Wait so does that mean you consider Manzur better then Da Silva and Veron??? ........ HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Hey Paul your an MLS fan right?? Name some of the great players from the MLS?? P.S. Besides Cuauhtemoc, we are all aware of his greatness.
I could help there. Pibe Valderrama, El Tanque Hurtado, El Pitufo De Avila, Diego Sonora(ex boca), Roberto Donadoni, Adrian Paz, John Harkes, Eric Wynalda, Luis Hernandez, Junior Agogo(African Cup of Nations played for ghana last one), Alain Nkong(played for atlante last season), Karanka(ex rela madrid), Djorkaef(sp.), Marco Etcheverry, Jaime Moreno, Hannaman(Reading's GK), Galvan Rey, Lothar Mattheus(sp), Juan Pablo Angel, etc.
Nah. Mexico's foreigners def. are younger and better than MLS's(for the most part), but soon enough MLS will sooner or later be able to compete with FMF in talent due to deeper pockets.
Deeper Pockets? As far as I know the MLS has lost in excess of $300 Million and only one or two clubs have turned a profit.
It will all change once MLS teams have their own stadium. They are trying to do this before they expand the measly 2 million salary cap. Paying rent for stadiums is maaad expensive.
Well maybe it will turn profitable (or go bankrupt,) but what exactly makes you think that the MLS will have deeper pockets than the Mexican League?
O i never said deeper, but will be able to compete. Look at how much american sports teams are paying their players, the NHL has a salary cap of 40 million US(hockey is #4, and in some cities MLS teams are beating their NHL competitiors in average attendence), beckham is getting paid 6.5 million a year, Blanco 2.x million a year, Gallardo for DC is getting paid 1.9 million a year, etc. If they are willing to pay that for one player which is comparable to the big players in mexico, America pays Insua i think like 2.5 million a year US think about what will happen when they expand their salary cap. They can get better plays for better pay. MLS has already proven that they ahve a market, all the stuff with you saying they were losing money was through the dark ages of the MLS. Things have turned around since them when all the big sponsors dropped like flies, since then they have turned things around, teams have their own stadiums or are starting to build ones. The MLS is here to stay, they learned their lesson from the NASL. They arent going to start investing hard core into players until they have their own stadium and generate garunteed revenue.
I for one wouldn't mind if MLS teams come to play in the Copa Libertadores. Just as long as they don't do what the U.S. National team did in Copa America 2007, which was a complete slap in the face and disrespect to the CONMEBOL. They only problem that I have with MLS being in the Copa Liberatodres is that it's fans are not as passionate as the South American teams, and that "passion" is why this cup is one of the best and most unique tournaments out there. I mean, just look at the "recibimientos" for the local teams in the Copa Libertadores, the fans go nuts. Non-stop screaming, flags being waved all over the place, banners reaching from the top of the stadium to the bottom, smoke bombs, flares, fireworks, etc. I don't know about yall but I would pay big bucks to experience these sort of atmosphers. Who wouldn't have loved to be at that historic recibimiento of River Plate in 1996. I don't know if MLS is up to that level yet. Do you think MLS teams would be able to give these sort of atmospheres, which are one of the great characteristics of this tournament. Would an MLS team be able to pack a stadium like America does in packing the Aztec Stadium with of American fans? Or how about creating atmospheres like those in the Maracana, Monumental David Arellano, La Bombanera, Monumental Antonio Vespucio Liberti, or the Azteca? The better question is how would MLS teams do in foreign countries? Almost all of their futbol/soccer games, both MLS and National squad, is played in the U.S. Instead of giving an MLS team the invitation, give it to Deportivo Saprissa from Costa Rica. Their fans are very passionate and follow this team as if it was own national team. Saprissa also has done far more better in regards to championships and international compititions then any MLS team. Heck, they are even as good most Mexican club teams. It would be very nice to see Saprissa in the Copa Libertadores and I'm very sure they would suprise a lot of people, adding even more excitment to this beautiful tournament.
Fan atmospheres? Arguably, D.C. United are the best in the United States, so far as that aspect goes - and in Canada, Toronto F.C. are certainly making a great go of it! (One could argue that the only reason that TFC has a lower overall attendance than DC and LA is because BMO Field can only fit 20,000 - and ironically, 20k was probably seen as more than enough when the place was built! Here's hoping that MLSE can persuade the City of Toronto to get the stadium up-sized to 25-30k in the not-too-distant future... oh, and to put real grass in, too!) Plus, of the potential MLS teams, or teams which might end up in the CONCACAF Champions' League, Montréal are in a good position so far, with a new Saputo Stadium which will already be hosting Canadian MNT World Cup qualifiers, Canada Cup matches against Toronto and the Vancouver Whitecaps, and wold be set to expand to 20k if Montréal get the nod for an MLS berth. And if Montréal end up in MLS, and do well enough to qualify for, and win, the SuperLiga, maybe we could see just how well they can do in other tourneys? Which brings me back to a point I made in another thread: Let the SuperLiga winner qualify for Libertadores (maybe by taking the third berth away from the InterLiga, which would still have two berths up for grabs - and is run by SUM, the same company which runs SuperLiga) and the runner-up qualify for Sulamericana. That way, the Mexican teams in SuperLiga will make more of an effort to win the thing - and therefore, if a Mexican side wins and qualifies, there would still be three Mexican sides in the CL... ...and if an MLS team can beat Mexican sides in a more competitive SuperLiga, they would have fairly earned the right to go to either South American competition. Oh, and I think someone mentioned the US MNT which went to Copa America - there was an interview in WorldSoccer magazine with the head of the USSF, and he aid that the problem the US team had with CA was that as it was not a CONCACAF event, they couldn't oblige many of the clubs with whom the main USNMT regulars play with to release them for the national squad. They would have sent their best if they could have gotten the players released.
i think if mls teams would have an spot, its better make a concacaf group in libertadores and top 2 goes to round of 16 of libertadores.
