Revs @ Cbus 9/25

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by RevsLiverpool, Sep 21, 2016.

  1. Soccer Doc

    Soccer Doc Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Keene, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Burns doesn't get him the players it's harder to blame Heaps but frankly Unfortunately the available evidence suggests he's neither a tactically good coach or a good motivator---ego---FAIL
     
  2. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There are lots of examples of good coaches doing well with a mediocre set of ingredients, making the team above average with average talent. Unfortunately, we are the opposite. We have lots of talent, some above average players (and some holes too), but we are not playing up to the level of our talent.

    It is an entirely separate question about Burns "buying better groceries," but with the current setup, even if we did have a couple of new players at the top-third in the league at their positions, would Heaps be able to make the team that much better, to play at the level of their collective talent? I'm not so sure....
     
  3. teskicks

    teskicks Member+

    New England Revolution
    United States
    Jan 14, 2002
    Wrentham, MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I have been wondering that for some time. I've been suggesting that he be traded for a top notch center back for months. My feeling is that JoGo is gone after this season and there will be a bigger need for a center back.
     
  4. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm in this camp. Trade Lee for TAM then sign a higher end CB. Agree on JoGo as well. Time to revamp that back line.
     
  5. Revs in 2010

    Revs in 2010 Member+

    Feb 29, 2000
    Roanoke, VA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He's not an especially bad referee -- he just had an especially bad game (which just served to highlight our really bad game:(). Careful what you wish for, remember, no Penso would mean more Alan Kelly or Hilario Grajeda -- sobering thought.:D
     
  6. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To me this game sums up what's wrong with our FO. The "depth" was pathetic and the team played like it, in a critical game against a team lower in the standings. For this, Burns should be fired.

    Then there's the tactics which Heaps got all wrong. Columbus made it a shooting gallery and their wingers ate the outside backs alive. There was no link up play and very few real chances on goal, with Agudelo's toe poke to their keeper probably the best rev chance of the game. The revs needed to come out aggressively and put Cbus on their heels, but they sat back and tried to absorb pressure and counter. That was always going to fail given the speed of Columbus. Anyone who pays attention at all would know that's a major strength of theirs. For this (and many other failures) Heaps should be relieved of his duties.

    Then there's Bilello who hasn't made any changes as President in spite of yet another mediocre season. He needs to bring in an experienced coach and GM now to give them a few live games to evaluate the players and begin to make decisions for 2017. If he can't be decisive and realistic about the onfield situation of his business, he needs to be replaced as well.
     
  7. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    You exaggerate. We have *some* depth, but this was an unfortunate set of injuries that forced Heaps to go deeper into his bench than he has all season. Normally, Watson would come in at center-back. But, he was hurt. So, the next option would have been to move Farrell to center-back and pull in Rowe to fill in at right back. But, he was a late injury.

    Personally, I would have called on Herivaux - I have no idea why Heaps is so reluctant to use him. And we really don't know anything about what's going on with McCrary to know whether he could have played at all.

    So, yes, we do have some depth. Enough? Well, not this week. Generally for almost any MLS team at some point in their season, their depth will be really stretched at some position. This week it was centerback for the Revs. I'd love to see a better option on the bench than Barnes, but that is what it is.
    I thought Neumann did fine - he virtually never turned the ball over. I think, when seeing virtually no playing time all season, the first thought would be to play simple and avoid turnovers - and I think he did that quite well. If we want to see how he can really impact the game, he'll need a string of games to get up to the speed and confidence of everyone else.

    Considering his limited minutes this year, I thought he was fine. Barnes, OTOH, was just a juicy target for Ola all game.
     
  8. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "Some" depth like we had vs. Columbus is like going into a store wanting to buy something nice, and then your realize that all you have is "some" money....

    Spin it any way you want, this was a roster-building failure. No one could possibly predict that more than a couple of guys might get injured or suspended at the same time. Those open roster spots are just a waste anyway!
     
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  9. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's a failure not only because of the open roster spots but because of the lack of minutes and faith showed in the young guys like Neumann, Herivaux, McCrary, Smith and Samba (while here). Even Kobayashi could have started instead of Neumann in Columbus.

    Let's look at the young field player options:
    Neumann - 4th overall pick - big fail
    Herivaux - homegrown kid, looks good when he plays, mystery why he hasn't seen more minutes
    McCrary - if you had questions about the kid do your diligence BEFOREHAND or choose another guy
    Samba - captain of Sporting B, didn't get anywhere close to the minutes requires
    Smith - looked good when he filled in for Tierney, odd that he has stayed on the team but rarely plays

    If they had rotated in some of these young guys during the year (more than USOC minutes) they perhaps would not have looked like deer in the headlights in a big game on the road at the end of the season.

    Fail to plan, plan to fail.
     
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  10. eric_appleby

    eric_appleby Member+

    Jun 11, 1999
    Down East
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The loss was well-earned, but that pk was absolute garbage. Worst call I've seen in a long time.
     
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  11. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    not much discussion here about Tchani's yellow card on Caldwell. An off the ball punch to Caldwell's head... only a yellow?
     
  12. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I watched the highlights here.

