Rapids Home Grown/ Youth updates

Discussion in 'Colorado Rapids' started by 22SteveD, Dec 14, 2011.

  1. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am hoping Oscar Pareja will talk about his plans for Youth Academy soon. Please post a link here if you see any news release that covers Academy.
     
  2. Totoro

    Totoro Member+

    Dec 3, 2009
    Colorado
    Isn't that Bravo's baby? I can see Pareja making suggestions, and helping with some coaching and evaluation.
     
  3. jdub3379

    jdub3379 Member

    Jan 2, 2010
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Forgive me in advance if this has been covered somewhere else but whats up with Cabrera? I was just wondering if he's been named officially and if he was will the setup be similar to the FC Dallas setup, with Pareja coaching the first team and Cabrera coaching the reserves and running the academy. Anyone know?
     
  4. Totoro

    Totoro Member+

    Dec 3, 2009
    Colorado
    Good question, I don't think anything has been announced.

    Switching gears a little, what's the idea behind MLS academies? They have a little bit of an "underpants gnome" feel to me. But then I don't really know any more about youth soccer club culture than I do about the stolen underpants market.

    Now that the rules are in place, I can see why clubs would want to exploit the opportunity, esp. if they're in an area that produces a lot of youth talent--you're competing against the other MLS clubs to register/get claims in on area kids.

    However, I don't quite see the ROI for the league overall. The MLS clubs are paying for their academies, and not Adidas, right? Aren't they basically going to poach players from other area youth clubs, and who's to say the MLS academies' coaching will be any better?
     
  5. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The ROI is in reduced costs to get players (don't need to scout the draft as much if you're getting youth players from your academy, etc.) and selling those players on. I'm not sure its enough to balance the cost but then I don't know much about the finances at that level.
     
  6. 30Something

    30Something Member

    Jun 3, 2004
    5280 Feet
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bravo would be a moron to not use Pareja's experience in Dallas to improve our academy. I bet Oscar's influence will be much larger than "suggestions".
     
  7. 30Something

    30Something Member

    Jun 3, 2004
    5280 Feet
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    South American press is saying Cabrera will join the Rapids in February. Cabrera is still coaching the Nats U17 team through the end of January, and is taking them on an international trip to Europe somewhere (Turkey).
     
  8. 30Something

    30Something Member

    Jun 3, 2004
    5280 Feet
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Background: the Development Academy structure was set up by the USSF. The main goal was to better develop the best talent in the US. What you had in the traditional set up was 2-3 teams in each state dominating the others. So the best teams only played 1-2 really tough games/year, with the exception of tournaments, regionals and nationals.

    Also, the USSF believed that teams were playing too many games and not having enough training sessions.

    So, the Development Academy was created. There are something like 60+ teams across the country. Essentially the best club teams in the nation. They do not play games outside of the Academy, and only play a few games each month. This results in a higher level of competition in each game, and more training sessions.

    Every US-Based MLS team is represented in the Academy structure (plus Vancouver). The value these teams bring to players is the opportunity to move up to the 1st team and play professionally in the MLS.

    You're right, the academy teams are recruiting players from non-academy clubs. However, the best clubs have great coaching (they're good clubs for a reason). In addition, the teams receive support from the USSF on coaching techniques. Additionally, the opportunity to play against top competition will make these kids even better. The creme de la creme, if you will.

    I think the ultimate structure will be a 100% residential academy structure (at least for MLS clubs), so MLS teams can recruit players beyond a 50-75 mile radius. Essentially, consolidating the very best talent with even fewer teams. There are only a couple MLS teams that have a residential academy, but I'm betting we'll see more developed over the next 10 years.
     
    1 person likes this.
  9. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To add to what 30something said, the whole world uses team Youth Academy's to find, nurture and advance soccer talent for club/ national teams.

    I could be biased but Ajax (Amsterdam) and FC Barcelona (La Masia) are considered the best in world.

    Only current residency program by an MLS team is RSL in Arizona, although with Toronto's $18M investment in new facility in 2012, I am sure they will follow this route.

