So we have an assistant coach who's daughter somehow ended up on our "A" team. She is a rec level player and someone just missed it. Anyway, the dad reached out to our DOC and told her he wants to be involved and she made him an assistant coach on our team. Never asked the head coach, just said "here he is make it work." No soccer experience whatsover and has been a huge pain. Anyway, it turns out that he has secretly been using a playing time app to track girls pt. I saw a screen shot of it and was just floored to see my daughter's name in an app without my permission. Its not like he's posting her information on social media but I was taken aback by seeing her name without ever having been told this was being used. Just curious as to what your reactions would be if that were your 9 year old daughter.
No offence, but there seems like a lot extra baggage to a pretty simple question… Personally, I don’t see an issue…
Does the app post public information -- first and last name along with other info -- to the Web at large? I use CoachClock for my rec team. I love it. I'm able to see how long someone has been out, how much time they've played in the game so far, etc. That's actually MORE private than having a sheet of paper I might lose at the field. Not that the latter would be particularly bad -- I have no idea what a stranger would do with the information that a kid named Billy played left mid for 52 minutes.
He should have told you and just been transparent about it. But let me guess. He started doing it after watching a few games?
All I read is that the father likely coaxed a weak DOC into letting his daughter play on a team where she seems to not have earned her way followed by a father - with no prior experience, throwing himself in and then keeping stats on the entire team. Helicopter parent and beyond. Now if the guy is a TA - fine. But it sounds like he thinks he's more and these sorts of shenanigans generally don't end well.
While agreeing the situation with the assistant coach and his kid is certainly frustrating, if not concerning, going off half-cocked and reacting like this is a child abuse allegation is a bit irresponsible… Not to justify anything, but no program is prefect…so while yeah, you have a right to not be happy about the situation and it should certainly be a check mark against the club/team, the grass isn’t always greener on the other side… Ever decision regarding a team/club should be done weighing the pros and cons (and the other viable options) …for all we know, the head coach is actually decent, the OP’s kid is having fun and learning good soccer, and there aren’t a lot of other options in his area…. Nothing I’ve heard so far is grounds for immediately and unquestionably leaving the club/team without further analysis…
Never alleged child abuse, never said i was leaving the club over it. Just expressed frustration that a dad with no experience who has a daughter with rec level talent on the "A" team, has decided to secretly keep playing time stats on our kids without parental knowledge or permission. This parent with zero, zippo, nada, soccer knowledge has gone to the DOC to complain about PT and many other issues.
I find this thread to be everything I hate about youth sports. Competition among parents and drawing lines in the sand about who is "good" and who is "bad" at 9 years old. Calling a dad names who asked, "hey, can I help out?" and was given a, I'm assuming, volunteer role. Did you ask if you could help out and were you denied? Are there any other teams with volunteer assistant coaches? Is it against club regulations? My guess is the answers are No, Yes and No. Making an absolute determination that a child is "rec level" . . . at age 9. SMH. When does all this talent to be a club level player start? Age 3? Maybe your 9 year old looks more talented because she has had club level coaching for a year or so already. Perhaps someone with a lot of soccer knowledge saw potential in this "rec level" player and thinks with proper training, she'll grow by leaps and bounds. Not that "someone missed it" Man; crap like this just kills me. Age 9 . . . Maybe the dad who wants to help, downloaded the app because he heard or felt that coaches don't provide all the kids at younger ages with substantive playing time and he actually wants to improve the situation and feels that would best be done with some data - not generalizations of, "it doesn't look like all the kids get substantive playing time" Are you upset because it's done on his phone or being done at all? The coaching staff SHOULD be measuring the team's playing time. It doesn't take any soccer knowledge to measure playing time, so it sounds like the perfect job for an assistant coach with no soccer knowledge. If you are getting upset at the sheer prospect that someone is measuring your child's playing time, then based upon your previous comments, it sounds like your daughter is getting too much playing time and will be hurt by the coach's analysis when he goes to the DOC and says - these three players play the whole game and these three players only played 8 minutes. The DOC will say - that's not what we want at U10 and will talk to the head coach and playing time will be adjusted.
The dad-turned-assistant coach sounds like a bit of an ass and a potential cancer but for the time being I wouldn't sweat the app--just by being on a club team, your daughter's name and stats are gonna end up in apps and websites and whatnot. And PLEASE keep your feelings about his daughter to yourself.
