Pre-match: March Friendlies - Ecuador & Chile

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by AutoPenalti, Feb 3, 2019.

  1. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    No, they don't. They were just the only warm bodies available in January for a camp where Berhalter had 3 weeks to teach them what he wanted them to do. Don't forget, Lewis was a later addition and not even in the original camp cupcake roster. So, it wasn't like GB had him in mind as some overlooked talent he couldn't wait to get in camp.

    Unlike some in Cupcake, Baird and Lewis (more Baird as Lewis doesn't start) learned and did exactly what GB wanted. He didn't do it well, but he did it exactly like GB wanted.

    Now they are back. The only rational explanation is that they know the system and GB doesn't want a midfield full of new students along with all the forwards being new students. He wants the midfield, and CBs too probably, to learn with the forwards doing exactly what they are supposed to be doing.

    Like any experiment, if you have too many variables, you can't conclude anything. But there is nothing special about Baird or Zardes or Lewis. There is just not much American forward talent in MLS. It wasn't like they were picked for cupcake over dozens of of other players. Lewis was literally a USL part time player. That is how low the bottom of the barrel was.

    If GB is rational, then June will be for teaching the forwards. That will be the top 2-3 forwards from this camp with 2-4 European based players and Altidore if he is healthy.
     
  2. GiallorossiYank

    GiallorossiYank Member+

    Jan 20, 2011
    NJ/Roma/Napoli
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Lol
     
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  3. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    It isn't cynicism, it is applying logic. But if you want to just take everything USSF and its employees say as received wisdom, then whatever. Hey, if only that Dempsey shot was six inches to the left...
     
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  4. ebado

    ebado Member

    May 2, 2008
    I don't really believe in Zardes as an international player, but at least in comparison to Lewis and Baird, he's produced at a much higher level. Lewis hasn't played very much and seems more comparable to some of the u-23 and u-20 players. Baird has a full season at least and scored some goals but doesn't seem very special overall.
     
  5. Pragidealist

    Pragidealist Member+

    Mar 3, 2010
    Poor logic. You’re making inferences with too little information and filling gaps Witt viewpoint rather than facts. Basically, you’re jumping to preconceived conclusions
     
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  6. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Zardes has shown enough times that he's not good enough, but whatever.
     
  7. soccerusa517

    soccerusa517 Member+

    Jun 23, 2009
    Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Jason Kreis is reportedly the U-23 Olympic coach.

    What could go wrong?
     
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  8. Red Card

    Red Card Member

    Mar 3, 1999
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Btw, a little off topic, Dave Sarachan is coaching in USL at North Carolina FC.
     
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  9. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    We can hide potentially ineffective players like Zardes on the wings where, even if they're not good enough, it's not a huge liability.

    We can't afford to do that with our most important positions.
     
  10. puttputtfc

    puttputtfc Member+

    Sep 7, 1999
    USSF has earned cynicism from the fans. I don't blame anyone for not believing a word USSF says.
     
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  11. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    The handwringing about the Weah and Sargent decisions has gotten pretty excessive.

    The U23s are playing really strong competition in Europe. Maybe the USSF staff thought it was better to have those two START against Holland U23s as opposed to coming off the bench for the USMNT against Ecuador. Also, they don't have to put up with all the travel. Same for the other guys like EPB, CCV, etc. that are likely to be with that group. Come on people. The U23s aren't playing Moldova. They're playing Holland and Egypt!

    I think folks are incorrectly assuming that those two won't be on the Gold Cup roster because they're not at this camp. Maybe they won't be. I just think its premature to make that assumption.

    In reality, I think we should just see this window as one big pool of U20s, U23s, and USMNT. Got three great camps and games to consider. The U20 roster that was just released is really strong, and they're playing games against France and Japan.
     
  12. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I read a few days ago that Berhalter said he wanted some players from Camp Cupcake there to make it was for new players to pick everything up. Wants to give the new players a chance with players who know the scheme instead of just throwing out a new group every time. Players will get moved in gradually to give continuity. Hopefully the U23’s and U20’s will run the same scheme so they can move right in when moving up.
     
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  13. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    It's not a huge deal if Weah and Sargent are with a U- team but it would be a very poor decision if they didn't get to play with any of our national teams (because they were invited to a U- camp and their club declined). I think the U23 roster should be coming out imminently so we'll see.
     
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  14. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Youtube: Jimmy Dore, Secular Talk
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is he going to an expansion team that's going to grossly over-pay for dinosaurs and then force his hand to play them, or somewhere as dysfunctional as Orlando? Well maybe the latter, but then every manager would have to deal w/ that obstacle.

    He was formerly considered for senior manager due to excellence at a club that featured no shortage of young players and a good system. Seems like a good distressed asset option, actually. I think some are stuck in lamentation mode to react that way about every decision. This is a niche job. It's the ice cream truck of football. It's not even a regular gig like with the other youth teams.
     
