Should UEFA leave FIFA?

Discussion in 'FIFA and Tournaments' started by Jtsmith1, May 29, 2015.

  1. Narc83

    Narc83 Member+

    Jul 21, 2007
    Phoenix
    You clearly are engaging in willful ignorance and the usual bs calling everything conspiracies when your right wing beliefs are challenged with basic truths.

    You misconstrue and defame instead of attempting any type of refutation.

    Fact: The US and Nato are lobbying to boycott or strip Russia of the World cup. Its pathetic to pretend otherwise because its obvious with the whole propaganda bashing of Russia and Putin. Amusing how you pretend that its only McCain writing letters demanding a coup. Its ridiculous how you refuse to see the parallels with the Olympic boycott back in the 80's.

    Fact: Alex Jones is a far right radio host and along side Fox News is a staple of the right wing crowd. Apparently you are confusing me with your friends and family.

    The whole Nato bashing of Russia is blatant to anyone that doesn't only listen to Fox News and Alex Jones.

    Blatter and Fifa are not responsible for what Chuck Blazer and the rest of his criminal buddies were doing. The whole arrest (New York times is propaganda ground zero and its why they mysteriously had a huge news crew ready to film the whole nonsense) thing was an obvious pretext to try and force him out and install a US stooge.

    Russia is clearly the target because the supposed investigation did not start in the 90's like you stated but began in 2011 with Chuck Blazer turning states evidence once he was charged with tax evasion. You are clearly full of shit pretending that the investigation started in the 90's. Chuck Blazer's crimes may have started back then but the investigation began in 2011 not the 90's. Its very telling how Chuck Blazer becomes invisible and all of a sudden his criminality is due to Fifa and blatter and not an American engaging in graft and tax evasion.

    Its obvious that the US lacks jurisdiction with Blatter and most of Fifa because they have only the most tenuous links to the US. Crimes have to occur in the US for the justice department to have any type of jurisdiction. Its obvious that you have trouble with this basic fact that Jurisdiction requires a physical or overwhelming contact with a state.

    The whole pretext of using the banking system is complete nonsense. Its clearly an instant of extraterritorial and will fail since there is clearly not enough contact with the US to provide the justice department with sufficient justification to claim jurisdiction.

    Uefa is not going nowhere since they won't have Fifa to bash for their criminality. Fifa is the convenient whipping boy that Uefa can pin all their troubles onto. Platini admitted that he voted for the Qatar farce and yet, he alongside Uefa is supposed to be an improvement?
     
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  2. Unimane

    Unimane Member+

    Jul 28, 2009
    Nashville
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just to make this short and as conscise as possible, here are the things you are completely off base about:

    1. A letter from a couple of senators does not equal an effort by the US government to strip the 2018 World Cup from Russia.

    2. The NATO bashing of Russia is neither here nor there, as I have stated many times, in regards to the issue at hand. It's merely some unrelated device you use to try and discredit the case against FIFA, plus try and validate your Russophile paranoid beliefs regarding the 2018 World Cup.

    3. You keep failing to understand the jurisdiction factor here. Keep hoping your scenario will work out. Let me know how that works out for you or, at least, give me some more of your American conspiracy theories as to how it didn't.

    4. You may be the first person to call me a right winger in my life. I certainly wasn't called one when I voted for Ralph Nader and worked for every left wing cause I could find short of giving mooney to that derelict Paul Watson on the Sea Shephard. I could wax hours on my issues with the American government. However, 100% fact and truth that Russia and China are worse places in regards to most any component, human rights, corruption, whatever.

    That said, the US isn't going after the 2018 WC bid of Russia, other than a few letters from senators that have little to no impact and your perceptory insticts aside. The only basis of the US government targeting the 2018 World Cup is your paranoia or directiveyou received from Putin himself.
     
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  3. Narc83

    Narc83 Member+

    Jul 21, 2007
    Phoenix
    Amusing here comes the misconstruing and denial of basic facts.

    Now its no longer a letter from just McCain but a "couple" of senators. Its funny how you are walking back the single senator to now just two (couple = 2). There exist multiple letters from multiple senators and lawmakers trying to pressure Fifa to strip Russia of the 2018 world cup.

