I've always thought that "Barça" was pronounced "Barka", but a friend of mine always says "Barsa", as in Barcelona. Is it a hard or soft "c" sound? The jackasses on FoxSportsWorld always say "Barsa", which leads me further to believe that this is the incorrect pronunciation. Which is it and why? Thanks.
It is indeed "Barsa". Why I don't know. I just know that a buddy of mine who's a linguistics major studied in Barcelona for a year and said that the "ç" is pronounced like an "s" sound.
i realize it is a different language, but ç=s in portugese. want a better question? ask how you properly pronouce xavi i've gone through this before, but here are the different ways i've heard it (phonetically in english) schah vee zah vee hah vee sah vee edit: oh ya, anyway it is barsa, not barka
Someone once told me that it is actually pronounced as a "th" as in "Barthelona". It sounds really lame that way though. In know the the "th" is common in Castillian Spanish but I don't know if it's also common in Catalan? Can anyone with actualy knowledge of Catalan help out?
cha vee ha vee they are the 2 ive heard, in the case of xabi alonso i only hear it pronounced cha bee
The letter "ç" does not exist in Castillian, it is Catalan, and is pronounced the same way as a soft c, the same way you pronounce the "c" in the word pronounced.
almost, but no. in castillian spanish, all s sounds are pronouced as if you have a lisp (interesting history behind this), so it would be more like barsthelona, but i guess it is hard to type a lisp sound. another thing is barcelona is catalan, not spanish. and to just clarify what bkn said, the 'ç' doesnt exist in any form of spanish, not only castillian.
sorry, but this is incorrect. In Castellano, the soft c is pronounced with a lisp, not the letter s. that's why Castellano is not pronounced 'cathteyano'.
Right he was. The letter is called a "C trencada", a "broken C". In French it exists and the mark is called a "cedille", which is were we get "façade", in fact an acceptable spelling of the word in English. If you speak Castilian Spanish it would be fine to say Barthelona. It should be remembered that that pronunciation of the "c" is typical in the north of Spain and parts of the centre and Med coast, even in Andalucia in some places, though most of Extremadura and Andalucia, onto the Canaries, and most of Latin America it is a silky "s". In Catalunya the "c" in Barcelona is pronounced as an "s", as that is the way to say it before an "e" or "i". Before an "a", "o", or "u" it is said like a hard "k". Thus when Barcelona is abbreviated, if you were to write it Barca it would have to be said "barka", a boat. To avoid this error and maintain the "s" sound even before an "a", you put the "ç" in there, so "Barça" is "Barsa". Some words in Catalan put in the "ç" for this same reason, so that "caça" (game, as in what is hunted for meat) is "casa" like in Spanish, otherwise if you said "caca" it would mean feces, err, get my drift? Re the "x": I admit that I vary in pronunciation here, perhaps an error, as it should be "sh" for sure at the end of a word. Thus "peix" (fish) is pronounced "pe-ish", with the vowels not drawn out but short and quick. "Greix" (grease) is said "gre-ish". But many people say it like a "ch" when it begins a word, as in "change". Thus Xavi for some would be "Shavi", while you also hear "Chavi". My doubt, and I'll have to ask is if the latter is in fact an error or if it acceptable.
Okay here's another... Here in Canada we have a highlites show where all the presenters pronounce Ronaldinho's name "Ron-ald-ING-o." It drives me crazy That's not correct is it? I've always thought it was "Ron-ald-EEN-yo." Now, generally the presenters on the show simply know nothing about football, but they've been pronouncing it this way for months. The group of them don't know something I don't, do they?
since there are so many accomplished linguists among us, i was also wondering about the catalan word "illusion" i've come accross it repeatedly in articles about barca but the internet translators can never translate it.
Well visiting Spain, I noticed that a lot of words are pronounced with the "th" sound. For example, gracias is pronounced gra-sias. But when I was in Spain, it was pronounced "gra-thias" with that lisp sound. So even Barcelona was pronounced "Barthelona". But isn't the distinction with the "ç" is that it's supposed to be pronounced "Barsa" and not "Bartha"?
umm i am pretty sure you are wrong. when i hear spaniards say words with s, there is still a lisp. edit: only thing i think i got wrong is how you spell the pronounciation of the lisp. i always hear lisps as 'sth,' but it seems everyone else hears it only as a 'th.'
I'm not wrong. soft c (i.e. before an 'i' or an 'e') and the letter z are pronounced as "th" in Castllian spanish. the letter "s" is pronounced as the letter 's' in soccer. i guarantee you did not hear anyone say, 'buenoth diath theñor!' If you did, that person had a speech impediment. There are of course regional accents and pronunciation varies in different spanish speaking countries, but that's a different issue.
Cha bee is correct. I have also heard it pronounced chub bee,,,but they were actually speaking of Clint Mathis
ok just checked in some songs and i was proven wrong. oh well, i dont know crap about castillian, learned my spanish in ecuador and from colombians, peruvians, and venezuelans. im just happy i didnt learn in argentina
"Ilusión" in Spanish as you are seeing it used is essentially a "high hope", expressing an optimistic desire for something. The fans are thus "ilusionados" about their team, very optimistic and hopeful for its future. In Catalan it is "il.lusió", with the paired l's divided by a dot mid-line. This is to ensure it does not get pronounced as an "ll", more like an "l" and "y" together, tough to pronounce. For the meaning usually seen in a soccer article it is used in the same way as in Spanish. In both cases I think that it can indeed have the meaning of an error in perception, closer to the English. Though usually something highly illusive, a mirage, is called an "espejismo" in Spanish.
Catalan is orignally derived from the southern french dialect (hence "mercès") Is that where the cedilla comes from? In french it is pronounced like an "s"....