Nostalgia - A Yearning for the Past

Discussion in 'Manchester United: History' started by TomClare, Aug 29, 2006.

  1. TomClare

    TomClare Member

    Aug 25, 2006
    Houston, Texas
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    “Nostalgia might dwell on things past, but it makes them seem as next-door neighbours, rather than visitors from a distant land. There's much to be said for it. And the wondrous quality of nostalgia is that it is unchallengeable - like beauty - it rests in the eye of the beholder!”



    I find that phrase such a wonderful statement. As we grow older, we do become more and more nostalgic. It is a fact of life. I make no bones about it, readily admitting that as far as football and Manchester United are concerned, I do certainly yearn for things past. Whenever I return to Old Trafford, I return to the seat of my sentimentality, and all my nostalgia comes flooding back. Old Trafford has played such a huge part in my life, as it has and still does, with thousands of supporters just like me. Ordinary, every day Joes, who have a love of the game of football, and a deep, intrinsic love of Manchester United Football Club. Yes, I did say Football Club.

    Unfortunately, television, and certainly the advent of the Premiership and the monies that Sky television has poured obscenely into football, have slowly but surely destroyed a way of life. In 1992, the Football Association got into bed with the Premier League. Not for the good of the beautiful game mind you, but as an underhand blow to the Football League, and under the guise of supposedly enhancing the prospects of the England team at International level. Lurking in the background like Fagin looking for victims for the ‘Artful Dodger’ was an almost bankrupt satellite television company. They dangled the bait, and like a couple of starving piranhas, both the Association and the Premiership gorged on what was on offer. Football was never the same again – and sadly, in my opinion, never ever will be.

    My love and affection for the game was stimulated by my Grandfather. He was around when Newton Heath changed their name to Manchester United. He saw United win their first ever title in 1908, their first F.A. Cup in 1909, and then the title again in 1911. From 1911 onwards, he had to wait some 37 years, enduring some really harsh times, during which the club was relegated several times, almost descended into the Third Division, and struggled so much financially that they almost went bust, before he saw them taste real success again.

    As a young boy, he would take me into his parlour, and we would sit in his wooden rocking chair in front of the old coal fire. Myself sat on his knee, and him with a pot of strong tea in one hand, and his arm circled around my waist as the firelight reflected onto the walls, casting out our long shadows. He would relate to me the history of the Club. His eyes sparkled, just like stars on a cold, clear, dark night, as he spoke so passionately about the thing he loved and revered so much – Manchester United Football Club. He would regale me about Bank Street, Ernie Magnall, the Davies family, Duckworth, Roberts and Bell. He told me of the scandal that brought players over from Manchester City and sounded the arrival of the legendary Billy Meredith at United. He spoke of Harold Halse, the Turnbull brothers, and wee Georgie Wall. “That was some team” he would tell me. He told me about the way that the P.F.A. was formed and founded, the move from Bank Street to Old Trafford in 1910, the mystery surrounding “Knocker” West, and how the players went off to France and the Somme during World War 1, and how many of them never returned home again.

    The lean times after World War 1 were explained and he told me about Jackie Mew, Jackie Silcock, “Clarrie” Hilditch, Neil McBain, big Frank Barson, and then about his all time favourite player, Joe Spence. I can still hear him shouting “Give it to Joe!” as he imitated the crowd at Old Trafford on a Saturday afternoon. He enthused about James Gibson taking over a sinking ship, and how he stopped it from floundering on the rocks, and set it in calm seas once again. He told me about the part that dear old Walter Crikmer and Louis Rocca played just before World War II, and how just after it, they were instrumental in bringing Sir Matt on board – and all the time he that would talk to me, my eyes would be opened wide in awe. Whenever he had finished, my reply to him would always be; “tell me again, Grandad!” He never ever refused.

