Ok, MLS season starts in 4 months. The transfer season starts in a matter of weeks. Basically the question is, which yanks abroad need to think about making the move to another team. Throw in the fact that the WC is in a year and a half and you realize that the stakes are getting high, here goes... Yank Abroad: Bobby Convey: Recently got the word of approval from Reading, but his career has been stalled for some time now, since his last round of injuries. The question for Bobby is: does he want to make the next WC? If so, he needs games. Personally I think he needs to be headed back to MLS. DC awaits. Lee Ngyuen: Has been in Europe for quite some time and has little to show for it. Is a back up at Randers who sees regular time, but is not setting the world on fire. He is understudy to an effective starter in Borg, so playing time won't come easy. I think he should give MLS a try, is still young, but lack of playing time could lead to Jovan Kirovski Disease, also known as national team oblivion. Eddie Johnson: Has not done well in Europe and finally was put out of his misery on the national team level. I doubt Cardiff will want him next season, unless he starts lighting things up. I think he will be headed home this summer. He is a proven quantity in MLS and many teams would be interested. Kamani Hill: Has not played in awhile and needs to. Last I heard was that he has a trial in Norway with Bodo-Glimt. If it doesn't work out, he needs to be headed back to the states asap. Benny Feilhaber: From such great heights. The free fall of Benny's career has been astounding. It seemed like things were looking up and then his knee went out. Right now he just needs games and consistency. Is still young and has talent, but if he can't get things in gear with Aarhus soon, he needs to give MLS a long hard look. Heath Pearce: The starting left back for the US does not start for an average Bundeliga 2 team. Absolutely needs to make a move in January, either to Holland or back to Denmark. MLS is probably not an option since they probably won't pay that much for a left back. Sal Zizzo: Has been seeing the Hannover bench recently and even a few games. Still young and has only been in Hannover for just over a year now. I think Sal should stay and see if he can make it work at Hannover. Greg Berhalter: This is a no brainer. Greg probably has one or two more seasons left in him. Its time to come home and enjoy the burgers and fries. Red Bulls need some help in the back. Preston Zimmerman: Making a name for yourself in the Austrian League is no longer a solid career option. Time to head to MLS. Oguchi Onyewu: Standard has been good to Gooch. Now he is seeing success in UEFA. Contract is up in the summer. Finish out the season well and make the move to the right team, but in any case its time to move on. Jay Demerit: If Watford is relegated, Demerit needs to make a move either back to the Premiership or Colaship. If not MLS needs to be considered. Freddy Adu: So far a disastrous season for him at Monaco. But at least he is the top 14 as he does see some regular minutes. If things don't turn up later in the season, then its time for a major re-evaluation, and defenitely a move to another European team. Gabriel Ferrari: Ghost player should think about trying MLS before he dissapears from existence faster than that picture of Marty McFLy in Back to the Future. Ok, just a few ideas. Any other players who need to think about a switch? Any player you disagree with me about?
The only one I absolutely disagree about is Zimmerman. If he was 24-27 yrs. old I would agree with you. But he just turned 20 last month. He's getting good experience in a good environment. No, the Austrian Bundesliga isn't all that but the league is heavily scouted by the German Bundesliga and if he impresses and continues to shine a return to Germany could be in the cards. Let's see how this pan out this season before anything. Benny when healthy will get chances at AGF. They are high on him and look to have him fit to use him. The main thing for him is to get on the field when play resumes in the Spring. After he does we can further evaluate his situation. However, I think he's in a good place. As to Convey, I think he should, to some degree return home but I don't agree with your timing. I think it will happen when Philadelphia, his hometown, begins play in 2010 or even 2011. Until then I think he will leave Reading in the winter and head to another club for 2.5 years probably to Denmark as rumored.
