Actually it's starting to sound like Hartman is selling everything. However his NASL license expires this year, he's fired the coach and there's only a buckwheat GM, some seasonal staff and 1 player on contract for 2016. If the Spurs really are taking the Scorps too then a rebrand and a couple of layoffs, this is a brand new team in an existing stadium.
From Geoff Sheen @geoffsheen760 8h8 hours ago BREAKING: #spurs will have soccer announcement on the week of 11/16 (exact day TBD). Team name, colors still undecided for now. #MLSinSA
With many moving parts, details need to be hammered out before #spurs send check to USL to join league. #MLSinSA— Geoff Sheen (@mrgeoffsilvius) November 8, 2015
They need to buy the Scorpions in addition to the stadium. Fortunately, I see a lot of people saying they'll support soccer in SA regardless of who the team is.
I'd gladly wear my Scorpions jerseys to "Spurs USL" matches as they trot out their generic team in a stadium that is Scorpion branded already. My middle finger extends pretty well ... beyond the scope of the finger itself actually.
I actually go the other way, I will wear my Scorpions Jersey, until I get a "spurs" jersey. However, this year really left a sour taste for me with the Scorpions. To the point, where I was considering not getting my season tickets. And with the leadership of Mr. Cornfield it was not going to change. So why does the Scorpions have your blind support? Yes they were first, but the model on how they ran the team, was starting to show cracks.
If they don't go the route of the Scorpions, any branding is easily erased. Especially with a team that has the financial backing of the San Antonio Spurs. I had mild reservation with Orlando City at first, due to the fact that they were moved from Austin. But I was going to support soccer in Orlando no matter which form it took. (And the suspension of the second Aztex kinda vindicates Phil Rawlins leaving since it's the same reason: lack of proper venue.) In the end, the point is they want MLS. What good is it to wage war against soccer in your own city just because they're not the team you started rooting for? You can hope it's the Scorpions. I've already said I hope it's the Scorpions. Don't act out against it if it's not.
$21M + USL expansion fee and rebranding, seems a bit hefty. I know the MLS stuff is written in to a contract with the city but you just have to wonder why spend all of that to risk going to d3 rebuild/renovate the stadium and then jump to MLS for another $100M. This doesn't seem well thought out unless MLS will give them a sweetheart deal for knocking an NASL team out... Easily could have bought the team and kept them in NASL with the same aspirations no?
Most of that is the stadium. And the city and county are largely splitting that cost. The Spurs are only spending $3M on that.
That's just it, my support isn't blind ... as much of the support for "spurs soccer inc" will be. I've been around long enough to know the true colors and tactics of the Spurs organization as well as their opinion of themselves, especially in town. Quite frankly, it makes me sick. Are they a top notch professional organization? Absolutely ... but there's plenty of those that just happened to be the asshole on the block, just like they are. It's about their attitude in this ... given their rep and past actions they'll do just that ... ERASE what came before them in an attempt to pretend it never happened and that they are the saviors and all giving wonderful entity. (see san antonio rampage hockey replacing the Iguanas). They'll pretend that Hartman couldn't get it done and that the city/people should have done what they wanted in the first place ... ... rather than admit that they didn't have the balls and didn't put their money where their mouth was because people didn't bend over for them in order to bring soccer to SA. Someone else punched them in the gut and the people showed their support for ACTION ... not words that they'd been slinging. Easily ... well, it'll take some work to convert the stadium given the color scheme and inserted 'art' in the seats. Phil Rawlins is a lying sack of shit ... ... but on the topic of you choosing to support OC ... that isn't the same thing. You didn't have a bigger entity in OC talking the talk, have someone else walk the walk, and then have the bigger entity say 'oh well shit ok fine' and then proceed (as it will happen, color me shocked if it doesn't) to erase the work done by someone else. You simply had a club get relocated. Well, in order to wear my Scorpions jersey to the match .... I've got to get in yeah? That requires a ticket. Just saying. I'm not going to sabotage the effort (not that I could anyway) but I don't have to buy into the bullshit either. I can support the players that come, the Crocketteers, the Casuals, the new fans that flock to the MLS team (as in all fairness there is a sizable population that has been waiting for that since day one), and do it all without buying into "spurs soccerz" ... If me not buying their merch and being a sheep to their cause is waging war on them, then they aren't as big a deal as everyone else outside of SA seems to think. Yes, we all want MLS ... that doesn't mean that getting it is all cakes and pies just because we got it. In some ways SS&E being the ones to bring an MLS club here is the worst way it could have been done. You'd have to live here/be familiar with the sporting history of the city to understand that. Not when you own USL rights, not NASL rights.
