RIP -- Consequential Person Has Passed Away

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Val1, Aug 16, 2015.

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  1. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bs-ed-op-0211-frank-robinson-20190208-story.html


    I'm a bit surprised no one has mentioned the passing of Frank Robinson. In terms of influence, he's best known for being the first African American manager in MLB and for his work in civil rights, but he was also (at least) among the first African Americans to break into league and team executive offices.

    He never got the appreciation he deserved as a player. Bill James had him at 12th among MLBers post dead ball era. The guys directly in front of him: Schmidt, Bonds, Morgan, Gehrig, DiMaggio. A lot of big names behind him like Ripken, Henderson, Robinson, Brett, Clemente, Berra, Yaz and Bench. Triple Crown, 2x MVP, 2x WS, 4th on the all time home run list until the HR explosion of the late 90s-00s. He's also the only guy to win the "career triple crown" of MLB-wide MVP awards: world series, all-star and Sporting News MLB player of the year. Wasn't a great manager, but he did manage to win Manager of the Year once as well.
     
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  2. Timon19

    Timon19 Member+

    Jun 2, 2007
    Akron, OH
    Just saw it in today's Akron Beacon Journal. He managed the Indians also. A legend here.
     
  3. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    IMO he was underrated as a player for 2 major reasons.

    1. His career followed a very similar, but clearly inferior, career arc compared to Hank Aaron. And Hank was always underrated until that moment when it became clear that he, and not Willie Mays, was The One to hit #715.

    2. At the time of his career and in the 15 years afterward, baseball fans didn't understand how to adjust raw numbers to account for the conditions of a player's time. Frank spent much of his career playing in a very low average period; Carl Yastrzemski won a batting title with a robust .301 average. So guys like Frank and Hank and even Clemente were underrated at the time that their reputations were being cemented in the public consciousness because people didn't realize that if you hit over .300 in the 60s, you were really, really good.
     
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  4. Val1

    Val1 Member+

    Arsenal
    Mar 12, 2004
    MD's Eastern Shore
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    As a side note, he was a high school classmate of Bill Russell, a year younger I think. That was one stacked high school.
     
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  5. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    He also played basketball with Bill Russell.
     
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  6. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    Definitely. I think there's also an issue with the glut of quality outfielders from roughly DiMaggio's rookie class through Robinson's (20 years). Musial, Williams, Mays, Aaron and Mantle are superior and complete legends. Robinson was probably more productive overall than DiMaggio (but maybe not as great), but JD had the streak and all those Yankees titles. Robinson was appreciably better than Clemente. Clemente got a lot of credit for the glove, but I'll take far superior power to a far superior glove in RF. Dying young probably cemented his legacy though. Yaz was in there too. That's a lot of talent in a 20 year span.

    No one remotely approached Robinson until Henderson, Bonds and Griffey came into the league. Rose and Jackson both had interesting narratives before them though.

    IMO, if Robinson came into the league 10 years later his numbers would have been more suppressed due to the environment, but that might have put enough daylight between him and all of that talent for people to appreciate him more.
     
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  7. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    He was no Willie Mays!
     
  8. HerthaBerwyn

    HerthaBerwyn Member+

    May 24, 2003
    Chicago
    When I was 8 or so I handed a scorecard into the Giants bus. Willie McCovey signed it. Willie Mays shut the window and kept it. Willie Mays was an asshole.
     
  9. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I remembered hearing that story before... Sucks when athletes (especially legendary ones) are such assholes to kids. I get that they can get sick of every time they are in public, someone comes up to them and asks them to sign autographs, but at least be good about it. I met Yogi Berra when I was a kid,and while he didn't sign, he was at least nice about it.

    My dad got Dom DiMaggio's autograph as a kid. It was at the All-Star game, and all the players rushed out, and Dom was the only one to sign a scorecard before jumping into a cab with Ted Williams, his brother Joe and a couple of other guys. Many years later, I worked with Dom's son and told him the story. That was pretty much the kind of guy he was.
     
  10. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And I don't know if he counts as a "consequential Person," but in soccer circles he certainly was. Former US National team player and MLS coach, scout and DT Frenando Clavijo passed away.

    I posted this in the Revs forum, where he was the manager for 2+ seasons. :cry: He really was a great guy, and was someone who could talk soccer for hours with anyone interested.

    I first met him at one of the MLS Cup functions in 1999 when he was an assistant with the Metros. He was rumored to be one of the contenders for the Revs job to replace Walter Zenga, and was full of enthusiasm and while he wasn't exactly lobbying for the job with a lowly fanzine editor, he was clearly interested,and also wanted to make a good impression. It's like someone who is in a restaurant and treats the waitress as a servant because they are "beneath" them, this was the 100% opposite. A genuine good guy to everyone he encountered.

    Another time he invited us to come to his office in Foxboro, and the two things that stand out the most in that meeting were that he had whiteboards all over the room, one for each team, with a list of players, and a whole color-coded system (that we couldn't figure out, and he wouldn't give the details), probably based on the salary in the pre-DP/TAM/GAM era. And then he got a phone call from Brad Friedel, of all people, they chatted for a bit (the timing would have been early evening UK time, a little while after Brad's game ended). Then he apologized to us for taking the call--when I felt like I was intruding by just hearing Fernando's end of the conversation.

