Riquelme vs Kaka vs Ronaldinho

Discussion in 'Argentinos Abroad' started by Lspence, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. Lspence

    Lspence New Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    England
    Now you guys are really gonna hate me. These aren't my comments. I saw this on one of the other big soccer forums.

    I thought this would stimulate an interesting debate.

    Ronaldinho and Kaka are better than Riquelme. What are your thoughts?
     
  2. bsas

    bsas Member

    May 27, 2004
    Switzerland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    You are really looking for trouble, my friend... :D

    First of all, I would say they are not the same type of players. But if I had to compare, I would say Ronaldinho is flashier than Roman and has more tricks up his sleeve. Kaka is undoubtedly faster. But Roman has a better vision, control of the game and is a better playmaker.
     
  3. Volrath

    Volrath Member

    Jun 28, 2007
    I have never considered Ronaldinho to be that much of a playmaker, he's more of an excellent winger to me. Kaka's fairly inconsistent, just like Riquelme, Kaka plays fantastic in the Champions League but has been known to dissapear on occasions in the Italian league. But this isn't really a problem with Milan because they still have Seedorf and Pirlo who take over when the other one fades out.

    You can't really say who's the better player between the 3 imo.
     
  4. bsas

    bsas Member

    May 27, 2004
    Switzerland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Totally agree. Seedorf is an extremely underrated player, but imho he has been as instrumental as Kaka in their CL victory. Not to take anything away from Kaka who is real class.
     
  5. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Roman is great, but in my estimation, probably Ronaldinho is the best of the three based on his whole career. Based on current form, probably Kaka is best of the three.

    But, I could use any of the three to build a team. All three are probably top five in their generation.

    (I am considering young kids like Leonel Messi a new generation).

    Edit: This thread should be in a different forum. It's not about the national team.
     
  6. Dr. Know

    Dr. Know Member+

    Dec 5, 2005
    Macondo
    Vipnerd please close this pice of shit thread. And "Lspence" STFU already.

    Thank you.
     
  7. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Seconded. I responded without noticing that the thread was started by the same moron who was dissing Boca and the Argentine league. I guess you always have to be on the lookout for trolls.
     
  8. Teso Dos Bichos

    Teso Dos Bichos Red Card

    Sep 2, 2004
    Purged by RvN
    Regardless, Riquelme wins.
     
  9. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    I'll take that as a joke, especially if the thread is talking about Ronaldinho's whole career.
     
  10. Dr. Know

    Dr. Know Member+

    Dec 5, 2005
    Macondo
    And so it begins.... The troll got his wish. :rolleyes:

    Vip please close the thread.
     
  11. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    How much does Nike pay you to come on here and fluff Ronaldinho? The only thing I'll say about his numerous personal achievements, oh wait they're FIFA awards which mean they carry as much weight as a Grammy does to music. So you must be referring to the great lengths he carried PSG, oh wait they didn't do crap so you must be referencing all the success he achieved for Gremio, oh wait it wasn't that either. So hell it must be how he's carried El Seleciao oh wait he hasn't done that yet either.

    He is an incredible player with skill rivaled by very few but his achievements at Barca were due in large part to the cast he had around him and the facts are in the 2004/5 season in which he won his first Blatter Boy Crush award, Riquelme put forth the better season in every facet from scoring to assists to elevating the players around him. More impressive is that the Villarreal team that Riquelme elevated was at the very best on a good day an average side with zero history to look back upon. Now run along and continue your impressive impersenation of sheeple.
     
  12. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    You must have a brain-block because that Villareal run was JUST ONE SEASON. If you judge a person's whole career on one season then you have no credibility. And for your info, I was one of the first to criticize Ronaldinho in his recent poor form, while you have maintained your fanboy status with Riquelme.
     
  13. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Gee I didn't realize Riquelme only played one season at Villarreal:rolleyes: Two excellent seasons actually plus both tours at BOCA and more consistent performances for the NT. So by Rony have one more better season in Spain you're gonna hang off his jock. Don't talk silverware and shit because without the supporting cast at Barca, I wonder just how much they would've won?
     
  14. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    They finished 7th in La Liga, that's right, 7th in 05-06, thats nothing to salivate over. Ronaldinho's had more success, played the better football, and has done so over a longer period. And internationally, how many world cups has riquelme played in? that's what i thought. And Villareal is really missing him this year, sitting in 3rd place in la liga.
     
  15. Volrath

    Volrath Member

    Jun 28, 2007
    1) Villareal's squad with Riquelme' being the main star was far from being a worldclass side, the fact that they managed to qualify for Europe, even if it was only for the Uefa cup, several times was quite impressive. Even more impressive was that 3rd place in La Liga and the semi-final of the Champions League.