Bobby Convey: agree, he should head back to the states, but i feel his time with the nats has come and gone.... he may as well stay in europe for that glorious payday as long as he can... Lee Ngyuen: he's young and gaining experience... i dont think he should come back to the MLS... saying that i think he'd do fine here in the states, but he may as well stay in europe..... it takes time to crack the squad... especially at that age Eddie Johnson: i think as long as a team is willing to pay him, he should stay.... he wont improve any by coming back to the states, while he may improve some team's forward status, but i dont see it neccessary at the moment Kamani Hill: again, young and gaining experience.... if he can make a team up in a scandanvian league then by all means he should stay.... his problem is he's a utility player and not a specialist of one position.... great for national sides, but hurts his odds with the clubs... Benny Feilhaber: yes, yes, yes.... if he wishes to get back into the graces of BB he needs PT... i dont know his current status in denmark, but coming back to the states and reestablishing himself both nationally and intl'ly would do wonders for his game..... Heath Pearce: needs to find a new team or he'll find himself replaced...possibly by an 18 yr old italian-american??? Sal Zizzo: "I think Sal should stay and see if he can make it work at Hannover." yes, i agree.... there is no better option... Greg Berhalter: isnt he already rumored to be coming to the redbulls??? Preston Zimmerman: stay in europe.... plain n' simple.... continue to make a name for yourself and he'll see rewards for it... see Davies.... Oguchi Onyewu: oh he's leaving alright....Standard did wonders for him, but his stock is growing too much to not see a move.... Jay Demerit: no opinion....if a move is necessary id like to see him get some PT...MLS?? i think he's capable of playing in europe successfully for now.... Freddy Adu: pick a team and establish yourself.... if Monaco is willing to buy his contract, i hope he opts to stay put for a couple years... even if it requires him to ride pine and get sub minutes for a season or 2..... Gabriel Ferrari: he has 2 options.... either Sampdoria grabs him off his loan or he'll stay with his Serie C team another season on loan... especially if they get promoted expect to see him stay.... MLS is not an option yet...
There's no compelling reason for anyone to stay or come to MLS, unless given a going wage guaranteed contract for a substantial time frame. Otherwise, the money isn't as good, the style of play is nowhere of the Eurto leagues and the contracts are rarely guaranteed to their full term. Sure, if Philly pops $1M/Y for Bobby on a 4-year deal - it'd be above the going wage, btw - he may consider taking it. But it makes no sense for anyone else to do it. PS. In case, it had slipped people's minds, the US is nearing an economic catastrophy. Of all the sporting reasons not to play in MLS, there's a financial reason too.
Playing time is a huge issue, especially if you want to be considered for the national team. Why wouldn't Bobby come home and play for $300,000 to try to rebuild his career. Same with Benny. If a player is tapped out and only has average options in Europe, depite the slightly better salary, MLS is a very good option. Corey Gibbs is a good example of this. He signs with Saint Pauli in the Bundesliga out of college and spends three seasons there bouncing around divisions, before moving back to Dallas, playing for probably less money, but then he gets noticed by Feyenoord. Bobby, Lee, Zimmerman, Benny could all come back to MLS for alittle less money and get major playing time and certainly do well for a few seasons, and then make the move back overseas to a better situation than they are in now. Robbie Rogers is doing the same thing. Over and over again MLS has proven that it is a great place to gain experience and get exposure for the jump to Europe, and now more and more European teams are realizing that MLS is a great place to pick up players.
The only problem with Zimmerman is that he has already been in the Bundesliga, so he is really going to have to light up the Austian league to get a move back there. The Austrian league ain't bad, but it is defenitely not as good as it used to be. It used to be on par with Belgium and Denmark, but now I would place some Eastern Europe leagues ahead of it, like Romania. What happened to Austrian soccer, anyway? Agreed on Bobby, I think he will head to Scandanavian league to try to rebuild his career, but I think MLS would still be a very good option for him. People also underestimate the lure of coming home and being close to friends and family.
Guess what? Europe is in the midst of the same catastrophe. It hasn't really affected pro sports that much, but Honda in F1 and West Ham are the early casualities. MLS is poised to take advantage of the crisis because its operating costs are quite low. MLS may actually benefit from a major European and South American player sell off. I am not worried about MLS in the crisis, they will be fine and may even see some growth. Why? Cost to take the entire family to an FC Dallas game: less that $100 Cost to park your car at the new Cowboys stadium: $100 If people are really hurting but are still looking for a night out, what do you think they are going to chose? In any case, we will see how it all plays out. If things do get bad, I see many Americans coming back to the states, because middling European teams (just like Kapenburg and Randers) will be hurting the most and looking to shed players. I think we are still about a year off from knowing the actual depth of the problem or perceived problem.