    13 Democratic and Republican U.S. lawmakers said they "strongly encourage" the Federation Internationale de Football Association (FIFA) to move the global competition
    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/01/us-soccer-fifa-congress-idUSKBN0MS52G20150401

    Senators Want 2018 World Cup Taken Away From Putin
    http://blogs.rollcall.com/wgdb/senators-want-2018-world-cup-taken-away-from-putin/

    US senators are calling for Sepp Blatter to be ousted as the head of Fifaover his support for Russia's world cup despite Vladimir Putin's military intervention in Ukraine.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...epp-Blatter-to-be-ousted-as-head-of-Fifa.html

    Apparently a bunch of US senators don't represent the US government and its a conspiracy to think its more than just a couple of senators. Lol, nothing to see here people its clear that the US government is not engaging in a media and political campaign to strip Russia of the 2018 world cup:rolleyes:.


    Now you walking back the the obvious Bs that there isn't an anti-Russian bashing campaign but add in some more nonsense about me being a Putin Groupie (Russophile is much prettier but the whole accusing me of Paranoid beliefs betrays your actual thoughts).

    Its obvious that we lack jurisdiction because Fifa is an international organization with only a tenuous link to the US. Calling it a conspiracy theory or imply that its Anti-American is laughable.

    The McCarthyism and refusal to take responsibility for your misconstruing and flatout lies reeks of you being a rightwinger.

    You clearly accused me of being an Alex Jones disciple and imply that i'm a member of a conspiracy cabal against "AMERICA." This is blatant McCarthyism and is silly to pretend otherwise.

    You clearly refuse to acknowledge how you clearly lied about the Fifa investigation dating back to the 90's when its clear that it only started in 2011. The crimes may date back to the beginning of Chuck Blazers employments but the investigation did not start 20 years ago like you stated. Very right winger to make up your own "facts" and refuse to talk about them once they've been shown to be outright falsehoods.


    You actually expect me to believe that you are not a right winger when you clearly are engaging in moral relativism and blatant denial about the illegal behavior of the US government overseas.

    More McCarthyism and slander that I'm not just a Putin groupie but a paid traitor. You can deny the obvious but its silly to pretend that you are not engaging in slander and outright personal attacks instead of attempting to refute anything i write.

    Lol, "perceptory insticts" has to be some silly right wing nonsense because google comes up with very little except religious orders like the knights templars, Freemasonry, etc.

    https://www.google.com/search?q=per...hrome&es_sm=0&ie=UTF-8#q=preceptory+instincts

    Uefa is not leaving Fifa because its a cash cow and this whole whining about corruptions is just a pretext to force out Blatter and install a puppet more amendable to the "Western Alliance" members.
     
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  4. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Then authorities made a terrible mistake by giving out fines to these "innocent" parties on other issues not related to Football, for exactly the same thing :

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/12/11/us-hsbc-probe-idUSBRE8BA05M20121211
    (note that this particular entity, also was mentioned in this FIFA scandal, and in this case it was US authorities whom gave the fine. And pretty recently too)

    http://nypost.com/2015/03/12/us-slaps-germanys-commerzbank-with-1-45b-money-laundering-fine/

    http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/4dea5a3e-fe22-11e4-9f10-00144feabdc0.html#axzz3bsEgdhTZ

    I'd suggest you, to do the same yourself, that you are suggesting me to do.
    ;)
     
  5. Unimane

    Unimane Member+

    Jul 28, 2009
    Nashville
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    1. Fine, I will concede that it is more than two senators. Regardless, all they have done is write letters to FIFA asking them to stop the World Cup in Russia. What exactly is the action taken by the U.S. government to do so? None, except the voices in your head.

    2. You clearly don't understand the meaning of the term McCarthyism. I'm not surprised, since you speak in sweeping ridiculous exaggerations. My reference to Alex Jones was the fact that you are engaged in absurd conspiracy theories. Additionally, "moral relativism" arguments are nonsense. The U.S. is, unequivocally, better than those countries in those particular areas we are focusing upon even if I have major problems with American society itself. I say this as an actual liberal, one who actually gives a damn about rights of people and not as you do, by choosing a team and then doggedly supporting their propaganda, no matter what. I can have severe criticisms of police in Baltimore, while realizing that the justice system is hell of lot better there than in Beijing.