Interesting that you feel Spurs have dishonored the soul of the Scorpions when in fact Hartman and his crony are the actual guilty party. Considering the state of the Scorps now I would think new management would be welcomed.
Hartman was upfront about everything from day 1. Anyone that thought anything different about what he was doing, was either an idiot or just lied to themselves. How has he done anything other than what he stated from the get go? Hell, the moment the water rose too high he actively sought investment and even hired a firm to find a buyer for the club. Do tell how that is dishonoring the soul of the club he literally created. Corhole can go die in a fire ... twice. It's who the management is, and THE ENTIRETY of what that means ... and of course, the fact that it'll be "Spurs USL generico" rather than the club we have now. It isn't like the Japanese party decided to buy in and the club is just switching who sits in the FO. Come on, you're better than that.
MLS Deal Comes Up Before City, County This Week Read more: http://www.woai.com/articles/woai-l...-comes-up-before-city-14109094/#ixzz3r6d40lIN
Has Hartman, or the surrogates he brought aboard to find buyers/investors for the Scorpions, sought contact with the Spurs?
SoccerPrime your 100% wrong on Mr. Hartman, I still remember the initial announcement that he had about getting the NASL team. even before the name of the Scorpions was elected on. Mr. Hartman from day one said his goal, was to fund Morgans Wonderland and what happened on the field would be bonus. I just dont think he really understood how much passion there would be for soccer down here. And of course with MLS expanding that put pressure on him from the fans about the push. And until this year, you really did not see the cracks in the Scorpions plans. But this year, once the announce of the sale of the team, things changed on the pitch and from the interaction with the fans. The problem with Mr. Hartman's plan is that the NASL he signed up for is different today. Which is great.. with new owners in Jacksonville, Indy and Tampa Bay.. to go with the Cosmos.. It has become big business, and that is where Mr. Hartman's plan really forced him to sell.. IMO As far as Mr. Cornfield he needed to go from day one, but he has survived. And from a tweet I saw.. he still thinks 2016 is happening.. LOL What I find funny is that those that said the Soccer for a Cause would not work.. were right and wrong. The Scorpions were a great franchise for a short period, but when the costs started to rise.. that's where it failed on the pitch. But in the end both Morgans Wonderland and soccer fans in San Antonio ended up winners. We got a championship from the Scorpions, the Spurs have a chance to continue that success that Mr. Hartman started. And San Antonio is once again on the map for a MLS expansion team, with an owner that can put us over the top, and with the move, we have the county and city on record that they are for MLSinSA!
Don't want to drag this in the mud, but I hope you can see my POV. Think about who hired Cornfield and continues to let him run the club (or what's left of it). Does that make sense? So was there an announcement today?
You are right that Mr. Hartman has held onto Mr. Cornfield for what ever reason. And that is a huge frustration with me. But the overall message from Mr. Hartman has been that its all about Morgans Wonderland. And unless something is hurting his bottom line, I dont think he would make a move. The only announcement today was the Bexar County Commissioners Court has approved the sale. The City's vote is on Thursday. Once that's done, I think we will hear more about the direction that everyone is going.
There were initial talks EARLY on in the process (not the sale process but the actual birthing of the team) but SS&E wanted to SS&E ... to which Hartman and co. said no thanks and we got what we got. Except your point isn't correct ... at least not with Hartman. Again, he was flat out upfront and honest from day 1 ... there were absolutely no misgivings and no pretending on his part. I've spoken with the man more than once on the matter directly ... he's been nothing but truthful and honest in this regard. So again, I pose the question to you ... HOW has he done what you claim he has?
If it was that early, then it was probably at the point where Hartman wanted it to be entirely non-profit. Before he realized that you can't be FC Barcelona without a certain level of pre-established clout.
From day 1 Mr. Hartman wanted this to bring additional capital into MW. And the discussion with SSE just was a mess. In fact it was pretty heated, to where I am in a way shocked that SSE was the one that got the team. I do wonder why someone else never stepped up. And if SSE prevented someone else moving into SA.
I'm not sure how many times it has to be said about Hartman. He had no visions of grandeur .... NONE The MOMENT the water rose to high for him he sought either help, or an outright buyer. What is hard to understand about that? Yes, he wanted to be able to take the club to the MLS level ... but never did he have a false pretense about what he was capable of, or what his venture was. Not once. The early discussions weren't heated because of what Hartman's vision was, but rather what SS&E wanted/demanded. ... and here is where much of the issue with "spurs" lays. With how their deals are structured and how they've ram/roughshod-ed the city/county into believing they walk on water ... and how they feel that the only way a certain level of something should be here is if THEY are the said something ... .... yeah, I'd find it not worth the trouble to make a go of it here too most likely.