The only players on that list I could see coming to MLS are Berhalter and Hill. Berhalter will do the "Earnie Stewart-Claudio Reyna-Brian McBride" retirement year (or two) to finish off his career. Hill can't seem to latch onto any teams over there. Consider that Kamani Hill is 22 years old, and has played a grand total of 10 games as a professional (9 with Wolfsburg and 1 with Wolfsburg II). And yet he's been capped multiple times by the full USMNT. I haven't really seen enough of him to know whethe he's just not that good, or if he's just looking for the right team. We'll see. A team in Europe will be willing to pay Bobby Convey a lot more than MLS will. A team in the championship will pick him up if he can demonstrate that he's healthy. I don't think people in America understand how great of a season Convey had in 2005 with Reading. He was named the tenth best player in the Championship by 442 magazine that year. I saw him on multiple occasions live that season, and he was great. A team will take a chance on him..........(again with the caveat that he's healthy). There are a couple of guys who I think could be making a move sometime soon. Zak Whitbread: Supposedly playing really well for Millwall in League 1 (although was an unused sub in yesterday's win over Bristol Rovers). Millwall are in second place right now in League 1, and if they remain at the top of the league he should stay. If not, he should look for a move to the Championship. We'd seen rumors that prem teams were interested, but who knows. Quintin Westberg: Please, for the love of god, move to another team. He was supposed to be a future USMNT keeper, but his career has absolutely stalled on the bench in France. I've only seen the kid play once in that Toulon tournament, so really don't know how good he is. What I do know is that he needs to find a club where he can get playing time. Charlie Davies: Anybody else think a "bigger club" could come pluck Davies from Hammarby? Hammarby were in 9th place in 08, nowhere near where they should be in the league. Maybe they'll take the payday for Davies from a Dutch or German team........ Tally Hall: Another promising young keeper sitting around on the bench. His bench is in beautiful Esbjerg in Denmark. He's 23. I've never seen him play, but surely he needs to look for starting opportunities. Goalkeeping is a tricky duck, though. Coming to MLS won't mean a chance to start. See Seitz, Chris. Dominic Cervi: This goalkeeper needs to get his situation sorted. DeMarcus Beasley: I get the feeling he's not going to be at Rangers much longer (as press rumors are also speculating). They're trimming the roster after getting dumped out of Europe in the qualifying stages. Where will he go? Who knows........ Anyway, this off-season we're going to see a lot more players move TO EUROPE from MLS, and not the other way around. The "middle class" in MLS is simply able to get higher salaries abroad at this point.
Can you elaborate? I had assumed Iceland's troubles were going to cause a cash issue at West Ham. Is this not the case?
Not trying to bash West Ham, but there is some uncertainty there. And I do know what I am talking about. I live in Southern Spain where unemployment has shot up to around 20% in the last year, and a lot of people are really worried. Second hand shops are super busy right now. Personally I don't think things are going to be that bad, I was just responding to the poster who said the US was on the brink of a catastrophe. I tend not to agree, but just pointed out that if there is one in the states the rest of the world will be dealing with the same issues.
Everything pointed out here is the reason that MLS needs a higher salary cap. I would much rather have our players home playing regularly than toiling away on lower level Euro Leagues/Teams benches. Imagine the league MLS would be if all of these guys were here. Demerit Simek Nguyen Zimmerman Convey Hill Heath Pierce Berhalter Feilhaber Ferrari -what happened to this guy? Jemal Johnson (who by the way plays) Zizzo Beasley- I questioned the Rangers move. Now he's rumored on the move again. Anyone else noticing that he can't stay with a team? Johnson- I knew he was a fraud from jump street. Time to come home Eddie. The big leagues are no place for pretenders. and the list goes on and on. You guys named players that I'd completely forgotten about. And now potentially losing Kenny Cooper to the likes of Rosenberg! How many teams are in MLS? We've already added a quality player to every team with this list. The main issue is MLS' low salary cap. All of these guys come home and the quality of the league instantly goes up. While many think it's a good idea, I see nothing good from toiling away in Scandanavia, or riding pine in 2. Bundelisga. Nor do I remember any player to make a major jump from one of those leagues. While the DP rule is a good idea I as a Dallas fan would have much rather had Heath Pierce and Beasley than Davino and Denilson. It's Time for MLS to get serious about being a Professional Sports League; pony up some more cash and get a lot of these guys home on the pitch.