Yes you bring up a GREAT GREAT POINT!! I still dont feel that US team fans(not dissing the brava, i sing with them everygame i go) are not up to par yet, if ever with south america. South america is a whole different animal. They cheer harder than Euro teams also. I think MLS teams are good for like a beginners state of cheering. But when it comes to say mexican or South American fans they lack ALOT! But will this hurt them? Not so much, i know with my squad DC, they have put up good fights away from home, just lacking the home advantage to really cremate their opposition on their home turf. I dont think the problem so much is that of the fans intimidating them, but yes the support might seem weak at home games compared to what SA's are used to seeing, but you do see some matches in the CL empty too in countrys in SA. I agree saprissa would be a fun experiment, but the way they were getting dominated in their "intimidating" atmosphere by Pachuca was similar to the play DC united had in their house, but they ended up winning and right now are in last place in the eastern conference. Surely a stronger team in the MLS i feel would be able to take down Pachuca, or for that matter play very well in the Copa Libertadores or vs. Saprissa. That is just my thoughts though, no disrespect to Saprissa, they played great but didnt have the look of the champion to win over pachuca, as they did vs. a very weak and undermanned Atlante.
I don't know about the Libertadores, but to the Sudamericana for the 3 CONCACAF spots they could pick 3 teams that failed in the CCL's qualifying round. But i doubt that'll happen. If anything i'd rather not get any non-CONMEBOL team anymore.
^^^ Yea i'll agree to that, why would you want to see teams that arent even good enough to play in the CCL play in a bigger tourney than any in the Concacaf region period?? I think the best teams from concacaf should only get inivted to the Copa Libertadores, IF that ever happens, but at this point with this new champions league crap going on right when the heat of things happens during the CL aka the final rounds are through feb.-March i Doubt any of the best teams of the Concacaf would do this, unless they choose to drop out of the CCL to play in the Copa Lib. But i would doubt that any MLS side would do that as A. They dont have enough balls to do this to the concacaf region B. They have a chance at winning chance to play in Japan for the WC of Clubs
you could even add hugo sanchez to that list. now, name the ones that spent their peak playing days in MLS.
from that list, would Jaime Moreno not count? He has played most of his career with the Black-and-Red, and has been with the team pretty much since the outset (save for a year spent with the team-formerly-known-as-MetroStars).
he would, i mean the list would be considerably shorter, not non-existant. we seem to be following eachother around the board nerroth haha
Personally i think Jaime made a big big mistake, as he has admitted himself that coming to the MLS at that time in his career wasnt such a great idea. He was the leading goal scorer in Middlesborough and cause IMO he was still young and immature he left to get playing time along side El Diablo, his mentor and career guide. But thats another name to add in his prime that played in the MLS, Marco Etcheverry.
Hmm... Well i dunno about it being deeper, IT COULD happen, i mean if you look at the 2 biggest billionaires right now, its bill gates and that mexican dude thats beating him by a billion lol. It could be like that. But seriously, with how money is generated in this big country the MLS even though would be at best the #5 league in this country, maybe 4 if it can handle hockey and take some of its fans, it still would revenue alot of money. Look at the NHL, 40million salary cap, MLS will match that sooner or later. At 2.x million right now it is pennies, but still probably pays better than small team in peru, most teams in bolivia, smaller teams in SA, etc. Imagine with a 10 million salary cap? 20 million? Hell match Hockey at 40 million and they can compete with decent sized clubs in Europe! And then add in these hungry owners that would love to see their team get great players, like DC United for example is co-owned by a multi-billionaire. He bought DC just on a whym(sp.). AEG bought Beckham and broke the euro market in half, Which actually ISNT that big for American Contract standards. MLS could be a MONEY league, and possibly buy good talent which will i am sure bring up US nat play to say England Nat Team Standards. Not italy or spain though. That is my point, there is alot of money in this country and if MLS works it out right they can grow this baby in the next 15-20 years to be a big money league.
Me personally, there is no reason why MLS should get a place in SudAmerica or Libertadores, Right Now atleast.The MLS is just not good enough right now. I cant even remember if they have ever won a home and away series with a Mexican team EVER.I much rather see a team like Saprissa get it,Saprissa is better than any MLS team.The MLS is getting better but its not ready yet to play in big international tournaments,they cant even win Concacaf Championships on a consistent basis.The MLS teams might upset some Bolivian or some teams in Peru but other than that I think they will get stomped by teams like Santos,River,Sao Paulo,etc I too want the MLS to get better but its not there yet.