    Originally I thought the PK was a dive and a bad call.

    But from the final view (starting at 3:24) I can see why the ref called it.
     
  13. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, it was a crap call, no doubt about it. He wasn't going to get to that ball anyway, and as the announcers said, "weak call."

    That said, our ex-gaffer said it best: "Yuh ken blayme thu raffaree effya lake, bu' a thu endathadey, yuh gut tae loo' a yuurself inna mirra."

    The way the Revs played, they didn't have a prayer of winning this game, no matter how bad the ref messed up that call.
     
  14. Minutemanii

    Minutemanii Member+

    Dec 29, 2005
    Abington MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Subject matter asside, ToMhIlL, please keep the Scottish typing coming!!! Et's fekken bdddddddddrilliant! End-dye loove ta raid et!!!!
     
  15. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Aye, bu ett's noothenn special. En fack, ett's dead-easy, soo easy tha even a loo-er praymate lake a Chacago Fayer suppor-ur or an Austro lopethekkus lake Benn Ulsen cuud due et, provaded they could figger oot wha alla those wee li-ul le-urs mean on tha keyboard. All yuh heffta due is tape the wurds oot EXACTLY as they sooond.

    Oh, an ye cannae pley prrropa fitba eff yeu nae warrin a kelt !
     
  16. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    I'm surprised that you're not raving about the releasing of Samba - that's the big fail IMO. This would have been a perfect opportunity for him.
    I'm absolutely with you up to his point. Heaps has been feeling enough pressure that he hasn't been confident enough to give his young/bench guys some real minutes.
    I don't think Neumann is a fail any more than McCrary is. They just haven't given them enough minutes to let them win a role.

    Same thing with Samba - when they got him, they knew that playing in MLS would require adjusting to the physicality put on central defenders (they said exactly that), yet they never were willing to let him play and live with the inevitable growing pains, despite problems at the position virtually all year.

    Smith has just been too injury prone. He regularly picks up injuries, without even the benefit of game minutes.
    True. And a very similar play occurred earlier, when Diego was set to get to a ball at the end line, in the area, and was bounced off the field with a "shoulder" charge. No call on that one.
    Yes. And Caldwell gets a yellow later for retaliation, when the replays show that he was clearly going for the ball and probably didn't even commit a foul.
    That's overly simplistic. Any team in MLS, on just about any night, can snatch a late goal in the final minutes. If the game is still in reach, the final minutes play out differently (that doesn't mean they didn't play like crap and didn't deserve a result, whatever that means!).
     
  17. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes - I remember that and was yelling at my tv when it happened as it looked like it would be called a foul if it had taken place anywhere else on the field. In fact, I brought it up on the Crew board and a few of their supporters objectively agreed with our sentiment and said their supporters section held its collective breath when it happened. When I made the point the red needs to be consistent (I agree with Heaps on this one), a few of their fans tried to argue it was shoulder to shoulder while the Ola Kamara pen was from behind. I don't agree but would need to see it again to refresh my memory.

    Do you (or anyone) remember roughly what part of the game that shove on Diego was? Late first half? Early second? I don't remember and wanted to take another look at it. I think it wasn't called because Diego, to his credit, didn't make a meal of it or protest vociferously. If he had and the play occurs in Foxboro in front of the Fort I bet that's a pk as he landed a good few yards out of bounds.
     
  18. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  19. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think we all mostly agree with rkupp's take on this whole thing. This game was a culmination of everything the Revs do wrong when it comes to building a team:
    • Not giving the younger players or other guys not in the top 15 a chance to get more minutes. Which leads to...
    • Why have the end of the roster populated when it's just a waste? Which leads to...
    • Why don't they have a reserve team that plays in a competitive league? I think we know the answer to that
    • OK, so why can't we have an arrangement with a team where we can get meaningful playing time for our guys?
    • And speaking of relationships with other teams, why couldn't Heaps find a way to make more of Samba? Think Sporting will give us another similar player next year?
    Until the entire philosophy of this team does a 180-degree turnaround, they will never amount to anything significant.
     
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  20. teskicks

    teskicks Member+

    New England Revolution
    United States
    Jan 14, 2002
    Wrentham, MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How about Kamara's retaliation hit on Caldwell just as the game ended?
     
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  21. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Should have resulted in a ban for him. Total cheap shot.
     
  22. mrt/MLS

    mrt/MLS Member

    Oct 11, 2003
    CT
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yeah that was crap. he was getting hammered all game, and that was a total cheap shot.

    Scott's foul wasnt even a yellow either.

    anyways, bad game.
     
  23. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    IIRC it was right before halftime.
     
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  24. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Glad we're in agreement youth development is a Heaps blindspot. The part that specifically bugs me the most is the fact these guys may have been good enough to rescue a point in a game like last weekend in Columbus. Take Herivaux for example. He didn't put a foot wrong in his USOC appearances IMO and fully deserved more league minutes, especially with that position in flux all year with the loss of Kouassi. Partner him with Caldwell who is steady, a good passer and already a veteran presence. If you don't play them you won't develop them and then they become a liability rather than a potential asset towards the end of the year.
     
  25. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

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