    I recall those days emotionally during my quiet times, and I recall that he instilled into me that football was not all about winning. “You have to be able to lose to understand how to win” was one of his stock phrases. He was scrupulously fair, and he taught me to respect opposing teams and their achievements. Making friends in the game was so important to him, as was the way that football was played. He didn’t mind losing as long as players had given their all – if United were second best on the day, but they had played the way the game was meant to be played, and had given of their best – he was happy. The Club and the way it conducted matters was also important to him. He adored what Sir Matt and Jimmy brought into the Club, and the foundations that they laid. He was so proud of what they achieved and where they were going as a Club. On the Sunday after Munich, we wept together at Mass for those seven players, the journalists, passengers and crew, that were already lost, and for those that still lay broken in the hospital in Munch, and we rejoiced for those that had survived.

    He had great time for Harold Hardman, the then Chairman, and always told me that the Club was in good hands as long as we had people like him and Sir matt at the helm. He believed passionately that the Club would rise again, and was so delighted just five years later when they won the F.A. Cup after beating Leicester City at Wembley. In 1965 he was ecstatic that the Club had won the Championship again, and he eulogized over young George Best, Denis Law and Bobby Charlton. But he reckoned that without the solidity of Bill Foulkes, and the guile and craft of Pat Crerand, United would never have got across the finishing line.

    Sadly, Grandad was never to see his dream of United conquering Europe fulfilled, for he passed away in October of 1966 and there was a big void left in my life. We had loved the game, loved United, and had laughed together when they won, and despaired when they lost. We had both felt part of “the family”, felt that we belonged, felt part of the everyday business of the Club. The directors, players, management, and staff, had a close affinity with the fans and the community, and there was a feel good factor all around – we all felt what we were – Manchester United, and were all so proud of it. Nothing, and nobody was bigger than the Club. When United bled, we all bled. This carried on into the Seventies and Eighties, when we were all there through the lean times, but we still laughed and cried, sang, and were still United.

    Football grounds really are the vaults of our memories, and whenever I return to Old Trafford these days, as I sit there, the images of my past return so readily, then fade and reassemble like some giant kaleidoscope. I often sit and wonder if the present modern day fan will ever feel what I feel? How will they pass on their nostalgia on to their grandchildren? How will the likes of Martin Edwards, Peter Kenyon, David Gill, and the Glazers be remembered? One thing I can say for certain, is that they will never be remembered with same reverence as the Davies and Gibson families, nor in the same light as the likes of Louis Rocca and dear old Walter Crikmer.

    I do yearn for things past – the old ‘Stretty End, the Stretford and Scoreboard Paddocks. The times when Old Trafford was filled to the rafters with such a happy raucous band of supporters who roared the lads on in hail, rain, and snow. Were happy to go to Aberdeen, Plymouth, Workington, Carlisle, Hartlepool, on a cold, wet day or night. It’s a far cry from then to what we see inside Old Trafford today. An atmosphere so sanitized that you could fall asleep in it and not realize that you were actually at a football match! How many of those fans today really know anything about Manchester United and its history? One thing is for certain, and that is to messrs Gill, Humby, and the Three Stooges, the nostalgia mentioned herein will mean absolutely nothing at all to them. For them and many, many more of their ilk, football didn’t begin until 1992. For all their money, they still could not put a price on our nostalgia and memories, nor will they ever understand where those deep feelings emanate from. These people will never get it through their heads nor see the disenchantment that they and their like have brought to our clubs and to the game.

    The game is so out of date and out of touch with the fans, that the situation is becoming dangerous. The television people with their intrusive cameras have taken away a lot of the romance that used to be in the game of football. It has stopped people elaborating on past events and it is like a death to the imagination. As I see it, the future generations will never be able to wax lyrical or nostalgically about the game to their grandchildren, as my Grandfather did with me all those years ago. The people in the corridors of power should remember where the game came from. They have changed it all so dramatically during this past fifteen years, and more than at any time during its history. Greed and avariciousness is the order of the day, and owners, directors, players, managers, agents etc are all ravenously plucking the goose that lays the golden egg. It will not live forever. When it dies, the predators and scavengers will disappear just as fast as when they arrived, and then the problem will be how to rehouse and reshape the game, whilst remembering to whom it really belongs. Those of us who grew up on the terraces had it by right – the big question is, will it ever be given back to us by design?
     
  2. GrodZilla

    GrodZilla Member

    Oct 5, 2005
    Stockholm
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Fantastic post and I hope that everyone reads it...
     