    Regardless, once more, that's neither here nor there in this argument. Either FIFA officials did or did not engage in corruption and the U.S. should either charge them with a crime or not, plus they do or don't have the jurisdiction to do so. All your gibberish aside about the evils of American government aside, I'm not seeing much in favor the of FIFA on this one.

    3. "Preceptory instincts" doesn't require a Google search, just a dictionary. It's the English language, put it together yourself. I think the problem here is that you deal in terms of conspiracies, cabals, groupthink messages, whatever and I'm just analyzing this matter as is. You probably see everything in terms of some heavy handed American agenda to manipulate and control everything, so the U.S. trying to steal the 2018 World Cup from the Russians seems completely obvious in that mind set. In reality, it's just ridiculous. If you can't see that the idea that this is, ultimately, something other than a grand conspiracy to deny the Russians 2018, then you'll probably believe any sort of baloney as long as it's wrapped in a burning American flag.
     
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  6. Sandinista

    Sandinista Member+

    Apr 11, 2010
    Buenos Aires
    Club:
    Racing Club de Avellaneda
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Look, I'm not saying you're wrong about the possibility of hosting a more watched (and therefore more sponsored) footballing event. YES, the chance to have a more attractive event than the current WC footballing-wise is real, just have the best teams and forget about the "world" aspect of it.

    I just think you're letting your imagination fly, some of the countries you mentioned voted for Blatter (not to mention many also voted for Russia and Qatar WCs), also, the idea of common interest between confederations (I know you just mentioned their interest of hosting a well-run WC, but it goes further than that) is naive against the opposite interests that arise (football is not only the WC, there are 4 years in between), there isn't even common interests within a same confederation, there is just countries and blocks with power that clashes with the other. You do talk about "dispersion of power" rather than a dominating UEFA, but how is that different than we have now? Perhaps right now is too dispersed and we have to find a better balance?

    Sure, I believe that idea you (and many more) envision would in fact cripple FIFA economically and bring down Blatter. I just want to ask what's next after Blatter. What is this whole leaving FIFA exactly for? Is it so the fans can have a better, more competitive WC? Surely not, let's not fool ourselves here. Is it for some altruist reason, perhaps regarding the creation of a more righteous and not corrupted football federation? Cause hey, that's a good enough reason for me, but it would take a lot of cynicism to believe it from most of the countries (and confeds) you mentioned.
     
  7. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    I don't think this will require UEFA as a unified bloc to jump ship but rather a handful of big FAs and a sizable group of medium FAs to push things in that direction. There are probably a half dozen countries in UEFA that are unequivocally pro-Blatter (and others who simply voted for him on pragmatic grounds). A dozen are definitely anti-FIFA, and the remainder aren't strong either way.

    Those who are anti hold a lot of sway because they are the ones with cash. A great Macedonian player will go play in a big league for money even if it means no FIFA tourney appearances for his NT. FIFA NTs will take a huge hit That's the reality. So countries on the fence will be forced to follow suit and things will trickle down the line.

    The same applies to South and Central Americans hoping to get coin in the US, Mexico or Europe.

    The point being, it won't take a huge bloc to sway things. Just a powerful few.
     
  8. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    For me, the purpose of breaking away from FIFA would be to create a new organization in which the amount of political power held by a country is proportional to its footballing importance. Ideally, this would also lead to less corruption and better decision-making, but those wouldn't be the primary purposes for me.

    A one-nation, one-vote system such as that currently used by FIFA is patently ridiculous, because not all nations are equally important when it comes to playing football. Brazil is more important than Bermuda. Germany is more important than Gabon. France is more important than Fiji. Yet they all have the same amount of power within FIFA. How is it that such notable footballing powers such as Papua New Guinea, Bahrain, the Cayman Islands, Burundi, and Cyprus have spots on the ExCo, but Italy, Mexico, and Argentina don't? And you wonder why the World Cup ends up in places like Russia and Qatar....
     
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  9. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Nope.
    Those work with huge amounts of cash, which is something diferent to say as they have it.
    Actually, they don't have so much cash, as they need lots of sponsors and benefactors whom provide it, for them. And guess what, most of it comes preciselly from the places that they are menacing to get away from.
    Unfortunately, to continue existing the way they actually exist, they depend on them for over 2/3 of all the money they work with. Oh and these FA's who work with huge amount of cash, strictly are from very few countries within Europe.

