Ok, Jordan Morris, is he the deal?

Or you can look at another very athletic Sounder's youth team product who left college early, DeAndre Yedlin.

Without a doubt Charlie Davies time at Hammarby helped him develop as a player. Rubin has largely matched Morris' college production, while being 1.5 years younger, in the Eredivisie. The biggest factors players need to look at when choosing a club overseas are its development culture and potential for playing time.

 

Gunn is an excellent coach, very much on a par with Bradley, who was obviously an excellent college coach himself way back when.

More importantly, because Morris is Stanford's star player, he is the top priority of the coaching staff. Contrast that with many young pros who are afterthoughts in training. College soccer has many problems, but it isn't nearly such a bad situation as some people are making it out to be.

 

Sure, we could point to players who've succeeded and failed on various roads, but I find it hard to look at our player pool and conclude that going pro early was any kind of silver bullet. To my mind, Morris turning pro at 20 or 21 or even 22 is very unlikely to be a determining factor in how good he becomes. The factors I think are important are to (a) wait until he's personally ready to be a pro, and (b) find a pro environment that's right for him.

Fortunately for him, Klinsmann has positioned him where a good pro opportunity is likely to present itself - that's a sharp contrast to where he was when he started college and couldn't even crack our U20 squad.

 

Donovan is an interesting case study - Golden boot winner in the U17 tournament. Not sure how much his time as a young player in Germany helped him. One could argue that if had not spent that time being miserable in Germany and instead had a year or two of college experience he might not have been retiring to take college classes at a young age. While we of course will never know, you certainly have to admit it is a credible argument.

Bradley is also an a very unusual case is he was basically playing for a former college coach with a very vested interest (his dad) instead of going to college. Not exactly the same as sending some green kid with a bunch of sharks to fend for himself. But clearly a few players have done well and certainly more than a few heralded kids that went the college route haven't panned out either. The point what works for one kid, won't necessarily work for another.

Is that because they are truly better or simply because picking a kid that has signed a pro contract was the equivalent of giving your computer business to IBM in the old days? Arial Lassiter was a complete nobody because he chose not to play for an academy team, was a good but far from special attacking player suddenly passed about 50 kids simply because he played a few games in the second tier of mediocre Scandinavian league.

We also disagree on here as well. If I'm the coach building for the future of the team, I want to spend my time developing players that will play on the team, not mediocre kids with delusional dreams.

These players also grew up in a very different environment where a team like Barcelona is on the first 6 pages of the sports section and there are UEFA licensed coaches everywhere you look and exposure to professional training at age 10. With all this said, I have a similar position that kids in general should seek out the highest level where they will get actually playing time. Where we differ is that I feel each kid is different. The same training program that is ideal for one kid will destroy another. The environment that a young man like Michael Bradley might find to be invigorating might seem soul crunching to a different kid. If a kid chooses a different path it might be for a lot of reasons that have very little to do with their long term ambition.

 

The argument I've made is a bit beyond your understanding. If I described an attack as primitive, clearly I'm not suggesting it is an ideal environment to learn the game. Instead, I'm suggesting that using a single metric as the basis of ambition is completely foolish.

 

Not in the least. It is your lack of reading comprehension that causes you to jump to such ridiculous conclusions I'm just suggesting that the person making $48K might be doing so because doing so for other reasons getting the largest possible salary out of school. For example of a low paid Stanford grad would be Adam Jahn who chose make $35K playing MLS soccer than take advantage of his 3.36 GPA in Management Science and Engineering. Joe Sophia 3.96 GPA at UCLA (another very good school) did a similar thing that decided to drastically change his earning potential by quitting soccer and taking a job at a management consulting company. My guess is that if Jahn, quit MLS he would could likely get a similar increase. In contrast most kids that get a degree in nursing are going after a very specific career path with limited upside long term earning potential.

 

Perhaps when Bradley was just starting, but they are not in the same league now. I can't comment because I never saw those teams play. Gunn's teams play very sound defense and I've never seen harder working teams. But the style of play was very basic even compared to other teams in the conference.

I'm sure this is the case. This has got to be a recruiting bonanza for a program that needs very little help so I think it is safe to assume the coaching staff has an extremely vested interest in doing everything they can to make him as successful as possible.

 

I'd certainly agree with those two. But an even bigger issue is how well the individual player will adjust to the environment.

 

Let me guess, you are not known for your "tact?" Please, save the rude comments as they make you appear like you are trying to be a keyboard warrior.