    Another thing about him, a story my wife found very endearing, was that he met his wife when they were 5 years old in kindergarten and had been in love ever since. I knew he had been ill recently, but he had posted that he was in remission not long ago. So sad it took a turn for the worse. He truly was a great guy.
     
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  11. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Rep. Walter Jones has passed away.

    The first line in his obituary is probably about Freedom Fries, which is unfair.
     
  12. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    A combo of Lieberman and Atwater? The Freedom Fries thing might have been his least damaging moment. Can't say RIP here, that's for sure.

    Per Wiki, which may or may not be true:
    In 1994, [Jones] switched parties and ran in North Carolina's 3rd congressional district, which had absorbed a large chunk of his father's former territory. His race against incumbent Democrat Martin Lancaster was initially very close until Jones released a picture of Lancaster jogging with President Bill Clinton,
     
  13. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Is it possible he wanted Willie's autograph? :D

    Arnold Palmer was playing the Senior PGA at Ridgewood CC in 1990. A lady on our block had tickets for a practice round and gave them to me & pops. Arnie was mobbed around one side of the practice putting green and had signed some things but was making his way off where security guards would lead him to the clubhouse. l ran around to the other side of the green and though he looked tired he signed the program and was as nice as could be.

    Trevino beat Nicklaus on Sunday and was whupping it up. Loved sticking it to him.
     
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  14. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How is that like Atwater? Is Bill Clinton black or something? I know Martin Lancaster sure as hell wasn't.
     
  15. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Why did Trevino love sticking it to Nicklaus? I don't recall anything specifically conservative (certainly not Zoeller conservative) about Jack.

    I sometimes wonder if Trevino might have won more if he'd just stopped going to the tournament that seemed not to want him there (Augusta). I can see going there, winning it, getting on a copter and dropping the jacket off as I leave, never to return. But if I can't win it, I ain't going to keep playing it.

    He used a southern state's hatred of Clinton the same way Atwater used White folks' fantasies about Black rape.

    FWIW, Bill Clinton is worse than Black to some conservatives, for being a White liberal of sorts. Seems I heard conservatives shot Goodman and Schwerner last, so they could see a murder before they died.
     
  16. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Was talking to several white Southerners recently. They preferred Barack to HRC. The Clinton Hate was strong. It has had many years to brew.
     
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  17. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    I meant in a good-natured way. Coming up Trevino was like the opppsite of Nicklaus. Short, scrappy, and was handed nothing.

    (Wiki)
    Trevino was born in Dallas, Texas, into a family of Mexican ancestry. He was raised by his mother, Juanita Trevino, and his grandfather, Joe Trevino, a gravedigger. Trevino never knew his father, Joseph Trevino, who left when his son was small. During his childhood, Trevino occasionally attended school and worked to earn money for the family. At age 5, he started working in the cotton fields.

    Trevino was introduced to golf when his uncle gave him a few golf balls and an old golf club. He then spent his free time sneaking into nearby country clubs to practice and began as a caddie at the Dallas Athletic Club, near his home. He soon began caddying full-time. Trevino left school at age 14 to go to work. He earned $30 a week as a caddie and shoe shiner.
     
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  18. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    In Dan Jenkins' "Dead Solid Perfect," protagonist/journeyman Kenny Puckett is walking up to the last green leading the Masters and overwhelmed by the sea of applause, and he spots Nicklaus in the crowd and calls out something along the lines of "Jesus Jack! What's it like to do this every week?

    It must have felt at least a bit annoying to the likes of Trevino and Player to feel like you had a right to be the best in the world for at least a couple years of your career-- only this guy is always in contention and beats you in about two thirds of the tournaments he contends in...

    Trevino was not at all a bad spirited trash talker-- he just started life as and spent some years as a hustler, and it was ingrained...
     
  19. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    That's life in individual sport, as I see it.

    I never liked guys like that, I'll admit. When you don't have to be gritty anymore, stop ********ing being gritty.
     
  20. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
  21. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    He & Jack were close & Nicklaus was on the 17th. Trevino was finished and was watching from the network booth. While Jack was in the fairway clouds came over and he hit an errant shot. Thats where I think Trevino whupped. IIRC Jack later blamed his contacts. In the video here you can see him missing the short par putt on 17 and Trevino saying "give me that trophy" :D

     
  22. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Gritty4Life, son!
     
  23. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Exactly. Representing what was once or maybe could have been what Cambridge is now, but instead became a nasty, blue-collar industrial town that has to have a jail in its pointyball stadium.

    You don't know this, of course, but there was a similar (tho smaller-scale, obviously) divide between North Alabama, with the influx of brain power thru NASA, a military base and several universities, and South Alabama, which had... Birmingham's steel and pollution and the Black Belt agricultural counties. There's still a difference, to this day, in the way people live and what they consider important.
     
  24. Bootsy Collins

    Bootsy Collins Player of the Year

    Oct 18, 2004
    Capitol Hill
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Surprised there hasn't been more discussion of Fernando Clavijo's death. He was without question one of the major figures in MLS history. 63 is too young.
     
  25. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Stop being so bougie. You know you want a jail at the Benz. :D
     

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