Pre/pbp/post 7/10 WWC USA vs. Brazil

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by Namdynamo, Jul 6, 2011.

  1. Bonnie Lass

    Bonnie Lass Moderator
    Staff Member

    Lyon
    Norway
    Oct 20, 2000
    Up top
    Club:
    Olympique Lyonnais
    Then what forum is it?

    If you want a neutral ground to debate the match, I suggest you go to the WWC forum. Not here. This IS the U.S. WNT Forum. There's only one. And this is it.
     
  2. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Thought this was part of the WWC forum :confused:
    -----
    OHHHH CRAP!!! your right. I apologise to the people here, I thought this was neutral ground, and I said I wouldn't post in the U.S. forums.

    Why is it part of the U.S. forum though, the other game threads are part of the WWC areas?
     
  3. AzNChicken

    AzNChicken Member

    Jul 10, 2007
    Los Angeles, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Maybe some people aren't pessimistic all the time and like to discuss the positives of their side in the USA Women forum...

    I don't think a celebratory forum should be made for every country that participates in the world cup. It seems appropriate to some of that here.

    BTW, sending off a player usually lowers the quality of play. This time, the opposite effect took place, at least on the US side. By all means, criticize how Brazil shot themselves in the foot and let this get away from them. Still, considering how the match ended, I'm not done celebrating. Sorry if my chest-thumping is disturbing your day.
     
  4. luvdagame

    luvdagame Member+

    Jul 6, 2000
    could have fooled me.

    just about all you say about them is that they can't play attractive football, or they only depend on athleticism. or maybe they are hoping that "heart" gets them thru, or they are not advancing the women's game, pia doesn't know what she's doing. she's looking for players who "gel" rather than good footballers etc.

    otoh, you like how germany plays, they have a great system, they use their younger players, when one forward goes down, another one just 'popps' up, etc.

    like i said before, i like pretty football as much as others. i loved christiane and marta's skill on the ball. but that's only one part of the game. i want the uswnt to achieve that level of skill, but culture determines much more that $$ and demographics in soccer, and we are not a football culture. so that part will always come slowly. so even tho i want the nice dribbling, more than that, i want the uswnt to WIN. that's the bottom line.

    but we have had this conversation too many times before....
     
  5. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Don't bother replying to anything I said. Ignore everything I said, as it wasn't meant to be in a U.S. zone. I won't post here again, sorry. I thought this thread was on neutral ground, but Bonnie just hit me up with a dose of reality.

    Again sorry, enjoy the rest of the tournament, and hopefully I'll remember to look at the top of the page in future :eek:
     
  6. Bonnie Lass

    Bonnie Lass Moderator
    Staff Member

    Lyon
    Norway
    Oct 20, 2000
    Up top
    Club:
    Olympique Lyonnais
    There's two threads. One for everyone else in the WWC forum, and one just for the U.S. fans that's here. That's pretty much the way it's always been.
     
  7. lovingthegreen

    May 29, 2006
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Back to more positive news ... :)

    Here is a video of fan reactions to Abby's goal and Ali's penalty kick assembled by the same person who had that awesome video of reactions to Donovan's goal last year, which can also be accessed on that page if you haven't seen that yet.

    http://www.youtube.com/user/robbydkitchel#p/a/u/0/ydBvRFNeMKc

    So cool to see that I was not the only one reacting like that. :D
     
  8. FawcettFan14

    FawcettFan14 Member+

    Mar 19, 2004
    Colorado
    I don't see what you all are arguing about. There are a time and place for BOTH reveling in a thrilling victory, and for critiquing the team's play and pointing out what they need to do better to win this thing. We don't have to be all one or all the other.

    I was jumping off my couch in excitement when Wambach scored. Actually, I was pacing around the living room nervously ever since Beuhler was sent off. Abby's post-game interview, and the shots of she and Hope Solo embracing, brought tears to my eyes. I called all my soccer-fan friends to share the moment. I could not stop smiling last night. I wrote a relatively proud, gushing, patriotic post on this thread a few hours after the game. There's no problem with delighting in such an epic and unbelievable finish to a game.

    However, Batfink's words, pessimistic as they might be, have an element of truth. The U.S. did not link up well in attack, their passing was poor (although it improved as the game wore on), and nobody (even O'Reilly) could beat defenders 1v1. Similarly, Brazil played a very disjointed and strangely casual game. I was shocked that Lima didn't instruct them to go for the jugular once they were up a player, or that the players themselves didn't just do it...that was the obvious correct strategy when you have a man advantage AND the momentum. Baffling. In short, while the game was high on passion and drama, it was fairly low on quality. Batfink is totally correct in saying it.

    Last night was a night for celebration for American sports fans, there's no debating that. I was fully a part of it. The morning after, though, the serious soccer fan side of me starts to view things a bit more neutral, level-headed way. Does watching the replay of Wambach's header still give me chills? Of course. Is seeing the Brazilians' shellshocked facial expressions still immensely satisfying? Absolutely. But do I still recognize that there are significant issues with the team's style that need work? Yes. Does the team need to retool post-World Cup, uncover and integrate new players, and come up with some more innovative formations and tactics? Also yes.
     