What is even your point? It appears we are more or less talking parallel to each other, and it seems to me that you became defensive when I said you are just speculating. So let's back the train up....

My point: A Stanford degree isn't gong to guarantee a high paying job; although, I'll admit that it helps. And that actually knowing what someone wants to be, with some direction, is more helpful than someone who just gets a degree and hopes that the name on the sheet of paper is going to answer their career and financial goals.

If you think differently, so be it.

 

Here's a question...

How was this kid not good enough for our U20's in the 2013 cycle?

 

The coaches saw others (not trying to be a d!ck here) as being ahead of him. Having evaluated hundreds of kids over the years, there is no perfect system for correctly assessing prospects, and I'm sure I've erred in my placement of many of these players simply because I didn't have enough time to better judge them both individually and within the group.

 

Good question. Could also ask the same thing about Cameron Porter and Khiry Shelton.

Is the USSF, or maybe MLS DA's, going overboard on dribblers? Are we ignoring the run makers? It certainly looks like it.

 

I have a feeling Kinsmann's 'word' isn't as strong as many tend to believe, atleast when it comes to 'control' over the youth ranks/player selection.

Tab has come out and said Klinsmann has NO say so with player selection.

 

He was on the very young side for the 2013 cycle, and was a "fast riser." He was invited to the Toulon tournament right before squad selection. Alonso Hernandez of Monterrey was also invited for the first time to that competition, and he was selected for the squad instead of Jordan. I have a feeling if there was another couple of months until the World Cup roster announcement, Jordan would have been named.

In other words Jordan Morris was a victim of the youth soccer structure in which we put players into silos based on birthdays. {This isn't just a US problem.} He was on the real young side for the 2013 U20 World Cup, and is only a couple of months too old to be eligible for the 2015 U20 World Cup.

When you do the analysis you can provide plenty of other examples of this issue. People don't think of it in this way (because Rongen-bashing is a hobby for some).................but Neven Subotic is really exhibit A. On the REALLY young side for one cycle, and only a month too old for the subsequent one. He's a December '88.

 

I remember watching those games and he was just as he is. He was fast, could run onto balls hit long, but struggled with the nuances of soccer. Connecting one touch, two touch with his teammates through midfield to maintain possession. Scoring vs a depleted Mexico team doesn't now mean he is the second coming or he was always effective down to U12s.

 

True, and also a victim of the structure that judges players by where they play instead of an assessment of their potential. Turning pro didn't make Yedlin or Roldan suddenly lightyears better, but it got them call-ups.

 

Well, I'd say that was a "C" Mexican team, at best. But yeah, he looked good. Definitely like he belonged. And being able to finish is a surprisingly under-appreciated skill.

 

Big difference is that medicine is still mostly based on merit and ability. The ability to get into those top-paying tracks in law or business is based more on who you know and/or are related to. And in law these days, even getting into the middle-income tracks is dependent on your contacts and politics.

 

And that seems to be what sets this kid apart according to some observers.

 

I don't disagree with what you're saying. Pursuing soccer as a career in this country is still a difficult proposition.
And we're talking about a kid here who wasn't called into our U17s, and was a fringe player for our U18s and U20s. He's only had three U23 appearances. So he's now gotten capped at the full USMNT level more than he has at any USYNT age group. So two years ago it would make sense for the kid to commit to Stanford and go there for his freshman year. That's a great decision. I just think that the industry is now telling him that he's ready to "go pro."

I have more of a problem with Klinsmann calling this player up from the NCAAs. I completely agree with what Taylor Twellman said at halftime of their MLS game this weekend. He might as well have been reading my posts on Big Soccer!!!! If this was Europe (Twellman gave England as an example)......................it would be laughable for them to call up a player from the equivalent of the NCAAs. [Twellman said the NCAAs were 3rd/4th division here.] And of course, like Twellman, I've been talking about the hypocrisy of Klinsmann demanding players challenge themselves at higher levels at the same time he calls up Morris (and Ibarra for that matter). From where I sit, if you're calling up Jordan Morris from the NCAAs what you're saying is that are no players in MLS that you're interested in. And if that's true, I'm very concerned about our scouting efforts. We're about to lose Tesho Akindele to Canada. Now, I don't think Tesho Akindele is the 2nd coming of Zlatan Ibrahimovic. However, he's a talented young forward/winger. I don't know what his ceiling is going to be, and I doubt Klinsmann does either. We'll also probably lose winger Ethan Finlay to Canada if we don't bring him in shortly. While we're effing around with Brad Evans for some reason, young left back Moises Hernandez just bolted for Guatemala. Why are we doing this? Moises Hernandez isn't the second coming of Cafu (Heck, he may be the 4th best left back from Texas after Garza, Shea, and Klute), but he was worth taking a look at. Anybody see his gorgeous ball to Castillo for a goal this weekend? I bet you Klinsmann didn't. I guess I'm a person that's grown weary of Klinsmann's act. The average American player in MLS is quite good. Give them a chance. Call up Kellyn Rowe. Call up Teal Bunbury. Call up Lamar Neagle. Call up Benny Feilhaber. Call up Harrison Shipp. Why did we stop calling up Chad Marshall???? Have some effing faith in the MLS player. They won't let us down!!!