Yeah, I know….I was mostly responding to Volk’s advice to grab you kid and leave the club… But back on topic, there seems to be two separate issues… First, this idea that this parent/assistant coach apparently weaseled his way and his daughters way on to the team…as stated, this might be a source of concern….but then again, PW makes a strong counter argument that this might have be done with the best of intentions and that perhaps you, yourself, have your own agenda to protect…. The second one involves tracking playtime….why do you feel you need grant permission for an official of the team/club to keep/track playtime stats? Pretty standard stuff to track stats in sports, even youth sports….besides, making efforts to get everyone similar or equal playtime, even at U10 A level soccer, is good developmental soccer…
I'm in agreement with you pretty much, but I'm sympathetic to the OP's anxiety even if there might not be much "there" there on the face of it. I've been around the parents who weasel their way into a position on the sideline and it's usually not a good situation. I can understand why the OP is leery of this guy's motives. It's not what he's doing so much as why he might be doing it. That's not to say I think there's anything to be done about it--best to let it go. There's no concrete actions this guy has taken which merit any sort of response, and fretting about it or--worse--gossiping will just poison the sideline. And, again, leave the guy's daughter out of it. Youth sports has a bad way of bringing out the worst in parents, but generally it's out of a misguided effort to help a child who's done nothing wrong.
Agreed, but I don’t think the situation is very clear; the details are pretty vague…other than tracking PT stats no real particulars on what he’s [assistant coach] exactly done to be such an “ass” or a “pain”… The overreaction to someone keeping playtime stats is just as much a potential red flag as someone weaseling on or volunteering to help out with the team… Around my parts, a volunteer parent coach or assistant coach is quite common, even at the club level, so my first reaction isn’t to see anything in it necessarily…to be honest, a non-rec team without an assistant coach (even if just a parent) would be more weird to me….in my experience, running a team is at least a 3 person job, coach, assistant coach, team manager….
Well, I'm taking the OP at their word that the guy has indeed been a pain, so if you accept that, on top of having talked his way into the role without any qualifications or the head coach's knowledge, then it's...not troubling (I don't want to be dramatic) but certainly not great. But until this guy actually does something wrong or inappropriate, the OP should keep quiet and stay out of it.
Fair enough… All the superfluous drama aside, I am still curious to hear why the OP (or anyone) has such a problem with the tracking of playtime…what is it that is so troubling/bothersome about it?
On the face of it--nothing. It's pretty innocuous and objectively is no threat at all. Years ago we had a father--a real sweet guy, Hispanic contractor who would come to games straight from whatever job he was working on. He would do his best to make small talk with other parents and talk tactics and whatnot (in a very supportive, non-judgmental way) although his attempts were usually thwarted by his extremely rudimentary English. Anyway, he had little notepad he always kept in one of the side pockets of his paint-splattered work pants; and every single time any one of our kids scored, he would diligently record the score by their name. No idea why he was doing it or what (if anything) he planned to do with his meticulous records of our U-12 team, but nobody was ever troubled in the slightest by this. It was endearing. Mostly because this guy obviously was just really proud of his son for being on a travel team and this was his little way of supporting the team. So...I think the issue here (and again, I'm giving the OP the benefit of the doubt as far as the facts) is that this guy came out of nowhere, talked his way into a coaching position even though he had no qualifications or ties to the team, got his kid put on the team*, and now is (according to the OP) being a pain...and on top of things, has taken it upon himself to start tracking playing time. Given all the context--was foisted upon the coach, seems to have bullied his way onto the sideline in the first place--his motives for what he might want to use this information for could be questioned. Please understand--I don't think this is a big deal. I've already told the OP to let it go. Youth sports are full of parents like this guy; you just have to deal with them and move on. I'm absolutely on board with telling the OP to not get worked up and make too much of this. But I've been around similar situations and so I'm quite sympathetic. It is annoying at best. *Which, again--I don't judge other parents for doing what they think they need to do to help their kid. This, in and of itself, is something I would strongly advise the OP to get over and let go. His daughter is 9 years old and he's trying to give her an opportunity.