  9. AzNChicken

    AzNChicken Member

    Jul 10, 2007
    Los Angeles, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And Batfink and yourself aren't the only ones mentioning it. No worries. Without a doubt, game film is being reviewed in detail in preparation for France. Whether or not that makes a difference in game, we'll just have to see.

    Either way, there was at least some improvement on the US' backline. Switching someone over to help out Amy L. at LB jammed attacks on that flank, which was being tested often in the first half. If only Bob Bradley made a similar adjustment for Bornstein at LB after half-time... irrelevant. Don't think O'Reilly was healthy either. As in the previous game with Sweden, without her the US attack becomes limited. She made a couple good runs but to no effect. It's too bad Rapinoe doesn't have the kind of speed that O'Reilly has..

    Cheney should be in a more central role! Running around freely on both flanks just overloaded them and didn't allow for her to have any impact on the match. For once, I agreed with Foudy on her call: should've subbed Lloyd for Rapinoe and threw Cheney into Lloyd's position with Rapinoe wide.
     
  10. lovingthegreen

    May 29, 2006
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hope this team wins the whole thing but, if they do, I also hope that they realize that long-term changes still need to be made. Just because you win it all does not mean that doing the same thing will win the World Cup in 2015. And, of course, the team does need to make immediate adjustments if they are going to beat France, but I'm sure they know that already and are not resting on their laurels.

    I'm sure they also know how similar what they did was to what the men did against Algeria last year and that the men then lost their next game and are going to do everything they can to ensure that part of last year is not repeated. And, as much as it appears you can just will yourself to victory, you obviously cannot count on that every day.
     
  11. philafan

    philafan Member

    Mar 20, 2010
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just one correction. On the game tying goal. It was actually Lloyd and not Boxx who made that run and then pass to Rapinoe. It was actually an end to end play that I believe started with Krieger on the right side, then to Lloyd in the center of the field, who as you said warded off two defenders and found Rapinoe to the left, who then made the brilliant cross to Abby's head.
     
  12. backheelscorer

    backheelscorer New Member

    Jun 14, 2011
    Club:
    Abbotsford Mariners
    Thrilling gaame, and as a USSA fan, was psyched against Brazil---but we ply awful soccer. We play like robots, can not beat anyone 1v.1, and have to completely count on crosses for goals. I am a big fan, but all the girls except for the girl who was a late sub (forget her name) can juke around a player. Everone else just pushes the ball forward 6-7 meters and tries t beat the defender to the ball, oft-times lsing the ball. Or a crappy pass right to the opposition, this whole game looks like the pre-`1990 USA mens team. It's Ugly. i s this the best we have???
     
  13. Andy Zilis

    Andy Zilis Member+

    Mar 9, 2005
    Rochelle, IL
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I guess it depends on your interpretation of the word "trouble". I saw England score the first goal against the run of play and then hold onto that lead until the final seconds of the game. That, despite some bizarre substitutions by their coach that left a few attacking players in the game who were seriously struggling with injuries/cramps. Then they pushed it all the way to PKs and forced France to come from behind yet again.

    I call that trouble. As much as the US team has struggled to put away their chances, France struggled with that aspect of the game even more against England. Their only truly convincing performance was against Canada. If they can find that form again, they'll be tough to beat. If they actually do something with their scoring chances, the US could be in trouble. That said, the reverse is also true, and overall, I'd give the US the slight edge going into this game. It's going to be difficult, though, and I can see either team winning it.
     
  14. vichuck

    vichuck Member

    Jul 25, 2008
    New Braunfels
    Club:
    Blackburn Rovers FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks for posting. Our house looked like that, too.
     
  15. sisterluke

    sisterluke Member

    Sep 27, 2008
    Los Angeles,CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Sol
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't see why its wrong to feel happy about the US winning the match. If I am very tearful and joyous over the result, does that mean I'm not taking the USWNT seriously?
     
  16. Gilmoy

    Gilmoy Member+

    Jun 14, 2005
    Pullman, Washington
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's not a shocker to those of us who've followed USA since 1995. We are fully aware that we pass poorly and don't make breathtaking vertical runs. This edition has been (not) doing it for 3+ years.

    It's still our team. That's reason enough for us to be here.

    And that's reason enough for you to keep harping on it, twice each in five threads per day :D

    See, you take the above to be a problem. We Americans are proud of it. We agree, and react differently.

    Historical artifact. #1 means only that nobody has earned more points than us on past major podiums. It doesn't mean we play the most beautiful style (and we USA fans have already torn out our own hair over this for years). Past performance is no guarantee of future bonita.

    You griped about us during group play.
    You griped about us for our QF play.
    You're griping about our upcoming SF play.