  3. -re-

    -re- New Member

    Jul 18, 2006
    A great read. Thanks for sharing Tom.
     
  4. SirManchester

    SirManchester Member+

    Apr 14, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    So how is it that when I talk about the capitalization of football, and about brand name comspiracies, nobody applauds? :p

    Just kidding, great read. And on a similar note, I watched the United history dvd again last night, and everytime it fills me with more and more pride. It's so full of history from the days of Newton Heath to that first title winning team to Outcasts FC, to the terrible 30's to our first FA Cup win, to Busby's first great team, to his babes, to his rebuilding of the club after tragedy, to the 70's and 80's which were difficult but our support was better than ever, and finally to Ferguson, Cantona and the treble. I just can't do it justice, but damnit I love Manchester United!
     
  5. sdotsom

    sdotsom Member+

    Manchester United
    Mar 27, 2005
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Its really hard to describe how I feel for United. It's a mix of love and obsession to be honest..I check this board and soccernet for news about the club before I even check the "real news". My uncle, who lived for some years in Salford, put me on to United in 1996, and I've pretty much followed since then. As I live in the states, its been a lot tougher to match the same emotions when a goal is scored that alot of you guys that see matches live or at the pub do. But I try...last semester when Rio put in the header against the Dippers I was screaming my head off at 10 in the morning here in STL after a drunken night before, so much so that the neighbors in my college apartment called the cops. the feelings for United really can't be described.
     
  6. mhtwins113

    mhtwins113 Member

    May 9, 2005
    Club:
    Lincoln City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Almost as much as you hate capitalism? :p
     
  7. SirManchester

    SirManchester Member+

    Apr 14, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    As much as I love fascism.
     
  8. Achtung

    Achtung Member

    Jul 19, 2002
    Chicago
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Personally, while there is certainly a longing for the past, I prefer to look at the positives of the machine. Being able to watch matches almost anywhere in the world, getting to know players even if you can't talk to them outside OT, and having a real obsession for the team that rivals anything you'd find in Salford. I think that while we all loath some of the aspects of the game you discussed, perhaps they are necessary evils in the long-term development and maturity of football. What matters is the game, the passion the fans have for it, and its ability to bring us together even if we have little to nothing else in common. I don't know that I ever see that going away.

    Kinda makes you wonder what kind of fuss was raised when professionalism, European matches, endorsements, and club sponsors were first introduced. :cool:
     
  9. xfactor857

    xfactor857 Member

    Sep 21, 2003
    Exactly. Whenever anything's popularity spirals out of control, it will inevitably "sell out".
     
  10. Numquam Moribimur

    May 30, 2005
    Club:
    Manchester United FC

    we talked about this 2 weeks ago ...there is not one team in the world i would trade our history for ..not one ! :)
     
  11. Dark Savante

    Dark Savante Member

    Apr 24, 2002
    Become the Tea Pot!!
    I smiled when I read this piece. I posted this:
    In this thread: https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=387837

    It would be interesting to hear your views on the subject of SAF, Tom, as you've lived through and experienced the greatness of the Busby era in its fullest and can probably give a slant no one else here could.

    I realise this piece is your thoughts and not a piece meant for argument. I will say though that along with the haze of the great days on the terrace you can't omit the bad that enciricled the game, namely, hooliganism and incidents like Bradford, Heysel. Hillsbrough and the rucks that could kick off between firms entangling and entrapping normal match going supporters into a melee they sometimes had no choice or option to avoid. The testosterone premise at the crux of your piece had its downside and made the game unattractive to many who started going as the 'Sky Generation' picked up. I think OT has gotten worse and worse by the year in terms of atmosphere - a consequence, but, where is the middle ground? When the place was booming, the terraces were 99% male, no families and nowhere near as many kids. Avoiding the politics and the trade-off in all of this, is it fair to say that the game gained mass appeal because the bad element who smuggled in with those who wanted to solely support the side, were phased out with the advent of Sky?