    Fact is, that Europe moves a lot of money, and if it depended only in what Europe can provide it with, they wouldn't be as big as they are at present times. Europe by itself has almost already reached the ceiling on what they can achieve and there is no place else to go from there, if it only depended on themselves. So that's when globalization enters into the game. With their power (and they currently do have it), they need to go beyond their frontiers and try to insert themselves in other markets where football hasn't developed the same as in their own continent, in order to keep on getting those assets from elsewhere.
    Problem is, that once you switch your back to someone else, it is very difficult to convince them, that in the future you will not do it again. Unfortunately for Uefa, with their past actions, together with their current atitude, they already have done this many times, reasons why very few from elsewhere, believe them anything.

    Maybe they can convince corrupt people to accept, but now these will hide themselves for a while.....
     
  10. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    #85 Rickdog, Jun 2, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2015
    Almost all you said was perfectly well written, for which I almost gave you a rep for it.
    But unfortunately, your last sentence (which I quoted here), blew it all.

    That decission of where the WC was going to go, was not taken to Congress, where every small little nation with no footballing tradition actually is (together with the big fish, as well), and where each of them have the same power as everybody else.

    That decission was taken by the Executive Comitee, where only 25 people took a vote (actually 22 of them, as 2 were banned and the third, which is the president of FIFA, wasn't required to take his vote) , where over a half of its members are preciselly from the most powerful and with the longest traditions of the sport within themselves.

    And guess what, most of those who now are menacing to leave, were precisely whom voted who gets to host, and not only that, but it was also most of them who gave their votes to the ones who got it (including Platini himself, as he recognized in doing so).

    If you really want to hold someone accountable for it, have them pay for not making a smarter decission.
    Don't put it on those who didn't vote or even never had nothing to say over it.
     
  11. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    o_O

    wrong thread, my friend.....
    (......or maybe, it's too much for my brain cells, cause I can't understand what it meant)
    :p
     
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  12. Sifrit

    Sifrit Member

    Mar 15, 2014
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    UEFA has no problem attracting sponsors from all over the world for their exclusively European tournament, the Champions League. Currently they have Nissan, Heineken, Mastercard, Gazprom, Sony, Unicredit and HTC Corporation. What makes you think they couldn't get the same sponsors FIFA gets for the WC?

    The sponsors give money because they want to promote their products to a global audience. They will choose the most attractive tournament. If UEFA launches its own version of the WC they will find sponsors from all over the world, because they will have a better tournament than what is left with FIFA.

    All the world's best players play for European clubs. If UEFA leaves FIFA these players would not be allowed to participate in FIFA events any more. That would be the end of the WC. No one would watch it and the sponsors would leave. The players would not just sign for clubs in other conferderations, btw. They can't earn that much money anywhere else in the world.
     
  13. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Still half asleep while watching sub 20 matches.
    :p
     
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  14. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    #89 Rickdog, Jun 2, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2015
    There will be sponsors indeed, but they will not pay the same amounts that they are currently paying as their viewership will decrease. And if they don't get the same amounts, the product they can offer will degrade its value in the middle term.
    Lots of the motivations that attract consumers are motivated by nationalism issues, and if their teams don't get the possibility to take part in the big show, they will not feel atracted to the product the same way as before, and therefore will not watch it.
    You think, that most viewers from a small team or with little tradition, watches the WC to see the best players of other teams ?, No, they watch the WC because their team is playing there.
    These viewers are the main focus for the big companies who usually sponsor these events, as they are not captive regular consumers, which in time can become one. Now if that small team, also happens to be from a very big country, lets say China (a team that in no way represents the type of teams from elsewhere atractive to Uefa), it's a new potential market of over 1000 million potential consumers.
    Now that would be like the chicken of the golden eggs, for sponsors. But as China isn't a traditional team, if Uefa leaves, they will never see their sponsors ever pay the amounts that they could potentially pay if China was there, too.

    Sure, but if that global audience doesn't want to see it, nothing will make them do so.

    here you are completely wrong.
    They are in it, to sell more, for every cent they invest into it.
    If that attractive tournament, becomes extremely expensive and they are going to get less money for every cent invested in it, it becomes less efficient to sponsor it. And when the audiences start getting lower, in a very short time those sponsors will leave.