Playing time is an important variable for the players on their way up. Once you've reached your level, you are who you are and you may as well make the best money while you can. Because it's easier for him to make more money in a more prominent league where the skill is greater and the athleticism is lower. And, if he plays well for someone in Holland, he'll have no problems making the US team, if that is indeed his goal. Benny is already making way more money than MLS can throw at him. Corey was a fairly well-known commodity already and just needed to get healthy again. His move to Holland was aided by his play against RvN in the Amsterdam Dutch friendly. But that was then. If the US plays the Netherlands now, it'll be Gooch and Boca in the middle, with Califf, Spector and Demerit as the back-ups and Goodson and Marshall on the waiting list. Besides, why would you want to come to the US to be spotted by the Euro scouts if you're already in Europe? I understand if you yearn for home like Donovan or Jaqua. But, for the footballing reasons? See above. Robbie Rogers could have been a target of a big club already, had he performed well for Heerenveen and it's much easier to perform well in the league when you can dominate with speed and in the league that is built for the attack. Once again, how many players has Heerenveen moved to the bigger teams and how many MLS by comparison? The 2008 Dutch club sales were around $60M and that's despite keeping Pranjic. America is the epicenter of the disaster. The entire world is effected but the US will be receiving the major punch. Why are you insisting than MLS will be improving when the rest of the sport world is addressing the issue right now? http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slug=cp-nhl_board_of_governors&prov=cp&type=lgns OK. That's a beautiful logic, if you believe that black is white and blue is red. On the other hand, if you believe that a rising tide lifts all boats and a tsunami sinks them ...
Too bad we can't concede that the opinions of those who (1) always think MLS is a bad move and (2) those that want all Mericans playing here in Merica are understood and leave the discussion to those interested in discussing specific players and their best moves. My thoughts: Convey: Not sure why anybody in MLS would pay him $300k. With the dollar appreciating, I am not sure anyone in lower England or Scandanavia will either. I am not sure he has any future anywhere. Nguyen: Not sure MLS would pay him more than a bag of peanuts to try out. I would also be interested to see how Greg Berhalter does in MLS -- if his "speed' has diminished any in the last two years, I am not sure he will be all that big a success.
Don't get nasty brother. I wish I could agree with your post, and on some points I do, but unfortunately reality and the overwhelming body of evidence suggests otherwise. That is MLS is a very good option for American players to build their career. In some cases it may be the best option. But first Cory Gibbs. You are wrong on a lot of the facts here. Gibbs was not a known quantity. He had played consecutive seasons in the Bundesliga and 2 Bundesliga for a team that was relegated each season, and did not receive his first cap until June of 03 when he was still with St. Pauli but looking to make a move upward, since third division soccer has little to offer. Also, Gibbs was not injured. In fact he was trying to make a move to Jahn Regensburg in the 2 Bundesliga. The deal fell threw and he singed with Dallas. Had a good enough season and got some more caps and a move to Feyenoord. MLS ended up being the only and probably a really good option for Cory, propelling his into the national team picture and a lucrative move back to Europe. As far a Lee Ngyuen goes, and even guys like Kamani Hill, one need only look at the Olympic Team to see the benfit of MLS to a career. Almost the entire team were current or former MLS players with the exception of Orozco, Davies, Spector (who got gurt), and Feilhaber. Everyone else had been or was a starter and impact player in MLS. And the guys making lucrative moves overseas and getting ready to make moves are all MLS players: Edu, Klesjtan, Wynne, etc. Ngyuen and Hill are instructive here. They were in the Olympic picture but didn't make the cut, I would guess primarily because between them they had about 6 first team pro appearances, and both of their careers were on a downward trajectory. Had they been in MLS or at least a better club situation, maybe they would have made the squad contributed and like Edu, Wynne, and Klesjtan work your way into the national team picture. Oh and something else, the quickest way to a move to a big club for more money and higher quality of play is to be on the national team. Sitting on the bench for an average Danish team will not earn you many