    Another point. This is an American board and I think it's fair to say that apart from ex-pats or emmigrated persons, probably about 1% of the non-British on this forum were following Utd before Sky helped make footy a global game. With the way things were back in the 80's juxtaposed into the here and now, the English game would have collapsed under the weight of disgrace. Something had to be done, and I think Hillsbrough was the catalyst. A new image was needed. Unfortunately, Murdoch was the profiteer, but a lot of what has happened was brought on by the unruly that forced change. I suppose I should leave Thatcher out of this.

    I think the true atmosphere is still there, unfortunately, you will rarely get it at OT, but if you attend away games it is there in abundance. The problem at OT, I have no idea how to change. The money men have made sure many of the old match goers were priced out or scared off going and with that, atmos' was lost. I doubt it will change, on that score you're right - it is a forgotten era, but a consequence of former misdemeanours from a forgotten time.
     
  12. TomClare

    TomClare Member

    Aug 25, 2006
    Houston, Texas
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    It's a natural thing is nostalgia. I agree that it is a wonderful thing to be able to watch games anywhere in the world, nobody in Manchester ever doubts the love and intensity of feeling that United fans from elsewhere have for the club. As I said in another thread, doesn't matter where you are from, once United is in your blood, it's there forever. However, I do have big issues with television, the Premier League and the price that has had to be paid for it, the way that football is being driven, and in the next few days, I'll try and explain why. Television has certainly taken away a lot of the romance that was in the game, and in this present day would have you believe that anything pre-1992 never happened.

    Professionalism did create a stir when it first happened. Initially, football was a game for the "toffs" especially when the Football Association was formed in 1873. But when it reached the working class areas of Britain, those dear people who had been starved of entertainment for so long, took to the game with a vengeance - players and fans alike. Then in 1888 along came Mr. McGregor and formed the Football League. Clubs had cottoned on to the fact that they could charge people for watching and the League was formed to ensure that the 12 founder teams had a regular fixture list that would ensure regulare income from the gate. It was at this point that Clubs started to lure the best players by paying them, and at first, the F.A. were up in arms about it as it destroyed the amateur ethos of the game which they wanted to protect so much. However, because there was the threat of a breakaway by the clubs, the F.A. capitulated to professionalism. It was the foundation of the bitterness which existed between the two bodies down through the years, which was instrumental to the F.A. backing the formation of the Premier League in 1992.

    The European Tournament didn't create a fuss when it was first formed. Clubs generally were all for it. However, it was the Football league who resented it. They were worried because they weren't happy for teams to be travelling around Europe in mid-week, just in case they weren't able to fulfill their fixtures on the Saturday after playing. Travel was nowhere near as easy in those days as it is today. Chelsea in 1955, were the first Club to be invited to enter the competition, but the Football League more or less ordered them not to compete. The following year, fortunately for United, the invite went direct to Matt Busby, and being the wily old bird that he was, went to the F.A. first and played them off against the League, knowing that if he got the F.A.'s backing (which he did) the Football League could do little or nothing about it.

    Sponsorship really crept into football in Britain initially. At first clubs were really against it, but when the "new kids on the block" arrived, people like Edwards, Carter, Dein etc etc saw that there was monies to be made, and they weren't slow on the uptake.

    For the spectacle that we see today, there has been a hard price to pay for it imho, and as I said, I'll try and elaborate on that in the next few days. It does make for interesting discussion between fans especially when we come from a broad spectrum of ages and nationalities like we do on this forum.
     
  13. sdotsom

    sdotsom Member+

    Manchester United
    Mar 27, 2005
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    you still can find the true emotion at many clubs, they just aren't the biggest ones. Imagine Reading fans, who had been supporting for years, and this year sees their side move up to the Prem. That's a feeling right there.

    However, I think people believe that globalization of the club somehow is making the club worth less to the "true fans" or hardcore support. It has definitely affected the game, but I think the ending of terraces and standing room affected the game much more.
     
  14. TomClare

    TomClare Member

    Aug 25, 2006
    Houston, Texas
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    It would be interesting to hear your views on the subject of SAF, Tom, as you've lived through and experienced the greatness of the Busby era in its fullest and can probably give a slant no one else here could.


