Pre-match: March Friendlies - Ecuador & Chile

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by AutoPenalti, Feb 3, 2019.

  1. FormerNo10

    FormerNo10 Member

    Leipzig
    United States
    Dec 13, 2018
    Costa Rica
    The issue that I am wrestling with is I want to see our team develop more quickly, especially after losing a full year w/o a National coach. I will support ggg and his system of choice. But, with this open FIFA window, full player pool availibility at its highest in years due to non-injuries, I was expecting March to be a camp where ggg could experiment/tinker with his starting XI profiles more. No one knows who are best XI are and who the depth players will be to challenge them?

    The DCM position is a great example for discussing options. I do not like MB. He hasn't played well since his father was the coach. I do not care for the MLS. So 2018/19 was my first true year to watch players like Adams and Trapp. For me, Trapp would be #3 or 4 on my DCM depth chart, to be used only in case of emergency until our younger talent is ready. He does not look like a quality international-level player (as well as Delgado Excellency). Watching all of Adams games this year I finally see what all of the MLS Red Bulls fans were excited about. He is a quality player with an incredible motor and great upside at a very young age.

    I was expecting more in the build-up to the Gold Cup. I was hoping ggg would have a much better feel for who is best 25-30 players were and begin the process of naming the starting XI for 2019/20. Name their backups. Let them work to challenge for the starting spots as well as always being prepared to start in case of non-availability issues.

    Can Adams, or anyone else, man the #6 at the Gold Cup? That is one of the biggest and many questions I have. But, will we ever find out? We all know what MB brings to the table. You can argue that we don't really know how he will perform in the new system surrounded by the highest quality teammates ggg believes in. My problem is I do not think that ggg will allow us the opportunity to discover some of those answers in this camp or in the Gold Cup. Adams seems to be ready to be experimented at RB and/or the "Roldan" position we saw in Camp Cupcake. We shall see.

    So, I will be patient for perhaps another year waiting for the potential of a team that is prepared to put the best players out there in the event that MB AND WT are not available for our first CONCACAF qualifier.

    BTW, enjoyed the article posted about DCMs. I am in the camp that he needs to have defensive bite. He may not necessarily need to be a true destroyer in the ggg system but not an open door defender like MB/WT. Another reason why I want to see anyone play that the #6 in 2019.
     
  2. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    For someone who wants to talk tactics and appears to be a big supporter of Berhalter, you dont seem to have a good grasp of how we played in January and how Berhalter has alluded to us playing.

    Adams would only be central when attacking and wasted out wide when defending. He has suggested that WM & CP will be central midfielders.

    Offensively it was a 343 and defensively it was 442. The wings will be rockstars like Corey Baird and that USL player for NYCFC. They are supposed to stay high and wide while also rotating centrally when WM/CP drift wide. Since we excluded some of our better young CBs i expect to the best CB in MLS (that is how Gonzalez was described in 2015???) and Miazga flank Brooks. I think both are mobile enough to cover wide positions in an emergency and Brooks can man the middle.

    Offensively. with this roster and Berhalters hints....

    Crap-----------Crap----------Crap
    -----------WM--------CP-------------
    -------------WTF--TA----------------
    ----Long---Brooks--Miazga---

    Defensively.......

    ------------Crap--------CP-------------
    Crap----------WTF--WM----------Crap
    Long---Brooks--Miazga---Adams

    Notice that ball and chain on TA going forward and on WM defensively. Meanwhile our best player at pressuring attackers, covering ground and breaking up plays is defending out wide.
     
  3. LuckofLichaj

    LuckofLichaj Member

    Mar 9, 2012
    Yes.
     
  4. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    The roster is a joke the way it is being explained by GB and the media. It would be perfectly fine, wouldn't it, for GB to say, "We only have two days, we wanted to identify the core of our team going forward. With the two days, we can focus on bringing Adams, Pulisic, McKennie, Brooks, and Miazga up to speed. They are the core and spine. Frankly, once that is nailed down we can work on the peripheral players in June."

    "We also brought in two players that caught a lot of flack after Trinidad and we feel sorry for them and everyone at USSF likes them." (Omar and Morris)

    Instead, everything is basically contradictory statements about selections and obviously dissembling. GB was all over the media when he was in Germany, but has been pretty silent since this roster came out. He is not a good liar and knows it and doesn't want to show it. But I just don't know why he just didn't say this camp is about the midfield and defense and the forwards just had to know what to do in drills.

    Some of the contradictions:

    Sargent and Weah left off because they are U23 and:

    1. Not getting consistent minutes for club.

    - But Lewis is not a consistent 90' player ever and is U23
    - CCV has been a consistent starter for Swansea basically since January.
    - Holmes has been a consistent starter for Derby
    - Nova, Gall, Green, Morales all consistent starters too
    - Morris has barely played in 18 months
    - LLetget has not gone 90' in months

    There is simply no rational explanation for picking Lewis over Weah; except that Lewis understands what to do already. Fine, just say that. Why all the mumble jumble about:

    2. He produced in the last camp

    - Playing against players that couldn't make USL rosters
    - Weah has produced for the USMNT and against a team like Colombia

    The ultra fanbase saw the problems before Couva. Of using older and mostly domestic players with a coach that came from MLS, who overrated the quality of MLS. So, seeing so many MLS players (and a real dinosaur who was never good) in the first full roster for the new coach (who comes from MLS) was obviously going to set off alarm bells. It should, we can't make the same mistakes (literally with Omar and MB the same mistakes) again.

    Again, why not just say it is a quirk of when he started and these MLS players unfairly have a leg up, but we have to use them this camp? Why all the nonsense about the Olympics and not playing for clubs? Because this roster and all the statements about it, are reinforcing the view that GB is overrating MLS players and freezing out European players, just like Arena.