    Maybe........, maybe not.
    If it does, they get to continue doing what they are currently doing (which is good)
    If it doesn't, they DIE. The end. Caput. Game over. (which for football, it probably would be the best thing to happen, but for the teams involved it's a point of no return. Clubs will be the most affected by it.)

    You think they are willing to take the risk ?.
    After all, FA's depend a lot on the wealth of their clubs.

    At poor neighborhoods back here there is a very wise saying : "Rich men fall harder, as they have lots to lose, while the poor, already are at the bottom"........ (think about that)

    That happens because they pay more. But if they pay the same as in their home countries, they'll stay home.

    If they do that, less players will want to go. Because they will be restricted to move. Freedom has a value, and not many people are willing to sell it. And many of those outstanding players that actually play for clubs in Europe, they love their countries first. Against that, no one can do much.

    Besides, there is no science required to understand that a player usually plays its best, when he is happy. If you restrict a player, he gets sad and many times doesn't even want to play no more. When that happens, the club has almost lost a player, and certainly if that player is the star player that everyone wants to see, sponsors will not be happy.... (you can imagine the rest). At that point, most clubs gets rid of him (tries to sell them in order to recover at least part of what they invested in him), because this type of feelings spreads inside a team, worst than ebola.
     
  15. Sifrit

    Sifrit Member

    Mar 15, 2014
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    If it's a new version of the WC, of course there would be nations from all over the world participating. Maybe the selection would be based a little more on performance than it is right now, but it wouldn't just be another Euro. That already exists.

    Only 32 nations qualify for the WC anyway. Most nations, including China, are not represented right now. People from those countries still watch it just like they watch the Champions League. I also watch WC matches not involving my country, and I watch the Copa America too when the big countries (Argentina and Brazil) play against good teams.

    The amount of sponsorship money generated would depend on the success of the new tournament, and you can't predict that. But even if it would be less than FIFA makes right now, it would still be more than UEFA gets at the moment, because FIFA would be gone.

    This is all hypothetical of course, but the most important difference would be that countries like Qatar wouldn't get to host a WC anymore. Countries with no footballing culture, climate conditions which make a summer tournament impossible (even though they told lies about cooled stadiums), terrible human rights records. Basically all they had to offer was oil money to bribe the voters.

    Why would the wealth of the clubs depend on FIFA and its WC? The clubs make their money from their own sponsors, their league's TV money, UEFA competition TV and prize money and some have rich sugar daddies. All they get from FIFA is a small compensation for lending their players for the WC. Especially the PL is so rich by now that the clubs likely don't even need CL money any more. They also attract sponsors from all over the world, and people watch it everywhere, despite the PL being even more regional that the CL.

    The clubs would probably be happy not to have their players go to any FIFA competitions any more, especially not to the Qatar winter WC which is in the middle of the club season.

    But they don't pay the same in their home countries. That's why everyone who is good enough goes to Europe. Which non -European league could pay wages like the PL or the big CL clubs?

    I seriously doubt that. In general humans love themselves and their families more than they love their country, and they will not give up millions in wages just to play in a WC every four years.
     
  16. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Those articles are interesting. What do they have to do with the current soccer corruption case?

    The banks in questions in those articles violated some pretty specific laws and regulations, such as violating sanctions on doing business with Iran, and failing to put in place adequate controls to prevent money laundering.

    In the current case, there's no evidence that the banks did anything other than accept deposits from existing, and seemingly perfectly legitimate, customers.

    I mean, I get it- you're the type of person who uses the term "bankster" (I thought that was limited to outraged college freshmen, and the type of people who hand out tracts about the international Zionist conspiracy). But, if you're going to claim that the DOJ is ignoring bank malfeasance in this case, you're going to have to provide some actual evidence.

    It's really odd that a seemingly intelligent person would get so outraged at the DOJ going after the pond scum that populates the halls of FIFA.
     
  17. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    It's a semantic argument. Select markets 1) are the big sources of fifa broadcast and sponsorship rev and 2) have the club buying power to lure players from FIFA loyalist countries regardless if some emirate sponsorship dollars here or there. People around the world will watch those leagues regardless. A brazilian won't stop watching the Italian league for example. If a few act in concert, everything falls into place like a game of risk.

