Project24 - Stage 2 - Cardiff City v Arsenal

Discussion in 'Arsenal' started by crazy150, Aug 28, 2018.

  1. NorthBank

    NorthBank Member+

    Arsenal; NYRB
    United States
    Mar 29, 2006
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've heard that said by some pundits & opposition fans. But seriously, you think that's gonna happen? Don't you think the Pep recipe is predicated on deep pockets? I don't know what his next gig will be after Citeh, but I suspect it won't be to a club that has a tight budget.
     
  2. NorthBank

    NorthBank Member+

    Arsenal; NYRB
    United States
    Mar 29, 2006
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If true, that's a shame. He left early from Russia so he should've had enough time to chill with the fam and then get back to fitness. There must be others who played in the group stage of WC who are up to full fitness now.
     
  3. NorthBank

    NorthBank Member+

    Arsenal; NYRB
    United States
    Mar 29, 2006
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This. Sad but probably true.
     
  4. crazy150

    crazy150 Member+

    Aug 27, 2006
    North Cuba
    I know he will never be tested that way, but it is a small asterisk for me beside his coaching accomplishments. Plus he now has the rep Such that he can effectively bring a discount to xfers for players that want to win. Kind of the opposite of the Mourinho effect at United now.
     
  5. crazy150

    crazy150 Member+

    Aug 27, 2006
    North Cuba
    I think arsenal will spash on some new defenders eventually, but like with Klopp and pep the management team will need some time to identify targets that fit with Emery’s plans.

    Also tactics and simple personnel shifts can play a huge role. Don’t necessarily need to spend 200m, but it helps. In 2014/15 we were second in XGA, 2015/16 top of the table. 2016/17–eighth; 2017/18–seventh.

    What happened? For me it was a collapse midfield not just CB woes. No Santi, no flamini, no arteta and coq was shite in AWs new system where he played far up the pitch in front of xhaka.

    I think with torriera and possibly guen, the club has brought in the players to rectify the lack of defending in midfield and return of some press resistance.
     
  6. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Adding to what Crazy said, I don't expect Pep to light somewhere that puts him in such a position but the point is that it is more difficult to properly assess the merits of a manager when they're in that rare situation where they can buy any and every player they need, including quality just for depth. Much like with Celtic in the SPL, Kentucky hoops, or many other legacy/ well-heeled team, how much of their success is down to the coach or simply the calibre of the players vs the competition? This isn't to excuse his talent as a manager, but I'd wager if you switched him with with, say, Sean Dyche, Citeh would still be vying for the title and Burnley would still struggle.

    I would put Mourinho in the same group in that I doubt we'll ever see him "slumming" with a less-than-rich club, albeit for different reasons and he's somehow contrived to bomb with such clubs.
     
  7. bandwagongooner

    bandwagongooner Member+

    Dec 9, 2006
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There aren't enough CBs to fill the number of teams wanting to play a press right now which makes fixing a defense somewhat difficult. Great defenders like Sol Campbell or John Terry would probably find it difficult to play the style that dominates at the top right now.
     
  8. Gunning4Chelsea

    Gunning4Chelsea Member+

    Aug 2, 2005
    chicago
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Isn’t that enough?
     
  9. crazy150

    crazy150 Member+

    Aug 27, 2006
    North Cuba
    Enough for what?

    Sure I’d have him. Yes, he has done a great job. Doesn’t mean he is the best ever or the best in the league, world, etc. which are all labels being thrown around a lot.
     
  10. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I presume this is why Sokratis was acquired as he has experience in a gegen pressing team
     
  11. KozIsCul

    KozIsCul Member+

    Feb 6, 2005
    I think 4231 best suits what we have at the moment. But my beef against Emery isn't so much that he wants to run a different system, it's the fact that he's been so dogmatic about a couple things, against the best interest of winning the matches we're in.

    The gk kickball hijinks is the most obvious part, but it's not the only one. Watching the first half of the Cardiff game it's clear that he wants to control the game through possession. As a generality that's fine, but we're sticking to it situations where it's obviously not serving us. Having the ball inside our own half isn't really any better than not having the ball. You really can't do anything with it except get it into their half. So do it. The only thing we accomplish by keeping the ball in our own half is depriving our high-priced talent the service they need to create with. We wouldn't allow teams like Cardiff to do that to us, we shouldn't be doing it to ourselves.