    Coaching for Clubs: Without a doubt is better then a decade ago, they are Professionals now and not volunteers/ parents. However, some will be better then others. FC Dallas (under Oscar our new coach) and RSL are considered to have best coaching in youth, also Toronto just added the former US under 20 coach. Clubs under USSF requires certifications which are not easy (as I understand it) to get and also require constant continuing education as well. Also USSF has roving instructors that also come in to help and make sure teams are following USSF instructions.

    ROI (Return on Investment) Don't see this used too much outside of business world but in this MLS academy world, locks in top talent for your club (they are basically your property if they play in US).
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. SoccerPrime

    SoccerPrime Moderator
    Staff Member

    All of them
    Apr 14, 2003
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I believe Vancouver also has a very good, residency based Development Academy.

    And to the earlier question if a year with a Alliance youth club counts, yes it does, or at least it does for the Galaxy. LA just signed Jose Villarreal who played with affiliate/alliance youth club Pateadores.
     
  11. Totoro

    Totoro Member+

    Dec 3, 2009
    Colorado
    Well, I didn't only write "suggestions" and I didn't put it in scare quotes to minimize it's importance. Presumably Pareja's primary responsibility will be coaching the senior team and that will take some time, and presumably since the academy has been one of Bravo's primary responsibilities, he'll continue to take the lead there. (The post I responded to was asking whether Pareja will be "talking about his plans.")

    Pareja can still contribute plenty w/Bravo remaining in charge on a day to day basis. (Unless, as you note, Bravo is a moron.)
     
  12. Totoro

    Totoro Member+

    Dec 3, 2009
    Colorado
    Thanks for the answers, everyone.

    I used it because MLS clubs are businesses. I understand why individual clubs have an incentive to form academies given the home grown signing rules--if there's a way to bypass the draft, you do it lest you reach the day when other clubs have their best local talent locked up but the top Colorado talent is entering MLS via the draft.

    I just wasn't sure how this helps MLS as a whole given the amount of investment required. I'm sure the idea is that the combo of improved reach (making high end coaching available to a wider pool of players), better/more comprehensive coaching/development will produce *more* star players...if the numbers of US pro players produced doesn't take a marked uptick as a result, you're not getting your money's worth.

    I suppose it's very forward-looking, which is why it seemed at least somewhat ???profit-ish to me. But then, I guess in a way the entire league is very forward-looking, in that pro soccer leagues had such a high failure rate.

    What clubs along the front range would be seen as competing w/ the Rapids academy for players? Clubs like Real Colorado, I assume.
     
  13. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks for Info Soccerprime, guess article I read was just including US teams. However, Rocky Mtn cup is coming home to Colorado this year!

    I think Oscar Pareja will have a say for sure in Rapids Academy. You don't hire away the guy responsible for the top MLS youth program and he gets no input. Plus looks like Wilmar Cabrera will be brought in to run Youth Teams (and assistant coach like Guppy did).
     
  14. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yep, Real Colorado is chief local rival. They are also very well coached (and certified by USSF) from what I understand.

    It seems MLS and USSF are very tight anymore, I think in this case (Youth Academy's) its a very good thing. Guess the dream case for MLS teams is Juan Agudelo, own his rights, no draft pick needed, get $6M offer (rumored) from europe for his transfer. Eventually program could become "self-funded" via this route.

    Ajax is perfect example of team basically completely funded by transfer fees from talent they develop. (TFC is basically an early Blue print of them now, including almost all dutch youth coaches now and the 4-3-3)
     
  15. deron

    deron New Member

    Jul 25, 2006
    Centennial, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Rapids Academy needs to focus very narrowly on running the organization well, and providing good coaching. In time they'll supplant the entrenched clubs, but if they get in too big a hurry they're gonna make the kind of mistakes that'll drive families back to the clubs.
     
  16. deron

    deron New Member

    Jul 25, 2006
    Centennial, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The whole world thinks nothing of placing 16 year olds in career tracks. This is a huge cultural hurdle for the US.
     
