How many games is that? How many opportunities has Jozy had against high-level teams in competitive play? He missed the WC and the Copa America, he played in the 2009/2010 Confed Cup/WC. I'll bet there are fewer than 10 chances for Jozy to prove himself at that level, over Jozy's entire career.
~20 matches. He has the Spain goal; the drawn pk against Italy; the assist against Slovenia; and a goal against Honduras, the last which is the only relatively recent tally against a decent side.
http://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2016/...tos-jozy-altidore-may-be-best-form-his-career Those are some pretty huge moments you tallied there. He is 26,and has basically missed every tournament since 2014. Unless you think he has gotten worse, I see pretty good reason for optimism and excitement for his international prospects.
Mostly years ago, he had some big moments in competitive matches against quality opponents; however, those moments have been too few and far between. Jozy looks to have improved in certain aspects of his game, though.
You have to talk about his injury record when you talk about this. We only play competitive matches against big names in summer tourneys. He's been hurt for pretty much all of them since 2010.
Iceland haha. Iceland has done okay but let's not get ahead of ourselves. Not to mention wasn't it a B team that he played against?
Jozy is due 1 tournament to make his legacy on ala McBride in 2002 WC or Donovan in the 2o10 WC Perhaps we luck in and Jozy delivers like 3 goals and a few assists in the next WC and gets us to the QF.
After 2006 lots of the discussion about Landon was that he was not good in big games, this largely based on 180/270 minutes he played over two weeks. Thomas Muller is going to end up as the WC's all time leading scorer and is a Euro "flop". I think a lot of this is just the randomness of a sport where 3 total goals in a game is above average. I'd look to the career as a whole. If a guy never performs against good teams that's one thing, if it's only sometimes that's something else. The biggest negative then are Jozy's stints at Hull and Sunderland (team's whose leading scorers had 6, 8, and 5 league goals).
Agreed but that's the value and absurdity of judging a person's summer tournament versus his season prior such as say Hal Robson Kanu with 2 goals in 5 matches for Wales and only 3 goals last season for Reading in the Championship yet somehow fans and clubs are drooling over him.
Jozy has had ~20 competitive matches against Honduras, Mexico, Costa Rica, in World Cups, and in the Confederations. That is not a small sample size. His failures in Spain and England are immaterial.
What about context? How many goals did the team score in those? Was he drawing defenders to open space for his teammates? I know that he played a key part in the Algeria goal at WC 2010 but maybe doesn't get an assist. To my eye, the USMNT is in better position to score with him on the field.
How many opportunities has Jozy had to play against top-level international competition in competitive play? He's missed the last WC and Copa through injury. I'd wager he has 10 ish games against such opponents in his career. CC 09 is 4 games, then two during WC2010. Then add games vs Mexico/Costa Rica. It's a pretty small sample size. And, it's not usual that Jozy plays, gets subbed out, and suddenly we look better. Indeed, his hamstring injury killed us in 2014. He may not be a "World Class" striker, but when he's hot, he can get thereabouts, at least for a little while.
Imagine if the choice was to either play Jozy or make him an international free-agent. We definitely would not want to have to play against Jozy. I think the whole dialogue about him would be different if he played for another hex team.
It's amazing how much hate a player like Altidore gets, when all types of excuses are made for Zardes not being able to score against teams of that caliber.
Since 2010, I believe he has made 3 competitive appearances lasting more than 20 minutes against top quality opposition (better than mid-Hex level, to use IE's criteria): - Costa Rica in March 2013 (Dempsey scored our only goal on a rebound off an Alitodre strike); - Mexico in March 2013 (a 0-0 draw at the Azteca where Atidore played 55 minutes); - Mexico in October 2015. He got injured 20 minutes into the WC 2014 opener against Ghana and had a 19 minute appearance in 2013 against Costa Rica in our 3-1 loss at Saprissa. That adds up to about 3 full games worth of competitive minutes since 2010. He was injured for the Mexico GC final in 2011, suspended for the home Mexico qualifier in 2013, injured for more or less the entire 2014 World Cup, not deemed fit enough to play in the 2015 Gold Cup knockout stage, and injured for the entire 2016 Copa America. So the idea that Altidore doesn't produce in competitive play against better than mid-Hex opposition relies pretty heavily on either 3 games worth of minutes since 2010 or the assumption that Altidore was roughly the same quality player as a teenager as he was for his early to mid 20's.
Altidore did a great job of holding up his run to stay onside for the goal. If one wants to claim Altidore didn't get enough competitive internationals since whatever date then I would add that in the EPL and La Liga, he played better than middle of the hex comp.
He is now the 'veteran' striker that Klinsman seems to need on every roster; that means no more Wondo. Altidore, Zardes, Morris, and Wood. I'd be content come 2018 with that.
That's actually a myth (which, admittedly, I once believed as well until I looked up the stats): http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/debunking-the-jozy-altidore-hate-on-bigsoccer.2030655/ (excerpt below from my title post): Now, with that said, I fully agree that he has been absent or in poor form due to injury way too often in meaningful tournaments (2011 Gold Cup, 2014 World Cup, 2015 Gold Cup, 2016 Copa America). But he does has a good strike rate in competitive matches.
He has a mediocre competitive record against decent sides. That is the context of my post. You're attempting to address something else, which has nothing to do my argument.
Fair point, but I'm curious how you define "decent sides"? When I have some free time, I'd be interested in comparing Jozy's strike rate (goals/caps) against "decent sides" (once we solidify a definition) vs. other USMNT players like Clint Dempsey, Landon Donovan, Eric Wynalda and Brian McBride, to see if that holds true. Off hand, I'd bet Dempsey's goal scoring record vs. good teams is off the charts compared to the others, but I wouldn't be surprised if Altidore's compares favorably with all of the other top goal scorers in USMNT history outside of Dempsey.