Pre-match: Netherlands vs France & England

Discussion in 'The Netherlands' started by DRB300, Mar 21, 2016.

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Netherlands will ... (explain your choice in a post below)

Poll closed Mar 24, 2016.
  1. ... get 6 points out of these 2 games.

    18.2%
  2. ... get 4 points.

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. ... get 3 points.

    9.1%
  4. ... get 2 points.

    9.1%
  5. ... get 1 point.

    27.3%
  6. ... get 0 points out of these 2 games.

    36.4%
  1. Dutch Treat

    Dutch Treat Member

    May 6, 2005
    Amsterdam|Alphen a/d Rijn
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I was wondering the same. Hell, I don't even know whether to feel good or bad about it.
    If this rumor is true we will find out soon enough.
     
  2. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    No Makaay was not a hard worker, a tracking back monster, so those qualities do not overlap and what you mean is how he still occupied defenders. That is a separate issue. Makaay is I think faster than Janssen, which allowed him to really get away from his defenders and score a goal. These are are actually very different players now I think about it and not a good comparison.
     
  3. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Janssen is a notch below RvN, but a notch above Dirkje Kuyt in my opinion
     
  4. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Let's get real. Janssen is only 21 years old and already has two caps for the NT. Did RvN or Kuyt play for the NT at such a young age? I hope he develops into something special.
     
  5. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Those are players both with huge careers. They also were players that had their own path to the top in that they climbed rather than exploded at a young age (as a van der Vaart for example). I think it is a bit early to tell where Janssen will be in some years from now. Discussing profile is different than making statements of his ceiling. I think to put him between Ruus and Dirk is a huge call. Not one I would be making at this stage in any case.
     
  6. So I did put you on the right track;)
     
  7. You just say that, just to rub it in my face, donot you! :mad:
     
  8. Keko

    Keko Member

    Jul 17, 2014
    Chicago
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    They had better competence to compete with.
     
  9. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    bunbohue repped this.
  10. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    More like being on the right track and by responding to a post I disagreed with, taking a ride to the next station. The players have different qualities :)
     
  11. I think you completely mis understood my post. But that's okay, can happen.
     
  12. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    #388 DRB300, Mar 30, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2016
    More like being on the right track and after explaining somebody that his answer did not connect with what was asked, arriving at another difference. That is another way to say it.
     
  13. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    No you misunderstood what was asked of me, but that is okay as well. Can happen. I hope things are clear now.
     
  14. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Orange14 repped this.
  15. You really donot understand what I posted, as I didnot post a disagree with you about Jansen not having the same qualities of Makaay. I didnot make any comparison, I only pointed at a quality of Roy that made up for the lacks he had according to your post.

    What I said was that if Jansen could build up the same scariness of Roy, that would be very good. I wasnot talking about the specific soccer qualities.
    So here you go off the road showing you really didnot understand what I posted, as I didnot suggest they are the same players or have overlapping qualities. In fact I didnot say anything about them that suggests a comparison, just a wish that Jansen one day would be as feared as Roy was.

    Here you show you didnot understand I wasnot reacting to your answer to a question, but to point at a quality Roy had related to this part of your answer:"but was he a defensive +? A hard worker? I don't remember him that way".
    So, no I didnot misunderstood what was asked of you, because I am aware of what kind of a player Roy was, but have seen too little of Vincent, who also is still in the "building" stage to have an thorough opinion on what he will be like. So no, I didnot react to the question of comparison, but to a part of your answer about Roy.

    I know..reading and keeping track of what really is said is difficult. So here is the compilation to make it easier.
     
  16. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    But they had a reason to, we didnt exactly play beautiful football that WC.

    You gotta take the criticism with the compliments when its deserved, I think
     
  17. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Just to elaborate on this, what I meant was Janssen will finish with more goals than Kuyt, and a bit less goals than RvN. So strictly from a total goals scored perspective I think he's between those 2 players
     
  18. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
  19. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Those lacks are not digs at Makaay and do not exclude the possibility that Makaay had a way to still occupy defenders. That only becomes relevant if Janssen would show that quality and he just plays the game differently. Makaay also had more speed to get away from his defender, a quality tied to the point you want to make about him. Speed is not something at this point that Janssen will improve up to to the levels of Makaay. There is no reason to even assume he will develop that quality. It's different.

    I do not see the logic of that happening. That already starts with speed. He does not have and will never have the speed of Makaay.

    You accentuate in red the wrong parts. Try to read after " what you mean" and I was right to say that it is separate issue. I can say, well if Janssen develops quality x, he would look more like y. Well yeah maybe, but why would you assume that will happen? Especially speed is not something that will not develop so much up from this point. They solve things differently, they are different players and I see no logic to assume that will change.


    That means tracking back, working hard, being all over the place. You did not understand me.

    Actually I am not even sure I agree on the quality you ascribe to him. Makaay's game revolved a lot around giving defenders a save feeling. Then suddenly being there for a goal. Defenders "doze off". When it payed out he looked smart and all, but when it did not, you asked yourself, where was Makaay? Robben has far more what you call, strike the fear of God in defenders. Defenders really play more backwards, build in more safety. Robben is very dominant and active player and he forces this reaction. Can you show me in clips what you mean with that he would occupy defenders all the time? Or that one of the defenders would not surge forward as a result of Makaay? For me you describe Robben far more than Makaay.

    Pedantic?
     
  20. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Agree. I would pay little attention to the stats on this one. Or even trajectory. I am just happy we have a more mobile option than Luuk de Jong. I hope that Janssen can take a next step.
     
  21. I didnot think you took a shot at him.
    I only saw a few of his goals in highlights so I take your opinion about that in a heart beat.
    No, I did understand you very well, because that's why he was called das Phantoom..a ghost you didnot see. If he did do what you mention, he wouldnot be called a ghost.
    I can see your point in this, but I doubt top defenders would be that dumb.
    I think you put your finger on the very difference between Roy and Arjen. Arjen is dominant and all present, while Roy was the looming danger.
    That's my second name;)
     
  22. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Dont mean to nitpick, but he was called "das Tor Phantom" actually.

    I hope we have found our striker in Janssen btw, if he can score 30 goals in next 60 games he will be at exact same 50% level that Ruud was, which is good enough for me.

    Anything more is bonus
     
    Sybe Pals and bunbohue repped this.
  23. Hahaha....those 30 in 60 would be already a bonus. You're not aiming too low arenot you?
     
    bunbohue repped this.

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