    We are content with this trend :D
     
  17. Alberto

    Alberto Member+

    Feb 28, 2000
    Northern, New Jersey
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    While the result was fantastic, the US did give away the ball and possession against Brasil. After starting out well and putting Brasil on their heels, Brasil started playing better.

    Megan Rapineo, was terrible until her left footed cross to Wombach. She gave away so many passes and was displaced from the ball so many times that it really was hard to watch.

    I did think defensively the US women were much better in their marking of the Brasilians.

    Overall, we need to hold the ball better and link up the middle to the attacking third of the field.
     
  18. Gilmoy

    Gilmoy Member+

    Jun 14, 2005
    Pullman, Washington
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Rampone was 1-v-1 on Cristiane, possibly with Krieger lurking just inside on our box right. We never saw exactly how the ball popped 5m away from Cristiane as she went flat -- a failed backpass, or Rampone's tackle? From there, Rampone passed to Lloyd, who veered leftward horizontal to evade pressure.

    Tobin Heath, who has numerous US Soccer dribbling-trick videos. Good to see her get some minutes in the crucible, and emerge unbowed.

    That's a long story, 3+ years in the making. Briefly, this is who we brought, we're still in it, let's find a way to win. This is basically who we chose and groomed over the last 2 years, so we're just being consistent to a commitment Pia made around then. Most of this roster was not a surprise, and most of our performances haven't been a surprise either.

    Whether this is the best of our player pool is a veritable can of worms, which we have been chewing for just as long. (Worms are rubbery, and taste like pork lungs.)

    Whether our youth system is fully scouting our player pool and properly developing ball skills and tactical vision is an even bigger pit, with the added bonus of entrenched vested interests, only somewhat smaller in scale than the Obama-House debt ceiling talks.

    All of these things will be on the table starting next week. Our London 2012 team will surely have some new personnel, which may or may not improve our style.

    Our Wed 07/13 semifinal team will surely look mostly the same as what we've shown so far, and will probably play the same way. With the same results :p The game is afoot!!
     
  19. Blustar

    Blustar Member

    May 30, 2006
    Club:
    Miami FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No wonder kicker gave her such a good score, that was a very composed and brilliant run, thanks for the correction.
     
  20. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    You are ignoring that Rapinoe had EVERY pass into the box that found a target.

    She was 5/10 in that category. The rest of the USA team was 0/18.( yes, even Boxx's cross found Diaine, not Wambach.)

    USA possession for the game was 51-49 to the good with a man down for 54+ minutes.

    Brasil must have had issues with their game as well, and the USA can claim credit for that.
     
  21. luvdagame

    luvdagame Member+

    Jul 6, 2000
    this is not new or news. we've said this a million times on this board. ussf knows it - that's why they started the dev. acad. i'm probably not as impatient as other people because i honestly believe that culture is more important than $$ and demographics in this regard, and therefore that part of our game will change very slowly. indeed i see it changing slowly on the mens side.

    btw, we still out posessed brazil - even playing with 10 for a large part of the game.

    what's unusual about this in just about any soccer game between 2 well matched teams?

    thanks for mentioning.

    this too is part of the game. so many think it's only about scoring after some fancy footwork. so they concentrate on how poor we are at that.

    true. it's obviously easier to say than do tho, because it's something we talk about incessantly on this board, and it's something the coach preaches about all the time.

    anyway, right now we're just enjoying the victory, and hoping that the girls can recover in time for france who are good and who will have an extra day's rest.

    as usual, i'm confidently worried.
     
  22. wathombe

    wathombe Member

    Mar 8, 2011
    Southern California
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wow. You point to an own goal as a sign of Brazil's superior skill? Wow.
     
  23. brentgoulet

    brentgoulet Member+

    Oct 12, 2005
    PuertoPlata, DomRep
    And as a matter of fact, that owngoal was the only legal goal Brazil scored :D
     
  24. ForeverLOST108

    ForeverLOST108 Member+

    Jan 23, 2010
    Orlando
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Cristiane stole the ball from Rampone and went to hold it in the corner, Marta started to make a run into the box and Cristiane tried to pass it with the outside of her foot but the ball was intercepted in the air by Krieger who passed to Lloyd.
     
  25. Non-dairy Creamer

    Feb 28, 2007
    are you talking about the men's or women's team? :)

    have you watched the other senior team? they are as boring as can be, and been that way for awhile, over the past year, I'd definitely take our women over the men for pure aesthetics, may not be saying a lot to some people but that's how I feel.




    you could say that about most any team not named Barcelona, Arsenal and Spain.

    your point is taken though, it's an ongoing problem for every US team, but we've still managed to win a few world cups and Olympics.

    you also have to admit that Brazil didn't really take it to the US when they had the chance, esp. up a player. Or maybe the US was just that good down a player. In a way it's a testament to the conditioning of the athletes that they did so well.

    I just hope we have something in the tank for France and the Final.
     

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