caps. Starting and performing well will. But Ngyuen is at best a sub. His career is headed in the wrong direction, it can only head in that direction for so long before it bottoms out. Zimmerman, Ngyuen, Feilhaber, and Wolf all started out in the big time: Hamburg, Wolfsburg and PSV. Now they are struggling in worse leagues. No body is going to sign or cap a guy who can't even get game in their current situations. Zimmerman to be fair deserves more time on Austria. But in any case, all of these guys's career is on the downward slope. And what happens when Randers gets hit by the crisis and decides they don't want to pay $400,000 for a back up. Where does Ngyuen go? Down, or to MLS. The overwhelming majority of yanks in Europe who are doing well (starters or major contributors) have done well played in MLS before hand. The others who are doing well grew up in the youth systems. Lets look at the facts. I am not going to count players who were established in Europe before MLS was a reality, like Keller, Reyna, Friedel (although he played in Columbus before he made the move to Liverpool), Berhalter. England: Dempsey: played in MLS McBride: played in MLS Howard: played in MLS Spector: Man U youth system Simek: Arsenal youth system Demerit: exception but an amazing one at that Whitbred: Liverpool youth system Hahnemann: MLS Convey: MLS Scotland: Beasley: played in MLS Holland: O'Brien: Ajax youth system Germany: Bradley: played in MLs Chreundolo: exception Pearce: exception Mathis: MLS Subotic: exception Spain: Altidore: MLS Italy: Szetela: MLS France Bocanegra:MLS Adu: MLS Vanney: MLS Belgium: Onyewu: exception Sweden Davies: Exception Norway: It seems half the league comes from MLS Denamark: Califf: MLS Parkhurst: MLS White: exception Lets look at Kenny Cooper. Signed by Man U out of high school. Struggled there, struggled in lesser divisions. Moves to MLS, become a star in Dallas, get on the national team and is looking at a lucrative more to Europe right now. He took a pay cut to come to MLS, but career wise it was the right move. Conor Casey has a similar story, although he had European success, he is rebuilding his career in MLS. Donovan is the same case, and he might be on the verge of becoming the first American to be a star on an elite team in Europe. The reality is that for guys with no pro experience it is really hard to make it in Europe. This has been proven over and over. It is hard in Europe no matter what. There is little consistency, constant coach and player turnover, and a very high level of competition. In Europe teams can't afford to keep Sigi Schmid around for three difficult years, hoping that he is building a team, relegation threatens and is a death blow to any team. Even the great teams like Real Madrid can't afford an average season. MLS has greater consistency and is for American players to develop and gain valuable pro experience. It has been good for too many American and CONCACAF players for guys like Ngyuen to blow it off because he can make $200,000 more sitting on a bench in Denmark. He could take the paycut, make a name for himself in MLS, work his way onto the national team and make a big contract move to Europe in 2-3 years. MLS has proven that it can prepare good players for Europe. I think that there is a question of whether it can prepare elite players, however. I firmly beleive that we will see all of these guys (Ngyuen, Zimmerman, Feilhaber, Wolf, and Convey) in MLS by 2010. It makes too much sense, unless we see their careers start to take off in the next 4 months. If Convey transfers in January I would imagine he will sign a short contract that will let him make a move back home if he needs. Remember he is only 25 and played in the last WC, I dobut he is ready to ride out his career (we are talking Grover Gibson and Joel Enochs land) in Europe just to make money, especially when so many of his friends and teammates are doing well. And sure European teams still sell alot more players, but MLS is only 12 years old and probably balks at more sells than we know. But the number of sells out of MLS is rapidly increasing. And you get spotted by Euro scouts in the US by playing and by playing for the national team. Sitting on the bench in Europe only gets you transferred to a lower level team. Wrong direction. Rogers was smart. He saw very little options left for him in Europe and made the move back to MLS, got playing time, made the Olympic team, become a dominate winger in the league, is on the national team fringe, and could be moving back to Europe in a year or two, wiser and better. None of that would have happened had he stayed at Herenveen or transferred to a lesser club in a lower division. I am sorry, but flat out, for young American players who want to better their career (especially when it is stalled in Europe) MLS is a great choice.