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  15. GiallorossiYank

    GiallorossiYank Member+

    Jan 20, 2011
    NJ/Roma/Napoli
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #865 GiallorossiYank, Mar 16, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2019
    Why not take the Gold Cup seriously? Oh wait the Fed made it clear they don’t care when they wasted Sept, Oct and Nov camps with Dave Sarachan. If Weah and Sargent was with Gregg in the Fall I bet people wouldn’t have any problems.

    The issue here is that inferior MLS players are getting a leg up because they were in the January camp. Jon Lewis should be with the U23s as he has no professional experience and two nice cameos against mediocre January opposition. I want Lewis to ball out for NYC, absolutely but he hasn’t. Weah is the better and younger player ask anyone in the world and they’ll take Timo. The Spring FIFA dates are limited and even if we play a random April non-FIFA date agaonst Mexico or someone that again is usually all domestic guys. IMO the Fed should have told Gregg, want the gig? Leave the Crew in May or we gotta go with someone else. Thats my problem with the hire. We wasted too much time, and then the Fed expects us to pay big bucks on tickets and airfare this summer for a competition they didn’t prioritize.

    Now we have one “full team camp” with everyone and sending Weah and Sargent down was the wrong choice. We wasted too much time waiting for Gregg Berhalter. Gregg F’in Berhalter. We didn’t wait for Pep, or Mourinho, or Allegri. We wasted months waiting for Gregg Berhalter.
     
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  16. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    On My Squatty Potty
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Adams is manning the DM role for RB today vs Schalke. Looks calm and composed.

    There's simply no way in hell Bradley or Willie would step into that squad at that level and bump Adams from the first XI.

    If Berhalter does it it's a fireable offense.
     
  17. schrutebuck

    schrutebuck Member+

    Jul 26, 2007
    Meanwhile, Schalke continues the McKennie at right back experiment. McKennie doesn't quite look comfortable glued to the sideline when attacking, but maybe it would work better if McKennie plays RB and then shifts inside when his team has the ball...
     
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  18. matabala

    matabala Member+

    Sep 25, 2002
    The US Soccer team is not a "public" company. They have no obligation to be transparent, IN A TACTICAL SPORTING SENSE, above and beyond that which maintains good PR.
     
  19. Susaeta

    Susaeta BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 3, 2009
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Weah is a better player, but Lewis is a better winger.
     
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  20. Cynical US fan

    Iceland
    Mar 30, 2017
    Boston
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    GR Yank makes good points. The match vs. Ecuador is on the 21st and those players in matches today will have 3 days in camp altogether. I have no idea how US Soccer influences Berhalter, but his roster is suspect. I don't think it was worth waiting for Berhalter. He'll be no better than Sarachan or Arena.
     
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  21. truefan420

    truefan420 Member+

    May 30, 2010
    oakland
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Depends on what you’re asking your winger to do. If it’s stretch the field and stay glued outside to cross the ball... sure you could make that argument. It plays to Lewis strengths and plays down Weahs strengths. If it’s to float inside an act as a proxy second forward while the width from your side comes from the outside back... then Weah fits that mold much better. Wingers roles change based on system and in game need. To be fair I know the point your making but feel like arguing the semantics of it.

    In 3Gs system Lewis may be a better fit as a winger but that doesn’t change the mistake it is to leave both Weah and Sarge off the roster. If he’s concerned with having a mix of people that know the system from Jan camp and new faces then at least 1 should have come as a ST option and a change of system winger option if needed. Instead we have a repeat call of the forward pool from Jan Camp leaving two of our most talented and promising players off for a u23 call.
     
  22. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well Morris is looking like he's ready to play. I guess his fitness/health shouldn't be that big of a concern. He can play the right winger or forward in Berhalter's system.
     
  23. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    I could write seven paragraphs excusing the whys and wherefores, but the bottom line is neither Weah nor Sargent are playing.

    When picking NT rosters, actually playing should be an important consideration.
     
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  24. FeedhimtothepigsArold

    Apr 7, 2014
    Club:
    Oxford United FC
    I think it depends on the role or instruction of the wing position.

    As a traditional winger, Lewis is better. If the instructions are for the wing player to play as an inverted/inside wide forward, then Weah is better.

    Weah is way more deadly cutting in. An example is the goal he scored against Paraguay at the youth worldy. I think for GBs system Morris, Puli and Weah could be dangerous as wide forwards who attack inside. Similar to how Mane and Salah play the positions as far as pressing and attack.
     
  25. FeedhimtothepigsArold

    Apr 7, 2014
    Club:
    Oxford United FC
    Im surprised that more pundits are not viewing Mckennie as a better option there. Interesting. Being that hes actually playing at rb
     

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