    Assume two blocs: UK, Germany, Italy, Benelux, Scandinavia outside of Finland, a few randoms like Austria, Czech. Then everyone else. The former has sufficient revenue, higher rung NT talent and sufficient rank and file NT talent to be formidable on day zero.

    Turkey, Greece, and Russia lack the fund to maintain the Balkan player pool. The best of those players are in Germany and England. They'll flip. Ditto Poland. Spain, regardless of some key sponsorships, will see greater benefit of taking part in a breakaway champions league, they'll flip, as will neighbor Portugal (if they weren't already in the breakaway camp). This would occur in weeks, not years.

    The initial breakaway movement wouldn't come without tacit approval from USA, SK, Japan, and Australia, which would cripple FIFAs financial situation. That's the global element. The French federation would prefer to flip if not for government ties. All of this movement would be sufficient cover for them to move on sporting grounds. Same with the half of CONMEBOL that voted Ali, and the other half would follow.

    What I'm proposing wouldn't require UEFA to act as a monolithic group or to weather a sustained storm. That would be harmful to both sides, but would likely be too great of a cost to them to initiate the action. The situation would be fluid and it wouldn't come to that.

    More than likely, this would be a case of SK, Japan, USA, Australia and possibly others like Mexico waiting in the wings for the initial bloc to form and then throwing their weight behind that breakaway group.

    Cynically, people might say the arrangement would be as prone to corruption as FIFA, but that wouldn't be the case. That's what legal and compliance advisors are for. Set up a system from scratch with greater transparency. Put conditions around representation by large, powerful FAs/markets (maybe a group of 30 globally). That is easier to monitor already. Protect smaller FAs by constitutionally setting aside a set percentage of world championship allocation funds for global sport development. This could be administered by a central development office. Require event hosts to possess a baseline level of financial capacity, press freedom, and political freedom to safeguard against social conditions. Cap host expenditures related to world championship event prep, which would be audited to guard against white elephant nonsense. There are obviously details that would need to be worked out, but that's the basic idea.
     
  18. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Wasn't money laundering one of the charges on the arrested FIFA officials ?

    Given the amounts involved here, they can't leave anything on their own. They must complete lots of paperwork which has to be informed to the competent authorities. Nothing of which happened here, as the authorities only got aware of what was happening, once they caught the ball of blubber (alias "chukky", for the friends) who was evading the payment of taxes, and afterwards he started squeaking it, in order to save his poor gigantic butt.

    Banks don't have the authority to decide what client is legit, and what client isn't. They must inform it even if it is the same Jesus Christ or the Virgin Mary. With all the required paperwork that the law forces them to complete. Otherwise, they can even be charged over perjury. In this case, an specific intent to deceive the authorities that a crime was comitted. It's a Federal offense.

    Look at it at the urban dictionary. It's a very common word, when someone wants to refer to someone who works in a bank or finance institution, but actually is a thief.
    Comes from the mix of 2 words : bank + gangster

    Hey, are you US american or not?
    I learned that word in the streets back there.

    Why should I do their work ?.

    And for Free. o_O
    Get out of here.....

    I'm very happy that these scumbags get caught.
    But if they are going to do it, they must do it right and don't let any of those involved get away with it. Or else, it will happen again, as it appears as you are condoning part of their atitude.

    It's the same thing as if you were a surgeon operating a patient who has a malignus cancer, you cut part of the cancerous tissue, take it away and you leave the rest inside. In no time, after the patient recovers from surgery, he will get ill again, if, the cancer doesn't kill him first.
    .
    .
    .
    In this type of things, sometimes you wonder if it was not better that whom took the case, would've been the North Korean Justice. They catch the scumbags and blow them away with anti aircraft cannons. End of the story, lets continue that these issue will not bother anyone else in the future......:p
    (just in case, if you didn't noticed it, this last part is a joke)
     
  19. paulalanr

    paulalanr Member

    Nov 5, 2013
    New Orleans, LA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Regardless of how paranoid your post sounds, you're not aware of how US legal jurisdiction works in this case. There is easy jurisdiction for all of the counts because the malfeasance involved US banks. The prosecutors would be stupid if jurisdiction wasn't the first thing they checked and confirmed, because that's definitely the first thing that a defense attorney will check.

    I honestly wasn't upset about a Russia World Cup when it was first announced. Sure, I wanted to visit England again, but hey, Russia plays good football and it's always sounded like an interesting place to visit. Plus the summer weather is probably amazing.