Anyway, I started ranting and couldn't get out!!!! I apologize.

 

I see what you're saying in the first paragraph, but I think your second paragraph undermines your point, to some degree. This is what I see:

• Jordan Morris is a fringe USYNT player and in the SS academy.
• He is also smart, from a well-educated family, and chooses to go to Stanford rather than turn pro.
• He has a solid freshman year at Stanford (6g & 7a in 21 matches).
• Klinsmann plucks him from obscurity and gives him a shot with the USMNT, initially calling him in in August 2014
• He has a solid sophomore season at Stanford (4g & 6a in 15 matches).
• He continues to get call-ups, and gets two sub appearances. He shows nothing particularly compelling in those short sub appearances.
• As @Clint Eastwood (and Taylor Twellman) notes, anywhere else in the world, calling up a player with his resume would be seen as insanity.
  
• He gets called in and gets the start against Mexico. In that match he does very little of note until he scores the goal. Perhaps his best run of the night, he uses his speed on the counter-attack, but shows his lack of maturity by, essentially, running himself off the end of the field.
• He scores his goal by getting the ball on a lucky bounce, and then making the most of his 1v1 opportunity to nutmeg he keeper.

Based on all of that, I think if you looked at the probability that Morris is going to be a break-out star for the USMNT, it is very, very low. It could happen, and it could be a great story, but let's not fool ourselves into believing that it already has happened.

Back to whether or not Morris should stay at Stanford, I don't see how JK anointing him changes his potential in any way. His college performance has been very solid, but not that of a world-beater. His performance with the USMNT is pretty inconclusive. What you have is one guy (known for his strange and uneven assessment of talent) saying that Morris is better than most MLS players. If I'm Morris and his family, I'm not sure I'd take that assessment at face value and leave Stanford.

 

In this discussion of contrasting career options and potential earnings is any mention of the unique career profile of the former professional athlete. Morris walking away from Stanford to go pro is not the same thing as a random 20 year old walking away from college inasmuch as ex-jocks often have more options, even beyond coaching and broadcasting. For example, investment banks and other fortune 500 companies love to hire ex-jocks. One with a an excellent educational pedigree, even better.

Even if Morris were to step away and amount to nothing more than a solid MLS pro, his post-career options would be manifold. Seth Stammler, a solid but unspectacular pro is now working at Morgan Stanley's muni bond desk after retiring at 30 to get his MBA from Booth.* A number of the 1980 Olympic hockey team wound up in finance. Hey, even the much maligned new GM of my current club did a stint with JPMorgan after his playing career.

*While Seth may have been able to get into to Chicago's b school on merit alone, admissions officers are always looking for good stories.

 

I happen to think that of the U23 age group Jordan Morris is near the top of the heap. [Consider the other forwards we've been calling up to the U23s of late. Its not an awe-inspriring group] And calling an NCAA player up to USYNTs like the U23s is fine. We just released a roster for an upcoming U23 game against Mexico and a player named Sam Strong was called in. Who the hell knows who Sam Strong is? Not me, but if they want to call him up to a U23 team....................go for it.

There's a difference between a youth team and the senior USMNT preparing for the Gold Cup. What calling up Jordan Morris tells me is that there are no other MLS forwards Klinsmann really thinks much of with regards to the Gold Cup. So he threw up his hands and just invited an NCAA player. I just don't get it. I watch a couple of MLS games a weekend, and I see performances that I really like. What about Teal Bunbury's 2nd half performance yesterday.......................?? What about Khiry Shelton's nice assist?

It's like he's looking for a "World Class" forward in MLS, doesn't see one, and just moves on to an NCAA player. We don't have Neymar in our pool of MLS players. We all know that. But that doesn't mean there isn't talent there. It doesn't mean that we don't have players capable of helping us win the Gold Cup.