Stop Dragan this Out: The Wenger Succession Thread

Discussion in 'Arsenal' started by elessar78, Feb 15, 2017.

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  1. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Teal talk a juve/arsenal side

    ...........higuain
    Sanchez....dybala.....ozil
    ........marchisio...khedira
    Alves...bonnucci...chiellini...alves
    ...........buffon

    Maybe?
     
  2. antifan

    antifan Member+

    Aug 14, 2004
    The Scottie
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Recently unsuccessful manager, massively successful business executive. Our title hopes have gone pear shaped, but for the club, he's goose that laid the golden egg.
     
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  3. Fifty

    Fifty Member

    Mar 11, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hope the next manager doesn't hold the fans in contempt like Wenger does.
     
  4. daedalus

    daedalus Member+

    Apr 24, 2004
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    i think there's still something to be said about not treating wenger - given his contributions to the club - like shit, particularly in how we are/will be perceived from the outside. (even if it's time to.) not to mention that he still has a lot of respect around the world. basically, we wouldn't even want to be lump with the kind of club who would dick over a pellegrini because, "OMGPEP!".
     
  5. daedalus

    daedalus Member+

    Apr 24, 2004
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    seriously? you're going to sit here in our most glorious forum and pretend that yaya sanogo never happened?!? :D

    i agree with you that the time when he found talent nobody else found is long past. and, while koscielny, sagna, and eduardo were not cheap buys that panned out, they weren't performing on the highest stage at the time of their transfers and they did work out well for us. it's more the fact that he did identify some good talents that were, maybe, not the most obvious (y'know, "that messi fellow is good").

    i just don't necessarily want him in charge of deciding "values" on them. or, hell, even coaching them if/when we acquire them.
     
  6. KozIsCul

    KozIsCul Member+

    Feb 6, 2005
    In the context of Arsenal and Arsene Wenger, I just can't see how that can be relevant. Wenger has clearly had enough time, clearly been given adequate resources by the club, clearly been able to implement his philosophy, etc etc yada yada. And as far as City goes, sacking Pellegrini may or may not have been the right decision but the only "cheap" aspect of it was not sacking Pellegrini while negotiating and ultimately hiring Guardiola as the next manager.

    People seem to want to manage the perception of Wenger's career, I think we just have to say that's not ultimately in our control.
     
  7. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    Wenger wants 4 more years apparently via AFC's official twitter lol
     
  8. KozIsCul

    KozIsCul Member+

    Feb 6, 2005
    Hmmm. I could start supporting Sheffield Wednesday and by the time the four years are up they'll probably be better than Arsenal.
     
  9. ArsenalJake

    ArsenalJake Member+

    Feb 11, 2013
    Charlotte
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wenger wants to stay and manage at Arsenal. The board has an offer on the table for him to sign. The players (for whatever reasons) seem to love playing for him (at least it's been true in the past, this may be changing for some).

    The only thing keeping Wenger from signing are the booing, shouting fans that demand results on the pitch. The only way Wenger will walk, is if Arsenal continues to shit the bed this season.

    The same ol Arsenal top 4 finish will likely result is satisfaction among many fans and lead to Wenger signing on for another 2 years. Wenger has shown time and again that he has the mental strength to deal with the fans during the status quo. He doesn't feel like a fraud in 4th place. 4th will buy us 2 more years.
     
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  10. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    He has a mandate from the team Top 4 and if you can a title but Top 4 is the main thing. So why fire him they can control dissenting fans and frankly there are a huge number of brain dead Wenger In he made the club look at how little money we have types so this is quite logical
     
  11. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I don't know about that. This feels like a watershed moment.
     
  12. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    Some room left on our bandwagon You can claim to have been there in Munich! (Different year, whatever!)
     
  13. elessar78

    elessar78 Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 12, 2010
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
  14. elessar78

    elessar78 Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 12, 2010
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    found and signed are, in all fairness, two different things. I get what you're saying—less so now, but we're still trying to do things on a budget. The problem is that there are many good players and many good managers who have big budgets. I don't think I'm delusional that if we had a run of good health in a few of the season over the last decade that we could have won the league.
     
  15. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I don't think that's the case: scouting has gotten so much better over the past decade that the advantage we had there is gone, and the market for young players is absurd. Strikers aside, it's probably cheaper to buy someone at 26-27 who's played well for a few years than it is to buy a hot 21 year old prospect.

    And even then, while Wenger's a great judge of talent, it's not as if many of the players Wenger signed were nobodies. Vieira was signed from Milan. Henry was signed from Juve. Pires came from Marseilles, but they were runners up in Ligue 1 and lost in the UEFA Cup final. Not exactly finding someone slumming it in the German third division were these players.

    Wenger's big advantage was he got these signings right (and by and large, he still does).
     
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  16. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    You haven't really been on a budget though, unless you mean compared to Citeh or United. You've been buying players like Sanchez and Ozil and this summer you guys spent a lot of money on a fourth CB and a third striker and a highly touted CM. Thats not really operating on a budget.
     
  17. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    I think you overestimate the boards concern about "Fans" and I may underestimate their concern.
     
  18. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    The Wenger budget is a lie, the club has the 4th highest wage bill in the EPL this year, Chelsea's is 3rd. We perform up to spending thats really what it is.
     
  19. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    Italian media reporting Wenger to Inter Milan or AC Milan. HIlarious
     
  20. daedalus

    daedalus Member+

    Apr 24, 2004
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    at what point in any of my post did i make any mention of managing any perception of wenger's career? i said and will say again, i could give less than two flying charlie fucks about how people perceive wenger's career but i do give a ******** about how THE ARSENAL ORGANISATION is perceived. those are two entirely different things, koz. yes, i get that you have your opinion that wenger should be removed regardless and anything else is pointless. cool, i can see your point. but that doesn't mean you adjust my point to meet whatever argument you are trying to put forth regardless of whether they matched what i said or not.
     
  21. daedalus

    daedalus Member+

    Apr 24, 2004
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    considering they seem to be able to do as they pleased, it's fairly understandable. :D
     
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  22. KozIsCul

    KozIsCul Member+

    Feb 6, 2005
    Ok. Suppose Wenger were sacked after the Sutton game, or his contract offer for the following seasons withdrawn. My point is, if that happens, in no way unfair to Wenger or reflects poorly on Arsenal as an organization. In particular, it wouldn't be the same thing as what City did, which is negotiating with the new manager while the old manager still has a job.
     
  23. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Essentially this. IMO it feels like Wenger runs a consequence free environment, so the players we all hope to see develop have little impetus to change because they'll get their paycheck and the manager will be loyal and optimistic til the last.

    Maybe everyone, coaching staff and players, had more fire when Highbury forced the financial issues or when Wenger still had something to prove. Surely a part of it is down to the increased top-tier competition within the Prem. What gets me, though, is that regardless of those factors the players he has brought in of late have not developed. Middling talents pretty much stay as such rather than take that next step. So if neither the players nor the team as a whole are showing any progression then I'm wondering where the drive has gone?

    He's a solid financial man, a fair recruiter up to where it conflicts with the first point, and a loyal cheerleader. He's simply no longer so exclusively great as a tactician or developer of talent. That's not even a bad thing, just a fact.

    (He said to the choir.)
     
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  24. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    This is the key factor for me.
     
  25. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I think the rigidity of the game makes it harder for those types of players to folourish

    Athletic ball winning and overloading midfielders are dominating the game rather than artistic playmakers for the most part

    We have not had a balance of that and finesse since vieira left
     

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