  17. Totoro

    Totoro Member+

    Dec 3, 2009
    Colorado
    If you're referring to the post of mine you quoted, we're talking past each other. I have no idea what in my post implies Pareja will have no input, BUT I AM NOT TRYING TO SAY THAT.
     
  18. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  19. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  20. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wanted to bring Marx's thoughts on Youth teams over here about regions/ areas of teams for youth purposes.

    I think eventual like he said this will become an issue, enough so that MLS will have to enact some new rule to "more" evenly distribute talent. It will be very interesting to see how this plays out because I believe MLS will also want top drawing teams to have more talent as reward back to all their fans and $ they bring in.

    It seems East coast, Texas and Cali have over 60% of the top talent found by USSF. If we see every MLS club create "alliances" with clubs in these regions, maybe that will resolve the issue somewhat.

    Maybe another solution is Residence academies that draw internationally, but Rapids/ MLS scouting would need to get much better in order to facilitate this.
     
  21. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Was reading through Youth forum threads and found this about residence programs:

    FC Dallas and Chicago Fire are planning residential academies. It's a huge undertaking, also involving responsibility for academic oversight and general adolescent well-being.

    Never knew about this:

    Vancouver Residential Academy article:
    Residential academy players forfeit access to NCAA scholarships and college play.

    “We’re clear on that, We make it very clear to the parents and the kids that this is an alternative, you can’t do both. If you want to pursue a professional career in the game, then you do what pianists and others do in their fields, you pursue that full time. We’ve come to the conclusion you can’t tap dance around that – you either want to go the professional route at a very young age or you don’t.”
     
  22. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ESPN article on youth development (7 coaches opinions)

    http://espn.go.com/sports/soccer/ne...oblems-american-soccer-leander-schaerlaeckens

    Really liked John Hackworth (Philly Union) response:

    "Ours is a very result-oriented culture -- specifically parents of young children -- and the only way they can measure whether their child is doing something good is whether they won on a Saturday. And that's the wrong way to look at how to become a really good soccer player. We need to think of it more as a musician. If you're a parent and your child is trying to play a piano recital in Carnegie Hall, they practice hours and hours and hours and play just once when they've perfected it. It's the opposite for kids in soccer; they play games and play games and play games and only practice every once in a while. We have it backwards. There is too much structure. What's appropriate for kids is not winning games and tournaments. Soccer is a skill game and you need to practice and practice. Most of that for a young kid is a lot of time on the ball in an environment where an adult really shouldn't be doing much more than cultivating creativity. The ball itself is the best coach there could be."
     
  23. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ESPN top High School Juniors (2013 grads) in CO:

    http://espn.go.com/high-school/boys-soccer/honors/story/_/id/7105876/class-2013-51-100

    31. Ethan Horvath, GK, Highland Ranch, Colo., Arapahoe, USSDA Real Colorado
    72. Emmanuel Martinez, MF, Bear Creek Lakewood, Colo., Bear Creek, USSDA Colorado Rush
    82. Ricardo Perez, MF, Fort Collins, Colo., Rocky Mountain, USSDA Colorado Rapids
    136. Timothy Tribbett, GK, Centennial, Colo., Grandview, USSDA Colorado Rush
    138. Yasin Abdulgasem, MF, Aurora, Colo., Overland, USSDA Real Colorado
    143. Oscar Montes, F, Lakewood, Colo., Bear Creek, USSDA Colorado Rush
     
  24. Totoro

    Totoro Member+

    Dec 3, 2009
    Colorado
    I think I know what he's getting at but that quote is all over the place, and perhaps that highlights the challenge with youth soccer. He contrasts soccer with classical music, but then it turns out he's not really talking about "practice" in the context of learning an instrument (which is probably good as few things seem more tedius than training children for classical music recitals). Instead, he's hinting at something that is neither "practice" as we tend to think of it, nor formal games.

    I wonder what age is he thinking of when he says "young children."
     
  25. 22SteveD

    22SteveD Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2011
    Denver
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ryan Kawulok was drafted by Portland Timbers.
    http://www.oregonlive.com/timbers/index.ssf/2012/01/former_pilot_ryan_kawulok_tryi.html

     

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