Next Ballon d'Or winner that isn't CR7 or LM10 (and when)?

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by BocaFan, Jan 19, 2015.

  1. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
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  2. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Is Not only Argentinians :D.. Look at the votes.
     
  3. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    You said pay close attention to how Argentinean media voted ...
     
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  4. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Yeah.. because it is a clear case of the bias being corrected.. The others are already convinced and don't have any ties unless you are a cule, see Luis Enrique.
     
  5. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    As I said, Argentineans are sour he doesn't deliver for the NT as he does for Barca. This has nothing to do with bias.
     
  6. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Justifiably. Modric would not have won these awards if he had not taken his NT to the semis at the world cup while becoming the best player in the tournament - in prior years what he did for RM was underrated and flying under the radar.
     
  7. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Modric got pretty fortunate at the WC.
     
  8. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    #5608 robnycus, Sep 25, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
    He was brilliant against Argentina while Messi was, again, no where to be found. This was a key game in their group to decide who would win their group which essentially had Croatia facing Denmark and Argentina facing France, the champions.
    The stories could have been different if Messi had decided to show up on that match and also convert the penalty to beat Iceland, they could have gone as far as facing England in semis..
    Modric and Croatia were fortunate because they delivered in the group stage to pave the road for an easier path to the final.
     
  9. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    That was his best game vs Argentina. Mind you, everybody had their best game vs Argentina given their mid and defense sucked. That was also the game Sampaoli completely messed up the tactical plan.

    Yes it was the key game in deciding the group winner, but nobody knew at that point one side of the bracket was going to be dog shit. Belgium won their group and ended up on the tough side. So don't put that on Modric's account at being clutch.

    Fact is Croatia had a much easier path to the final and even still, needed PKS in R16 and QF. Not only that, Modric missed a crucial PK at the end of the R16 match that could have cost them the game. Not to mention the 2 PKs he took in those SOs were pretty poor.

    Then when they face the first good team in the WC, they get hammered much like Argentina did. So yeah, he was pretty fortunate IMO.
     
  10. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    #5610 robnycus, Sep 25, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
    When did I say Modric was clutch because they won their group ?
    He was excellent in their most important group match in comparison to Messi (75% pass accuracy, only 1 shot on target, only 49 touches :notworthy:even though Argentina won possession/had a lot more passes than Croatia and a less than 7 whoscored rating) come on.. that is pretty poor based on his standards. Just face it, he disappeared and as far as his leaderships skills are concerned, which are very important in these high stakes games, he was appalling, showing zero motivation, staring at the ground the entire time Croatia had the ball and causing trouble.. like saying get me out of here.. this is not the place for me and unable to look at his teammates in the eye who all rely on him as their captain to be their leader. The poor guy just crumbles mentally under pressure wearing the albiceleste and as a result his performance is not what it should be or one that could be said to be coming from the best player in the world. A total disappointment.

    It is just basic logic that in most cases teams want to finish 1st in the group stage for an easier path, at least easier R16 match.
    Belgium finished first and therefore faced Japan who was on paper easier than Colombia .
    Croatia had the same fortune as Spain, Russia, Colombia, England, Denmark, Sweden and Switzerland who all ended on that side of the bracket so is not like it was just a Croatia thing...
     
  11. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Messi making to a QF would have made no difference in judging him. That's why I am talking about all the way to the Final, not an easy R16 matchup.
     
  12. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Dude why you so sour Modric won the fwpoty
    Modric did more in the 2018 world cup ko stages than messi did in any World Cup

    Had messi not missed his pen vs Iceland and been so abysmal overall Argentina may of gotten an easier route which would’ve possibly enabled messi to go further in the competition

    You place to much emphasis on Croatia’s so called easy route and not enough on how easy it should’ve been for Argentina to top their group

    Also the first time Argentina faced a big team they got annihilated by a 19 year old
    You are just a plain old hater.i would’ve paid to seen your reaction if ronaldo had won the award
     
  13. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Predicting an alternative reality now? You don't know what would have been .. no one knows. Obviously if Messi played better, Argentina would have played better and gotten better results.. and those better results matter..
     
  14. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    He went completely irrational there. Also, is not like this was only the case for Croatia/Modric.. It was also the case for Spain and 7 other teams who all happened to be on that one bracket.
     
  15. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    I like how every time Messi has a poor game, the game's importance level gets inflated to preposterous levels. :ROFLMAO:

    Yes, it was an important game. I mean, its the World Cup, right? But it wasn't a 'must-win' or anything. The match against Nigeria was the most important as it was a "must-win", followed by the France game and after that the Croatia game which was third-most important out of 4.
     
  16. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I am not sour at all. What I stated are just facts. I am not rating Messi's WC. I wasn't even talking about him. Only replying because it was brought up.

    Just like Modric's Croatia got annihilated by that same 19 year old and team. And WTF did Modric did against France ? Not sure he did much vs England either. Please show me how Modric's KO round performance was that outstanding.
     
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  17. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    You're over-thinking it. It was the much easier half of the bracket. Plain and simple. Yes, there were 7 other teams that didn't get through it, but that's because they just weren't very good.

    Spain is the only big name on that side of the bracket but they were a mess given the last-minute coaching change.

    That said, no half of a WC bracket is "easy", obviously.
     
  18. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    #5618 robnycus, Sep 25, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
    Man of the match vs Russia. 9.1 whoscored rating. After having played two back to back 120 minute games , I am sure he was already suffering from physical exhaustion and not in his ideal form for the SF and final matches. Consider he is 33.
     
  19. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Yeah, the same bracket that Argentina could have been in if Messi would have played better in the first three games.
     
  20. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    Yeah yeah, Argentina sucked. Which only adds to the evidence that Croatia's run wasn't that impressive.

    I've also heard the "exhaustion" excuse a 100 times. Not once has anybody pointed-out how Croatia's games were spread out. Playing 120 minutes isn't so bad when you have 6 days until your next match. Plus Croatia gave some rest to key players in their final group game, including Modric.

    Croatia actually got better as the England game went on. The whole exhaustion story was made-up out of thin air. :)
     
  21. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Messi also played 2 ET games in 2014 before the Final. Just wondering if the same point was made back then ... :whistling:
     
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  22. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    ^ This literally might've been the first time anyone has pointed that out.
     
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  23. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    You are clueless dude. Modric if I am not mistaken was the player who covered more kms in the entire tournament. The one who is making stuff up here is you who thinks playing more minutes of high intensity does not translate to degraded performance in a long run. After the back to back 120 minute games the next game was only 4 days later same with the final.
     
  24. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    probably because he does not run as much. He and Modric play two very different roles.. Modric is actually also responsible to defend, whereas Messi has a free attacking only role therefore wastes less energy.
     
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  25. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I don't disagree, they have different builds. Still taxing no ? Specially for a player that's supposed to and expected to be doing more sprints and in the final third.

    Listen, I know Modric is a great player. I've pointed it out before. That's not to say he was fortunate. Judging by how Croatia struggled through KO, had they faced better opposition, they could have been knocked out in the QF. And that would change the whole perception of these individual awards. You and Madrid fans know this wasn't his best year at Madrid.
     
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