    2) Ronaldinho played the better football? Subjective, highly subjective for that matter...

    3) 2 World Cups as opposed to one, This would have been the same amount if Bielsa hadn't been such an idiot.

    4) Again, Villareal has almost a completely different squad now. A lot more high caliber players then Riquelme's semi-final CL team. That comparison isn't fair imo.
     
  16. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    I agree you can never compare them based on trophies because of Ronaldinho's teammates but I dont think its highly subjective comparing their talent. People give credit to Riquelme for his vision, and rightfully so, but dont associate this attribute to Ronaldinho, forgetting all the balls he gave Etoo, Giully, etc on top of his superior ball control.
     
  17. vipnerd

    vipnerd Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 26, 2003
    La Mitad + Román

    Wouldn't the fact that they finished 7th in La Liga telll you a bit more of the depth of squad of the team and further magnify the achievement of reaching CL semis that season?

    As to the # of WCs ... 98 was too early for Roman. 2002 was Bielsa's complete brain diarrhea ... that is how the NT performed. 2006, he was the playmaker of the best football showed in that WC ... and was in semis until he left the field.

    Yet, you can see this in 2 different ways: career and present. In both of them, probably Dinho and Kaka have the edge. At the same time, some would say that Dinho has achieved more than Maradona ... tied in WC titles, tied in local tournies won in Europe but one won a CL and the other only a UEFA Cup.

    The turning point for any analysis starts in the value each gives to the tournaments in Europe vs South America. Roman's achievements at club level in South America, and at youth NT level, are much bigger than Dinho's and Kaka's. In this context, it is like a return to the childhood question: who do you love more, dad or mom? Those with only one parent have an easier answer ... or so would it seem.



    .
     
  18. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    That is right they did finish 7th yet they also were semi-finalists in the Champions League. Throw some Intertoto inlcuding a win and two better than solid performances in the UEFA Cup. Not bad for a tiny team that just recently starting seeing any success and has never had a roster remotely close to what a Barca can field.

    As for World Cups, using this tournament as a basis for how great Ronaldinho is pretty much a joke as he was lambasted for being an invisible man. Of course he does have one more WC under his belt in 2002 but any knowledgable fan would know that the only reason Riquelme didn't go in 2002 was due to Bielsa being an idiot. We saw how far Bielsa got without Argentina's play maker didn't we? Further more, for having one more WC over Riquelme how is it that he has less assists? I'll will submit that he does have those three goals but he also got sent off so there you are for comparing WC's. Oh yeah Riquelme was acknowledged by many to be amongst the most outstanding players at this past WC, when was Ronaldinho ever considered that in either WC?

    For being considered one of the best ever, Ronaldinho never did squat in South America aside from NT matches. For being such a great player, I'd expect at least one Libertadores, SudaAmericana or a Recopa. For a player of his stature I would have expected him to pick up at least one side and carry them to some sort of title.

    I'd never dispute his incredible skill or greatness as a player because he truly is that but until he carries a team to another level I'm not buying into Nike's marketing campaign.
     
  19. Teso Dos Bichos

    Teso Dos Bichos Red Card

    Sep 2, 2004
    Purged by RvN
    Ronaldinho inspired PSG to 11th place in his second season. He then threw a tantrum and demanded to leave. The next season PSG finished 2nd.
     
  20. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    I never claimed he did anything with PSG
     
  21. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    As far as wc 2006, riquelme was more impressive than ronaldinho, but he too was not all that great, and the proof is his own countrymen critcized him heavily for underperforming, so much so it was affecting his mother's health.
     
  22. Teso Dos Bichos

    Teso Dos Bichos Red Card

    Sep 2, 2004
    Purged by RvN
    Just highlighting your clear inconsistency.
     
  23. phil80

    phil80 Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    This statement makes absolutely no sense, as PSG was not once mentioned. Try to keep up.
     
  24. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Boca Juniors
    Argentina
    Mar 6, 2005
    Here there and everywhere.
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    You obviously don't have any grasp on the Argentine psyche. No matter how good a player performs, their will always be the segment (large and small) that will find criticisms of players. What you need to do is google some articles from the WC and you'll find that the neutrals/unbiased almost all considered him one of the top performers over the likes of Rony, Ballack, Zidane........

    Furthermore a good barometer of the two would be by again using the NT as a gauge. When Ronaldinho does not wear the shirt, the Selecao doesn't miss a beat. When Riquelme didn't play for the Albicelestes it was painfully obvious. We tried to plug Messi into the role of Riquelme during the absence and he was far from ready. That should tell you something as Messi is the best player in the world right now based on form.
     

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