    SAF is up there with the best of them in my opinion - Busby, Shankly, Stein, Nicholson, etc. To achieve what Sir Alex has achieved in the game - and don't forget, he's done it at two different clubs - isn't achieved by luck. There are a lot of parallels between both Sir Matt and Sir Alex, even though they are two totally different personalities. Both of them when they took over the Club immediately implemented the youth poilicy, even though they knew they needed time to see that policy bear fruit. Both of them in the initial period after their appointments, bought seasoned, experienced First Division players to make sure that the club survived in the First Division. Both of them let players go to Leeds United who turned out to be signifcant factors in the success of Leeds United - Giles and Strachan. Both of them created a family spirit within the club, and everybody, from the tea-ladies to the star players, were all made to feel part and parcel of that family. Both of them, even after winning a championship were not afraid to break up a winning team and give youth the chance it deserved, and both of their policies were proved to be right.

    As I said, two completely different personalities working in two completely different eras. Far from the image that he projected, and the image that a lot of people today have of Sir Matt, although he was the soft spoken person that he was, he was no soft touch and could be just as ruthless and as hard as Sir Alex ever has been. Players who crossed him, or whom he felt had let the Club down, were out through the door very quickly, and in the majority of cases, went dowhnhill very quickly as far as their careers were concerned. Two Munich survivors, Albert Scanlon and Denis Viollet, transgressed, and there was no sentimentality at all from Busby when he got rid of them. Denis Law tried to hold him to ransom and found himself on the transfer list 15 minutes later! Returning from an away match on the train, after a game in which they hadn't played particularly well, he once found the players playing cards and gambling for large stakes of money. He actually smashed the table on which they were playing and threw the money out through the train window. The players knew exactly where they stood with him. He wanted the game played in the right way, and that was always his passion. He used to tell the players that if they played the game in the style and correct way that he wanted, the trophies would look after themselves. I always remember that famous statement he made; "There is never any conceit in victory, nor disgrace in defeat."

    Sir Alex has taken on board a lot of Sir Matt's ethics although he is prone to be a lot more volatile than Busby was. But times are different and running the Club is a much harder job today than it was in Sir Matt's time. Sir Matt was never the best at handling the media, even though journalists were never the prying parasites that they are today. Fergie has had to deal with first a Board (whose Chairman was solely interested in making money out of the Club for himself), then a plc, and now a single owner. Sir Matt was lucky in that hed two chairmen who were immersed in the Club, James Gibson and Harold Hardman. Two people who would never have so much taken their bus fare out of the Club, and who were "Manchester United" people. Fergie handles the media side of the job very well in my opinion. Considering the pressures upon his time outside of football matters, what he has achieved in his time at Manchester United is nothing short of remarkable.

    Our fans should go down on their hands and knees and give thanks for SAF, because without doubt, before he arrived in 1986, the Club were in grave danger of traveling down a very slippery path. What Manchester United became through the 90's and up to the take over, was down to one man - Sir Alex Ferguson. Like Busby before him, his vision and expertise is what has made the Club. It wasn't the Board or the plc who gave United what it has, it is Alex Ferguson. He's had his critics, and that's part and parcel of the job he does. He's sometimes baffled the hell out of me with some of the things he has done - team selection, transfer dealings etc - but at the end of the day, you can't argue with what he's achieved. I am more than happy to have keep the faith with him and trust him in what he is doing. He is building his 4th team at United now, and I believe that this will be the legacy that he leaves us with - another great team. In my honest opinion he has laid the foundations and he just needs one or two more pieces to complete the building - I feel that it won't be too long before the Premiership Flag flies over Old Trafford once more.

    This was a piece that I wrote eighteen months ago regarding the two managers:

    The Brick Builders
    ________________________________________

    Fifty nine years ago, a great Scotsman, in whose shadow this great Club of ours stands, became the Manager. That momentous moment harboured the beginning of a love affair for hundreds, and thousands of fans, over the next six decades, with Manchester United, and still carries on today. And the reason that these fans fell, and still fall in love with the Club, is because of the foundations that this simple miner's son, from Orbiston, in Lanarkshire, laid down and cemented, to support the structure that he had built. He was a soft spoken man, never to be heard raising his voice or blowing his own trumpet. He was a man of great warmth, a man of principle, a man of honour, a visionary, a man who certainly had great style, but most of all, he was a people's man. He was a man that everybody could relate to. We were all blessed from the moment he entered our lives, and even today, ten years after he left us, we are still blessed. What he built, and the principles upon which he built it, ultimately left us with his legacy. In the history of this great game of football, I cannot think of any other person who was so loved, so admired, and so respected.