The addition of those players wouldn't add to attendance, television ratings, advertising dollars, etc. In fact, I'm unconvinced the addition of these players would add much to the quality of play either. Do we know if Ferrari is any good? No idea. Lee Nguyen? Well I know he's not starting for mid-table team in Denmark. Zizzo? How many games as a professional has he played? Hill has played 10 games as a professional in his life, and he's 23. Convey hasn't played meaningful minutes in more than 2 years. Feilhaber has more caps for the US national team right now than starts as a professional. Simek's not going anywhere. These are all players who are in the nebulous "middle class" of American players. The salary cap isn't being changed until the CBA expires, and the ownership/Garber seem reluctant to change it after that. Their response is, "If you don't like the salary you're going to get, move to Europe or don't sign your contract in the first place." And that's just the way it's going to be. I see two players on your list likely to come to MLS. Kamani Hill, because lower-table Norwegian teams like Bodo/Glimt didn't even sign him after a trial. And then Greg Berhalter will take a lot of money from a team like RBNY, who didn't learn their lesson with Reyna apparently.
Good post. Agreed. Although I would like to see Davies stay in Sweden for one more season. Moving can be very dangerous, just ask Heath Pearce and Michael Bradley. I would hate to see Davies make a move to a team that will get relegated or be really inconsistent. He has a bright future and I think he should take it slow and move to the right club.
perhaps, Lee realizes how far he is down the depth at any position for the US and would rather bank in europe and attempt to make first team in the process?? perhaps some players actually look at professional soccer as a job, and not a stepping stone to representing their country..... Lee is making some decent money in europe, he's spending time in a foreign country with easy access to other foreign countries.... many players would give their left arm for this.... as for Hill, he was a standout in the Olympic Quals.... he did well in the French tourny prior to the olympics... the only reason he wasnt used in the olympics is b/c coaches dont know how to use hill.... Hill is a utility player, which in a sense is good, but in his case has been his downfall.... each coach that gets Hill sees a different style and position in him.... he's played forward, right, left, and center mid, and even right back..... he has failed to be properly trained in any one position, but he's adequet to fill any of the above positions.... problem is, he's facing competition who play 1 spot and thats it... he had a trial in norway, and i would be shocked if he cant find a team in europe who'd take him cheaply (by euro standards).... however, much like Nguyen, i see Hill recognizing that his odds of taking a national team slot is slim.... might as well bank in europe and continue to develope, compared to making a fraction in the MLS and HOPING you get noticed abroad and START THE WHOLE PROCESS OVER AGAIN....
to be fair, we could list an equal number of players from MLS starting XI who would be replaced most likely for any one of these players....
MB?? you mean the move to a tougher league and yet he still gets PT and even starts?? and i highly doubt if M'bach get relegated that MB would also be relegated.... whether a clause in his contract or simply due to someone wanting to get him as a transfer...
Wow, this is a different world than the one I live in. In Olympic qualifiers, Hill was a backup with the "B" team and didn't embarass himself. "Standout", he!! no. The French tourney was an embarassment and while it is true that Hill was not among the most embarassing there, it's not something one would want to advertise on one's resume. Hill wasn't used in the Olympics for one very simple reason -- we had better players, usually more than one, at all the position he could play. Actually, was he even on the squad?
with hill playing right back, the men he marked had no goals, and very few opportunities, not to mention he was able to get up and aid a under performing attack... not bad for a forward, turned defender just for the quals.... in my opinion, he did extremely well given his situation.... a backup with the "B" team?? he started nearly all the quals and did well seeing he's not a defender.... the French tourney was embarrassing but taken with a grain of salt... they were all fringe players and had ZERO time to get to know each other.... take 20 talented kids who havent played together (perhaps some for a few), and thrust them into a U23 tourney where they are playing teams and players who have played quite a bit of time together and the outcome will most likely be the same.... in my opinion, only 4 players were worth mentioning.... Westberg, Shea, Nguyen, and Hill..... Nguyen and hill were not stellar by any means.... they simply didnt suck.... they had average tourney in a team's crap performance.... and as i pointed out, Hills downfall is his ability to play any position adequently.... his problem is he doesnt stand out at any one position... the reason he was left off the olympic squad was b/c there were better options in each position who actually stick to playing that position.... with the 18 man roster, there was no room for a utility player..... again, thats his biggest positive and yet his biggest downfall...