News: Possible PSRA (Referee) strike in 2019

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by AndyMead, Dec 18, 2018.

  1. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Pro referees give union board strike authorization
    https://www.socceramerica.com/publi...es-give-union-board-strike-authorization.html

    Short form: CBA between PSRA (referees' union for U.S. and Canadian referees) and PRO (assigning and oversight body for MLS, NWSL, USL) expires on January 15, 2019. PSRA has received authorization to call a strike from its membership and the NLRB has ruled in the PSRA's favor over a complaint that PRO has been bargaining in bad faith.

     
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  2. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks for posting this over here. Completely forgot last night.

    I don't really know any details at this point, and I doubt anything I might happen to learn will be repeatable due to the legal ramifications.
     
  3. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I actually asked a PSRA member last month about Alan Kelly getting MLS Cup and got a "no comment" as an answer.

    Disclaimer, I used to be an officer in an IATSE local, and I'm a strong believer in collective bargaining, and I have a strong distaste for strike breakers.
     
  4. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
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  5. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I'm somewhat surprised that Kelly is a member of PSRA. He was hired by PRO as a referee instructor prior to the last strike, and picked up the whistle on opening day - while the PSRA referees were on strike.

    The strike-breaking MLB umps that stayed on with the league were never admitted into that union. I'm surprised to read that Kelly was admitted into the PSRA after crossing their picket line.
     
  6. FoxBoro 143

    FoxBoro 143 Member+

    Jan 18, 2004
    MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  7. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  8. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I have to imagine it's complicated.

    This whole thing actually answers some long-standing questions, namely how the hell did Peter Walton lure one of Ireland's top referees without paying him big bucks? The answer is that he didn't. He used the lockout as an excuse to get Kelly on the field but keep paying him a higher salary.

    I am not a lawyer so I have no idea how this will turn out, but I know Walton is a weasel and a league stooge. I hope they get rocked in court/arbitration.
     
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  9. FoxBoro 143

    FoxBoro 143 Member+

    Jan 18, 2004
    MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hope the referees are allowed to negotiate for themselves, instead of being forced into lower salaries by a union. The one thing MLS has not improved upon over the years is the officiating. If the league can attract high quality talent by negotiating with them, instead of being stuck with lesser officials who are willing to accept the terms some lawyer negotiated.
     
  10. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    I doubt the union is forcing them into lower salaries. I'm sure it is the opposite. Growing up I was never a fan unions. Had many relatives in them and stories all seemed to focus protecting low performing members and stifling management. Most of the companies they worked for ended up closing because the quality was so low compared to alternatives. However, if let unchecked too many owners will take advantage of their employees.

    Every league's fans think their officials are terrible. MLS seems pretty pro-active in working to improve training.
     
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  11. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wonder if maybe some independence from MLS might not start them down the road to organizational improvement.

    As it is, PRO is run out of 420 Fifth Ave. New York, the same suite as SUM, MLS, Goal.com. etc. Maybe cutting the apron strings and creating a truly independent agency instead of simply being lackeys for MLS would help wash away some of the lies and corruption.
     
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  12. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How many unions have the right to pick members and invite some people but not others? Is there a link to a federal law that defines a "union"? Who can create a union? Are there industries that are not allowed to unionize? Can people excluded from a union create a rival union? Can people who do the same job for the same company ever be members of different unions?
     
  13. Eddie Stiel

    Eddie Stiel Member

    Sep 27, 2011
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    The PSRA did not strike in 2014. MLS/PRO locked them out. Kelly did scab, even though there were not actual picket lines at MLS matches.
     
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  14. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Thanks for the clarification. That's an important distinction. I'm usually not that sloppy with union/management things, but I was just being lazy and couldn't be bothered to do two minutes research. Sigh. My apologies. Thanks again for the correction!
     
    Eddie Stiel repped this.
  15. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It bears repeating. MLS is PRO. PRO is MLS. Any semblance of independence is an illusion, and that includes the "independent review panel" that hears red card appeals and assigning in general.
     
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  16. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    From a pure title POV wasn't Kelly management at the point of the last lock out? Thus he didn't scab in the traditional sense, he was management filling in for the missing employees.

    (I realize that what his title was and what he was actually brought in to do weren't exactly the same and PRO played fast and loose with that, so from that POV the title of scab could apply)
     
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  17. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    42. Yes. People. Yes. Yes. No.
     
  18. FoxBoro 143

    FoxBoro 143 Member+

    Jan 18, 2004
    MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is MLS obliged to continue using PRO in the event of a strike? Can they tell PRO, if they are unable to find replacements, that their contract is terminated and MLS hires new, non-union referees?
    Or would the NLRB, or another applicable party, rule that MLS and PRO are essentially the same thing and MLS must negotiate with the union?

    That is assuming that the three parties dont already have this situation covered in a prior agreement, which they likely do.
     
  19. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I'm probably out of my depth here, but I doubt MLS has ever been in the business of assigning referees. They do contract referees to work their games, but the assigning to specific games is ostensibly done by USSF. PRO is a collaboration between USSF, the CSA, and MLS to foster professionalism and professional development of referees in the United States and Canada, and has taken over some of the assigning responsibility from USSF and CSA.

    PRO will still continue to do the assigning of referees for MLS games, the only difference is that in the case of a lock out or strike, referees that are in the PSRA will not be working.

    In that case we'll likely get what we got during the last lockout - PRO management that can still meet the fitness requirements, immigrant officials who have not joined the PSRA, recently retired official (there was one during the last lock out), and "national" officials that probably don't expect to ever otherwise make it to the MLS level running center with some older "regional" refs who likewise don't expect to ever be in the PSRA filling out down-roster.

    I would expect that the VR and VR2 spots would be filled by management and retired referees who don't care about their personal relationships with PSRA members.
     
  20. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What I said.
     
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  21. asoc

    asoc Member+

    Sep 28, 2007
    Tacoma
    I don't trust PRO one bit to be honest with you. Too many fishy things done by them. And it shouldn't be PRO who puts someone on the Independent Review Panel but the PSRA that does it.

    I don't always like decisions made by refs, but I will trust their integrity 100% when compared to PRO.
     
  22. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Well, I do think some of the things that have happened since PRO was formed are very positive. Though I'm sure the formation and solidification of the PSRA is part of that. The level of refereeing has gone up. Especially the Assistant Referees. Offside calls are generally of the highest standard anymore in MLS. Just five and especially 10 years ago that was not the case. (I can supply examples if needed). The increasing professionalism of the craft is also a big positive.

    That said, I definitely understand and agree with much of what you say. There is still too little independence and too many conflicts of interest with PRO.
     
  23. BalanceUT

    BalanceUT RSL and THFC!

    Oct 8, 2006
    Appalachia
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I somewhat suggests that he had no choice in the matter, nor did the union. Any referee that works 4 games is automatically enrolled in the Union per the CBA.
     
  24. BalanceUT

    BalanceUT RSL and THFC!

    Oct 8, 2006
    Appalachia
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I didn't see anything about quality of refereeing in the article. Where did it so "clearly explain why MLS officiating is so poor"?
     
  25. FoxBoro 143

    FoxBoro 143 Member+

    Jan 18, 2004
    MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If you read it, you saw how much of a conflict just one referee has caused. No big deal, but when that one referee is probably better than all the rest, and he most likely would not be here on the union negotiated salary, that demonstrated that the salary ceiling is too low to attract referees that dont suck.
     

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