OSI Referee of the Year

Discussion in 'Referee' started by chrisrun, Oct 31, 2007.

  1. chrisrun

    chrisrun Member

    Jan 13, 2004
    Orlando, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Finalists are Brian Hall, Jair Marrufo, and Alex Prus.

    USSF is really pushing their full time refs. The headline is "Jair Marrufo Finalist for OSI Referee of the Year", and the text is:

    "Jair Marrufo, one of U.S. Soccer's four full-time referees, was named as a finalist for Major League Soccer's OSI Referee of the Year award. The other two candidates for the award are U.S. Soccer and former World Cup referee Brian Hall and Alex Prus."

    http://ussoccer-referees.blogspot.com/2007/10/jair-marrufo-finalist-for-osi-referee.html
     
  2. bluedevils

    bluedevils Member

    Nov 17, 2002
    USA
    I think it would be neat if USSF awarded this award, or perhaps a similar award, to referees NOT working in MLS. Perhaps only referees who cracked into the professional divisions in the current year would be eligible. Would be nice to see a hardworking, promising, up-and-coming referee be acknowledged. A little recognition for the non-FIFA, non-MLS guys would be nice.

    And no, I don't think I would be a finalist for such an award. Not this year, anyway ;)
     
  3. Wizardscharter

    Wizardscharter New Member

    Jul 25, 2001
    Blue Springs, MO
    Anyone but the confrontational Brian Hall. It's a travesty that this egotistical, angry jerk is even allowed to be mentioned in the top 3. Regardless if Hall is the guy who makes the most right calls, many of his calls are done so with such bile and offrontiveness that he is an embarassment to the game.
     
  4. intechpc

    intechpc Member

    Sep 22, 2005
    West Bend, WI
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So when was it that you met Brian Hall? Because unless you've met him personally, that's an awful lot of insulting and judgemental language to spew about someone you don't even knokw. What puts you in a position to make those judgements?
     
  5. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Marrufo deserves this, although Prus has also had a fine, if inconspicuous, year. I don't think Hall has had nearly a good enough year to be considered as a finalist, honestly.
     
  6. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm saying this as someone who, a couple years ago, didn't even think this guy deserved to be in MLS. But, from what I saw, I think Toledo had the best year.

    I would say that, again from what I saw, Prus had a good year, too. I'd also note that Stott has always been one of our best and I've heard far fewer complaints about him this year than in the past (but I also haven't seen him work much personally, so can't really judge).

    The reason, of course, that Toledo didn't get nominated for--and won't win--this award, is that, repeatedly over the course of the year, he showed red cards for SFP and VC. Showing the most red cards, especially for the "more judgmental" calls of SFP and VC, is never going to make you a favorite with players, coaches, the GMs and media, who are the people
     
  7. tmaker

    tmaker Member

    Nov 24, 2003
    Seattle
    I imagine that had something to do with numerous Toledo games finding their way into USSF's "Points of Emphasis" videos...

    Toledo has improved noticeably over the past two years. Prus still fails to impress me, and Marrufo makes me itch when I watch him, though he too has improved. Just not enough for me.
     
  8. ref47

    ref47 Member

    Aug 13, 2004
    n. va
    we'll see how marrufo does tonight on dc-chi match.
     
  9. ref47

    ref47 Member

    Aug 13, 2004
    n. va
    great match for marrufo. brave call at the end to disallow the tying goal. he sure can cover ground quickly.
     
  10. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm in the minority amongst the Chicago fans, but I thought other than the missed PK call he had a good match.
     
  11. andymoss

    andymoss BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 4, 2007
    Nashville, TN
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I don't think I've ever seen Jair have what I would consider a good game. Last night was another that was getting away from him at times and he let it go. Just before the two Chicago goals, it was getting very testy and needed reigning in, yet he didn't seem aware of what was building.

    After the second goal, there was a perfect opportunity for him to settle things down when a Chicago player went down in his own defensive third, apparently injured after being fouled. Instead of stopping play to take care of the injury and to take some of the sting out of things, he waved play-on. Stop it man! Grab yourself a breath. It's been an insane 8 or 10 minutes and we all know about the first-five-after-a-goal, etc. He wouldn't have been breaking up a DC attack; Chicago was coming out with the ball.

    Even having seen the replay, I can't see where he comes up with SFP at the end. Even he considers the caution first! What did the send-off serve? What did it buy him at that point?