    During his time, he took a Club that was down, and out, from the depths of its nadir, to the dizziest heights that it could achieve. Along the way he suffered setbacks, and disappointments, and also great tragedy. But each time, when the building was knocked down, he rebuilt the bricks, solidified them, watched the building grow, and stood back as others saw that this was the blueprint that they also should follow. He gave us so much joy, so much pride, so much passion, but most of all, he nurtured in us all the love that we have for Manchester United today. Sadly, this Master Builder grew tired from injury, and age, and in 1969, retired. The fire was briefly rekindled in 1970, but in 1971, he retired permanently.

    In the years that followed, the club suffered long periods of mediocrity and the building fell into decline . There was a few disastrous years under an Irish pretender to the Master Builder's crown - he came, but failed so miserably. Then came the brief spark from a Scotsman, which lit the candle all too briefly, until he extinguished the flame himself. After him, it was the turn of the aristocratic Architect, who knew how to draw the blueprint, but could not put the building blocks together as the Master Builder had done when he laid the foundations. In 1980 came the extrovert who could talk the talk, produce the flamboyance and image, who promised much, delivered a little, and whose building bricks eventually imploded upon him. Unlike the Master Builder, he could not distinguish between the good bricks, and the flawed bricks, and in his efforts to do this, became so short sighted, that he became unable to see what was going on around him as his bricks tumbled.

    And all through these years, the Master Builder would visit the building site, cast his wise old eyes over the ruins, puff on his pipe, shake his head, and sadly leave the site to his successors.

    In the early 80's, a builder's apprentice was doing great things at a small Club on the north east coast of Scotland. He too, hailed from the same area as the Master Builder, and he also was a man of principle, a man with great style, and a man of the people. The Master Builder let it be known that this young apprentice had the right credentials and the knowledge to put his own building back together again. In 1986, the apprentice answered the call. Upon his arrival at the building site, he consulted briefly with the retired Master Builder, and then set about reading the blueprint and putting the bricks back together. He needed time, because he realised that to succeed, he would have to raise to the ground what was left of the Master Builder's ruins, go out and find a new type of brick, and then build upon the blueprint that was left behind by the Master Builder. At first, it was hard going. He had to build against impatience, intolerance, and at times with one hand tied behind his back. But slowly, as the old Master Builder looked on admiringly, he began to find the new bricks that were required to rest upon the old foundations. This young apprentice had the courage, the tenacity, the stamina, and the desire and will, to build his bricks into a rock solid building that would not falter when the storms and the tempests raged against it. He made his mistakes as he built, but like the old Master Builder before him, he learned from those mistakes. In 1990, he placed the first brick on the apex of the building, another one in 1991, and another one in 1992. Then finally, in 1993, he laid the golden brick upon which he would graduate from apprentice, to Master Builder. And all the time, the old retired Master Builder looked on, lovingly, and approvingly.

    In 1994, the old man passed away, and the new Master Builder was left alone to get on with the job of keeping the building, solid, and steadfast. This he has done, and like his mentor before him, has built buildings of style and great eye catching beauty. Times have changed drastically since his mentor was the Master Builder, and he has had to face a number of storms along the way. He has ridden out the storms and repaired any damage that was done to the effect that his building has always become much stronger. He too is loved and revered by the people. Just as the old Master Builder did, he too has delivered a building of great style, built upon the foundations that were laid down before him.

    The legacy that Sir Matt left us, and the legacy that Sir Alex will leave us, must never be allowed to be threatened. For most of us, it's because of what these two great men have built for us, that we love the Club with so much passion and fervour. It's not a plc, nor a Board, nor any pretenders that own the Club that we love, it's the very foundation of what is Manchester United Football Club.
     
  15. Alfiesdodgyknee

    Alfiesdodgyknee New Member

    Mar 24, 2006
    Glazer's Pocket


    Everthing u have just said is 100% right
     

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