    What really turned me against it was Putin's politics and despotic reign over the past few years. Invading a neighbor country on a bald land-grab; oppression of the free press; cracking down on dissent; indications of massive government corruption and unaccountable consolidation of wealth and power. That sounds like a very dangerous and unpleasant country in so many respects. I'm not going to Russia '18 becuase I hate Russia or have anything against the Russian people. I'm not going to Russia '18 because frankly I don't think I'd feel safe in that country.
     
  20. Mr Wonderful

    Mr Wonderful Member

    Jan 19, 2015
    The Shores of Puget Sound
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Well, I guess one man's 'bashing' is another man's 'calling out a country for systemic human rights abuses and invading a sovereign nation'.
     
    Marcho Gamgee and paulalanr repped this.
  21. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    Yup. Us banks require disclosure of ID, address, point of origin, etc for payments in excess of 10k. The banks fulfilled their duty here. A millionaire depositing a tidy sum of cash from a seemingly legit third party in and of itself won't braise red flags. The strength of the system is it's web of disclosure. You can use mosaic theory to connect the dots and bust multiple parties once one party gets caught on something.

    Blazer gets busted for tax fraud (an IRS rather than a banking issue), his accounts are reviewed, then common related payors/payee accounts are reviewed and the Feds have a pretty good idea of what is going on before they decide to step on Chuck's throat to extract the remaining pieces. He rolled them, and the other people caught in this will roll yet more parties in the coming weeks/months.
     
    Rickdog and paulalanr repped this.
  22. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    For that to happen, it's lots easier to start getting rid of the asshole called Platini, whom also happens to be the current head of Uefa. With him around, Uefa has no credibility.

    I didn't say that. I said that the FA's to which clubs belong to, depend on the wealth of their clubs.

    Sure, but have you wondered from where come those sponsors ?
    Look at their jerseys and what is written on them, as that usually is their main sponsor. The sponsor that allows everything from happening. Most come precisely from the countries you don't want to mix yourself with.
    Can't you be, just a little consequent on this.

    You don't want them to host a WC, due to how workers are treated by them , but you are happy with them when they bring in the cash that allows your club to work (buy better players, pay wages, compete in better level tournaments), and afterwards you go to the stadium and pay your ticket to get in, to make them more rich, as many of them are also the owners of the clubs that play in european leagues.
    It's complete nonsense, and the most biggest contradiction. Good luck with that one.

    You don't have a clue of about what you are talking. The reason most PL clubs are owned by foreign businessman (many from Asia, btw), is because many of them before their arrival, were broke. Very few clubs, specially among the most popular of them, were free of having financial problems. If Liverpool for instance, wouldn't have received the cash from the americans who bought it, they would have disappeared from existence. I'm not inventing stuff here. It's a reality. PL clubs, by themselves, aren't rich at all.

    Almost no one can.
    You don't need to even put a foot apart from Europe, as many clubs in the not so gifted countries that are also a part of Europe, can't compete against that, either. Reasons why their lesser leagues are getting year after year that passes by, lots weaker than they were before as for them it is very difficult to be among the high competition. And I'm not saying slightly weaker. Lots weaker than before, an issue that unfortunately for them, it is starting to reflect itself at NT competitions, when faced to teams from other latitudes.

    Believe it or not, thats your option.

    A nation is an ethnic community. A community is a group of families with common issues between them.
    Family and Nation, are very close concepts one to the other.
    One thing for certain though, not everyone round the world is a mercenary.
    Sometimes you prefer to not be so rich (sometimes even poor), but to remain close to the ones who are similar to you and think likewise. Of course everybody wants to have a better life, but if it is not going to be with those you love, it's not worth it. (whatever, that's how I think at least)
     
  23. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Shirt sponsors are a nice source of revenue, but they're certainly not what "allows everything to happen." Arsenal's 30 million pound yearly deal with Emirates is only about 10% of its revenue.

    And they're easily replaceable, if need be.
     
  24. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
  25. Sandinista

    Sandinista Member+

    Apr 11, 2010
    Buenos Aires
    Club:
    Racing Club de Avellaneda
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Well, that just kills our hypothetical Super-WC of UEFA+CONMEBOL+USA, México and Japan... :(
     

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