    Brian Hall? Never met the guy, but he was at Nationals and I've spoken with people who were there. Seems he is a different person when he's on the field than he is when he's not working, and I have to admit, I'd be pretty hyped up if I were out there in the middle on some of these matches!

    Prus? I wonder if he can hear yet? His ears must still be ringing after last night!

    And I agree with BlueDevils; give it to an up-and-comer which will serve as incentive for our brightest and best talents to push to that next level.

    Oh, and where can I get one of those OSI warm-up jackets Alex had on last night?!
     
  12. Ref Flunkie

    Ref Flunkie Member

    Oct 3, 2003
    New Hudson, MI
    He had a great match IMO. Why would the Chicago fans be complaining?!? Yeah he missed the PK call, but that is the problem with the lines and having to judge when you are 20 yards back. I'm more disappointed the AR did not see that the foul was in the area (I think I saw Marrufo looking over for help after he called the foul). Funny thing is, I didn't really see the Chicago players arguing THAT much over it. Perhaps it was because they were up 2-0.
     
  13. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What does it serve him? Other than enforcing the Laws, nothing. Yellow cards can be remedial, but red cards are supposed to be punitive. That tackle had absolutely no chance to play the ball, was a flying lunge, and it landed in the back heel/ankle of the Chicago player. What if he gives Dyachenko a yellow and then Dyachenko (or his team, at all) scores a goal in the remaining 30 seconds or so? Then what? That was a textbook red card foul and good for Marrufo; he resisted the urge, which we visually saw when he went to his top pocket, of giving the yellow card because there wasn't much time left and it wouldn't "get" him anything. You could almost see it click in his head of "what am I doing? that's a red!" when he started to point at Dyachenko and reach for the back pocket. It was an absolutely correct call.

    You can't and with good reason. Few things were more annoying --and insulting to MLS referees--around the referee tent than random referees buying the MLS jackets from OSI in the first few years of the OSI/MLS contract and showing up with them at tournaments while doing nothing to dispel the created myth that they were an "MLS Referee." Someone--I presume USSF--put a stop to it a while back.
     
  14. IASocFan

    IASocFan Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 13, 2000
    IOWA
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I thought the DFK was the right call. The keeper was on the line and put his foot forward - which would have put the foul outside the penalty area!
     
  15. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I saw about 65 minutes or so of the match so I can't assess the entirety of last night's game. I will say that, yes, there were a couple patches where it looked like Marrufo was "losing it." That being said, think about the intensity of this match! Something would have been wrong with the two teams if it didn't look like, at certain points, the referee was really tested. Moreover, Marrufo never did actually lose it, which is a testament to him. From what I saw, I think he did very well. He didn't, in the heat of the moment, fall for a couple dives that could have easily been called (Olsen and Blanco both come to mind) and I thought he used his cards very well. Plus, he got the critical call right at the end of the game--the no-goal call. Whether it was for the push or the handling (and the announcers assumed it was the handling, but other than there fixation on that there's no evidence to suggest one way or the other which it was), he made a gutsy, correct decision in stoppage time in a hostile environment (about as hostile as it can get for a domestic US match). And then he had the courage on the late tackle to show the red card, as well.

    The only potential big blemish, of course, is the PK/non-PK. First, as I said on the Chicago boards, I still want to see a replay I can pause. From ESPN's camera, it looked to be inside the area by about a foot or so, but it was still really close so I'd like to see a replay where I can pause it at the exact moment of contact.

    Moreover, when it's that close and the referee is running in from a 90 degree angle, it's basically a guess for him. So, in the interest of trying to get something out of this--as a referee, what do you do there insofar as consultation with your AR? (for those that haven't seen the play, it's a clear, clear foul by the keeper, right at the top of the box--no DOGSO, but a yellow for tactical foul) Marrufo needed no help calling the foul, but the location was very iffy. We don't have the luxury of headsets, so how do you use your AR? At all? Do you visually go over to him? Do you wait to see where he goes (stay put or walk to corner)? And if he stays put, does that necessarily mean he thinks it's outside the box? What if he just doesn't know either? It's an interesting situation. Yes, there are technically mechanics to follow, but in a real world "bang-bang" like this, they don't really work that well.
     
  16. Ref Flunkie

    Ref Flunkie Member

    Oct 3, 2003
    New Hudson, MI
    Again, this is what I saw happen AFTER the foul. While the guy was on the ground and just after the caution was issued, I think I saw Marrufo look over and motion to the AR asking if it was in our out of the area. Apparently, either the AR did not know, or he confirmed Marrufo's initial decision. I think he did everything he could to try and figure out if it was in our out of the area (short of going over to chat with the AR, which in this case, I don't think is necessary).
     