    I'd feel better about things if somehow I believed this was some temporary experiment or learning device. But if it is, we haven't seen any indication of that from Emery so far.
     
    thebigman repped this.
  12. And_ROOS

    And_ROOS Member+

    Dec 30, 2006
    Melbourne, Aus
    I don't think he has been at all. I am of the opinion that Cech, as the experienced keeper is being given 10 games to show what he has, while Leno plays in any cups. And if Cech shits the bed again, and Leno puts in a good show, Leno will come straight in.

    I rate Mourinho higher for what he did with Porto in the CL than anything Pep has done. All that money spent at so many clubs, its like bragging about winning with a rich club in football manager. Buy everyone, win things. Great for the fans, but he won't go down as someone who revolutionized football management. Has he ever had to do it hard at any club?
     
  13. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    True, but that Porto run (during the year the Invincibles should have won the darn thing) had a number of flukes to it, as well. Porto played a defensive, hack-laden affair against a tired Man U side to open the knock-out rounds, scoring @ Old Trafford in the 90th minute to advance. They then had Lyon, which had key players miss the 2nd leg due to cards, a Depor side which contrived to beat Milan 5-4 on aggregate, and finally a Monaco side that fluked past Real Madrid and was missing one starter due to suspension. Hey, give Porto and Jose credit for getting the job done and beating the teams before them, but apart from ManU they didn't exactly beat a Murderers Row collective of giants, either.

    But man did that season have a rusty lining. Invincibles in the Prem but oh-so-close to a treble, only to get knocked out of 2 tournaments within 4 days by less-than-glamorous means. Still haunts me.
     
  14. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    It's usually overlooked that the Porto team had a bunch of very very good players

    The midfield of Deco, Maniche, Costinha and Mendes is more than good enough to beat Utd

    [​IMG]
     
  15. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
     
  16. NorthBank

    NorthBank Member+

    Arsenal; NYRB
    United States
    Mar 29, 2006
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just heard him say that on the Arsenal Vision podcast. If only this one stat makes a good midfielder. Still, I haven't given up on him yet. I'm happy to see a Xhaka-Torreira MF tried for a run of games, meanwhile let Guendouzi sit and watch (and play cups) for a little while, knowing that he seems to be at the very least very good depth... and probably much more.
     
  17. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Pretty elite though
     
  18. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    No one has any issues with his long passes and direct balls into attacking positions

    But his lackadasicalmpassing innour half to the opposition, poor defensive position, lack of mobility and rash tackling g can be an issue

    This is why torreira has to partner him imo in the same way gifted passers like pirlo and alonso were protected
     
  19. Shen-O

    Shen-O Member+

    United States
    Jul 26, 2005
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This team is shooting itself in the foot playing Xhaka. Just move on already, eat the cost, sign someone in January and be done with finally.

    Why bother with him
     
  20. Tonerl

    Tonerl Member+

    Arsenal
    May 10, 2006
    Cincinnati, OH
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because he’s absolutely elite at one of the most valuable actions a midfielder can take.

    Like biggie said, he’s got flaws but with the right partner you can exploit his strengths and minimize his weaknesses.
     
  21. Tonerl

    Tonerl Member+

    Arsenal
    May 10, 2006
    Cincinnati, OH
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nobody says that alone makes a good midfielder, but players that are that special at something so valuable are worth trying to accommodate if you can find the right balance.
     
  22. Shen-O

    Shen-O Member+

    United States
    Jul 26, 2005
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You mean his ONE strength right? Yea, he's killing us dude. He can't even pass the eye test.

    Why cater to someone with so many flaws? Pirlo didn't just have pretty balls into the final 3rd, he also knew when to play short, when to play long, how to receive and turn with the ball beautifully, and he knew when to pick up/slow down the tempo. Xhaka does none of these things.

    Did we learn nothing under Wenger and his love of crocked/flawed players?
     
  23. Tonerl

    Tonerl Member+

    Arsenal
    May 10, 2006
    Cincinnati, OH
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bzzzt!
     
  24. Shen-O

    Shen-O Member+

    United States
    Jul 26, 2005
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'll take "sorry responses when I have no real reply" for 200 Alex
     
  25. Tonerl

    Tonerl Member+

    Arsenal
    May 10, 2006
    Cincinnati, OH
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Your hysterics include claiming ‘the eye test’ is the first bar and your argument consists of Pirlo>>>Xhaka. (No shit.)

    What am I supposed to engage with?
     

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