It exposes the lie in most youth soccer. USSF, USYS, state federations, most community clubs, rec clubs, rec leagues - have wording buried somewhere in their rules that "everyone should play %50 of a game". My particular state says below u12 everyone gets %50, and in the non-competitive travel divisions below u14 should get %50. My club says regardless of travel division everyone should get %50, as long as they show up for practice and aren't disciplinary issues. Few coaches actually do this. Everybody looks for weasel room. People tack on stuff like "everybody will play %50. practice behavior can affect playing time" so, the 10 year old that likes to talk about minecraft while waiting in line and starts his turn at hill sprints a couple of seconds late suddenly finds themselves losing a "shift". Or maybe "your dd didn't play as much as the other kids, she looked tired". Ask a player "are you tired" they might say yes. Ask the same player "are you ready to go in" they also might say yes. Usually when the A team is winning, the parents let it slide - everybody wants to be on a winning team, right? But you get an A team that is struggling, suddenly people get upset they drove 2 hours to sit in the rain and watch their child play 5 minutes in yet another loss with a -5 goal differential. I've been in the admin side of my club for 5 years now, I see the tryout results, I see the coach provided evals. Kids with an average coach, that play, get better. Kids with fantastic coaches, that don't play, stagnate or get worse. There is no shocked like the parent of an "A" team kid that hasn't played much in the 2 years leading up to high school when they find "B" team kids starting freshman/JV game over their "A" teamer. But all of this is hard to enforce, especially at the all volunteer clubs. My club usually has 6 home games a weekend, spread over 2 - 3 physical locations. Nobody can get to every game and track that the playing time guidelines/rules are being followed. It usually doesn't get dealt with until a parent complains. Even then, coaches are hard to find, you don't want to drive away a volunteer, more compromises are made, etc. Imagine a parent showing up with evidence. One shock that comes close to the sparsely used A teamer parent seeing B teamers faring better in high school are club admins and coaches faced with hard evidence that things are not being done as advertised This parent's lack of soccer knowledge isn't the danger. They're a Sneezy in a room where the other dwarves are building a house of cards (I've exaggerated some, most coaches line the 10 year olds up for hill sprints in one big group that runs at the same time - no lines/laps right ? )
So far, barring a counter explanation, is how I pretty much how I see it as well… The only reason, I can see, to be worked up over someone monitoring playtime is because is they know their kid is benefiting from an inequitable share of it…. My kid has, especially the last few years, seen more than his fair share of playtime…so much so, that overuse injuries and mental fatigue, have been issues/concerns…. And whereas, it’s hard to casually monitor the playtime of everyone else’s kid, I am certainly aware that there have been kids along the way who were not getting their fair share…. If someone had monitored PT in order to even things out a bit, I wouldn’t have had a problem with it…
The only caveat here is that it's the newly more-or-less-self-appointed assistant coach who's taken it upon himself to do so, apparently without the knowledge of the head coach he supposedly works with. That suggests an agenda.
Aren't you assuming the HC doesn't know about it? It's possible the HC said "here, do this" (or agreed when the assistant coach asked about it) to keep the assistant coach out of his hair during the game. Regardless of why he's doing it, I also don't see a problem. The OP even said "I was floored to see my daughter's name in an app without my permission." I wonder why he thinks he needs to give permission for that? If we were talking softball or baseball, the names would be go into a stats book, I'm guessing without asking parents about it. Why does it matter it's in an app? Sorry, I just don't see the problem.
An agenda to do what? To make sure everyone is getting equitable and fair playtime? EVEN IF this “less-self-appointed assistant coach” is the biggest asshole in the world, don’t the facts speak for themselves? If there isn’t a playtime issue, the stats will prove that out…however, if there are PT issues, then why does the messenger or source really matter? Given the scarcity of details, I would say there are a lot of caveats that could be bought to bear…
Further facts: this asst coach went behind the head coaches back to complain to the DOC about PT. He used a PT app, without the head coach knowing about it. Head coach got reprimanded from the DOC about the PT issue. If he were an adult he should have approached the Coach himself with concerns. Finally, all of these issues have surfaced a few days before our biggest tournament of the year. We do have a Club policy that you play to win tournaments with your best players and PT is not guaranteed for tournaments only. We are now the one club in our program who must dole out even playing time for this tournament b/c of one snitch who couldnt have an adult conversation. We were also placed in the toughest bracket by the DOC as she was under the assumption that our best players would receive the most PT and we would be fairly challenged. She has since changed her tune b/c of this "asst coach."