  17. andymoss

    andymoss BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 4, 2007
    Nashville, TN
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    SFP as defined in the ATR:

    It is serious foul play when a player uses violence (excessive force; formerly defined as "disproportionate and unnecessary strength") when challenging for the ball on the field against an opponent.

    I'm going from my memory of the incident, and I've slept since I last saw it, but (I think) by the time the contact was made, the ball had gone, but when Dyachenko started the tackle, the ball was playable. It was most certainly a foul. It was absolutely a desparation tackle. But was it SFP?

    That said, it does meet the criteria:​

    Tackling from behind during which a foul is committed.​

    and​

    It is also serious foul play when a player commits any tackle which endangers the safety of an opponent. In this case, the tackle may be from behind, from the side, or the front.​

    I was being facetious. I don't and wouldn't wear anything that I haven't earned and fully realize that the lofty heights of the top matches are beyond me, mainly due to old father time and a late start, and I'm certainly not one of those guys who shows up at a tournament wearing something like that and gets all vague when asked about it.
     
  18. Ref Flunkie

    Ref Flunkie Member

    Oct 3, 2003
    New Hudson, MI
    Ok I just came across this in the CNNSI recap of the match:

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/soccer/11/01/bc.soc.mls.fire.united.ap/index.html

    Here is a quote from the Fire coach:

    Osorio's biggest complaint was that the Fire were not awarded a penalty kick -- and that a red card wasn't given -- when United goalkeeper Troy Perkins tripped Carr at the edge of the penalty area in the second half. Osorio said he's had trouble adjusting to the quality of the officiating in the league.

    "I just can't hold it any longer," Osorio said. "It's really, really bad. ... The one thing I know for a fact we have to improve is the refereeing. Hopefully they will not fine me for saying that."


    I'm sorry, but I am really starting to get fed up with this crap. No other professional league would let their coaches get away saying this stuff. Nevermind the fact, that he is utterly wrong about the red card.
     
  19. KidRef

    KidRef New Member

    Jun 27, 2000
    California
    He'll be fined. I'd be frustrated about it not being called a pk too. It definitely wasn't a red card though as the player was going away from goal. Good red card at the end, very clear late, cynical, excessive force.
     
  20. chrisrun

    chrisrun Member

    Jan 13, 2004
    Orlando, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And the winner is Hall.

    http://www.mlsnet.com/news/mls_news.jsp?ymd=20071105&content_id=127771&vkey=news_mls&fext=.jsp

     
  21. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Must....bite....tongue....


    I will say I don't think he had a good year at all and that I was surprised he was even a finalist.
     
  22. oldmanreferee

    oldmanreferee Member

    Dec 28, 2005
    Mountain View, ca
    I thought this was the thread on the MLS referee of the year not on the game of last week.
     
  23. Pierre Head

    Pierre Head Member+

    Dec 24, 2005
    But he is correct in his assessment of the refereeing overall. He is just the latest in a long line of knowlegable people to make this assertion. It has been going on for years, and run by the same people, who just keep putting out the same officials year in year out. It has been a major embarrassment to the US referee program. It is time for a wholesale change in how the officiating is managed, how the referees are selected and trained, and how they are assessed.
    That being said, there are one or two who do a good job overall,
    and try not to compromise their own principles and standards to fit in
    with league dictates, as far as possible to avoid getting dropped. One of these of course is Brian Hall. Why is he not one of the full-time referees employed by US-Soccer?
     
  24. Spaceball

    Spaceball Member

    Jun 15, 2004
    Brian has passed the mandatory retirement age for FIFA. Therefore, he is now a national referee and not FIFA. The goal of the full-timers program is to develop referees for FIFA tournaments...namely the World Cup. Since Brian is no longer eligible, my guess is that he was not considered for this. If the program started 10 years ago, I bet he would have been first on the list.
     
  25. Ref Flunkie

    Ref Flunkie Member

    Oct 3, 2003
    New Hudson, MI
    This is a matter of opinion, one which I happen to disagree with.


    Whether right or wrong, you CAN NOT say this publicly. If he has a beef with the referees, take it to the league. Again, no other professional sports league would have this going on and fine the guy $50 (or whatever). I'm curious, does anyone know if a fine in fact resulted from this?
     

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