    Maybe what is most annoying is that the thing we liked about GB most to this point was his straight talk and talking to us like we understood things. However, much of what he said since December he contradicted with this roster. And he is obviously either Arena 2.0 or lying about why he selected guys. Probably the biggest disappointment is that we can't trust him going forward. Plus, the truth (if it is integrating core players) is just not something that has to be hidden.
     
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  5. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    What rage?
     
  6. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    Explanation: As a young American playing abroad, Weah has a chance at getting consistent minutes. Lewis does not in MLS.

    Bringing Weah could hurt his chances to become a starter. Lewis doesn't have a chance. It's the difference between being a young American playing abroad and in MLS.
     
  7. Pragidealist

    Pragidealist Member+

    Mar 3, 2010
    I also think they are prioritizing qualifying for the Olympics. Weah would be a key contributor to ensure that. He is guaranteed lots of significant minutes in that group. Lewis probably isn't. He may have just as much chance of getting some good sub minutes for the men's team as he does getting any significant minutes from the youth team.

    I hope that these decisions were in concert with Tab and they had these types of discussions about where they were most likely to get the most significant minute and where they were most likely to help impact the program. It take a little faith that those conversations are being had though- so I don't fault anyone if they are skeptical of it.
     
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  8. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    I like McKennie, but I have to agree a bit with people taking issue with his being used basically at every position. Eventually, he will need to find his place on the field, or he'll be a career utility guy. That will keep him employed, sure. But, I don't think it will maximize his abilities for the US. It makes him a great backup on a really good team where he can provide cover in a lot of spaces and give the coach flexibility. But, it's bad for a guy you want to be a key player at a single position Internationally as he won't ever really get to know any single place on the field. I'll be curious to watch how he does in these games and where he plays.

    I'm curious if anyone can recall examples of guys who played all over the field to the extent McKennie does now but who eventually found a specific spot they excel at?
     
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  9. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    SJ Earthquakes/Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Pleasanton, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The guy who did that, Tedesco, is gone now. I presume that'll bring some stability to his play.

    Geoff Cameron was a high-level utility guy. Mostly played RB, then moved to CB/CDM as his legs failed him.
     
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  10. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    At Weston's current age Jermaine Jones was a pacy striker playing for Germany's U20 World Cup squad in Argentina!

    Lets be clear that Weston is playing all over the place because of his coach. Tedesco (much like GB) fell in love with his own image as a master tactician and systems developer and came to believe that he could devise these complex schemes, (almost like throwball sets), to control matches. Mckennie does a lot of things well and plays very hard so he got put in a lot of different slots in Tedesco's "master plans".

    Soccer is way too fluid and dynamic for rigid complex sets to consistently work. Tedesco got fired after long slumps and the squad increasingly disenchanted because they were not "getting" the tactical brilliance.

    Lets hope GB does not create the same problems. At the international level with the significantly lower training time it is most important to pick the right core players and put them in roles to succeed than to try to be a brilliant tactician!
     
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  11. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    SJ Earthquakes/Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Pleasanton, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #836 gunnerfan7, Mar 15, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
    We're good there, Daniel Lovitz knows the system!
     
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  12. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Yeah, I think McKennie post-Tedesco will be interesting. The new coach I would think is more likely to find a spot and stick him there to stay for a while. Of course, Tedesco liked McKennie and there is no guarantee the new guy will. Better, more expensive players than McKennie have fallen victim to a coaching change. I don't expect him t be benched, but with a switch anything is possible.
     
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  13. matabala

    matabala Member+

    Sep 25, 2002
    No, coaches shouldn't be doing their strategic thinking out loud for the public and the media. Does any other CEO go to the press to inform them off how they're going to run their business?

    I had to do a double take to make sure I read this correctly. Do you seriously think a professional sport coach should talk like a nursery school teacher? Grow a pair, please!







    Again, why not just say it is a quirk of when he started and these MLS players unfairly have a leg up, but we have to use them this camp? Why all the nonsense about the Olympics and not playing for clubs? Because this roster and all the statements about it, are reinforcing the view that GB is overrating MLS players and freezing out European players, just like Arena.

    Maybe what is most annoying is that the thing we liked about GB most to this point was his straight talk and talking to us like we understood things. However, much of what he said since December he contradicted with this roster. And he is obviously either Arena 2.0 or lying about why he selected guys. Probably the biggest disappointment is that we can't trust him going forward. Plus, the truth (if it is integrating core players) is just not something that has to be hidden.[/QUOTE]
     
  14. Master O

    Master O Member+

    Jul 7, 2006
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just another disappointment in a long line of disappointing choices by USSF in hiring this guy.

    Can't we find some better people to run this federation?
     
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  15. Cynical US fan

    Iceland
    Mar 30, 2017
    Boston
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Despite Ecuador and Chile being better opponents than what Berhalter faced so far, I won't be watching again. These are FIFA sanctioned friendlies, and clubs must release their players. No reason an uninjured Fabian Johnson isn't playing LB when there's no one else that compares to him (he's played both RB and LB). Morales may be injured, but Adams or/and McKennie could take over at DM for Bradley. Leaving Wood, Weah, Sargent and Novakovich out is BS.
     
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  16. FirstStar

    FirstStar Hustlin' for the USA

    Feb 1, 2005
    Time's Arrow
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    OT, but "YES", all the time. CEOs of public companies are always making public statements regarding business operations and are routinely subject to analysts calls. This is especially true when engaged in a turn-around or with a failing company. Google: "GE Larry Culp CNBC" for an excellent case study.
     
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  17. laxcoach

    laxcoach Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    United States
    Jul 29, 2017
    It's been months since Berhalter wasn't named the new manager even though we knew he was....and I'm over the disappointment.

    But I'm not sure I'll do more than passively watch the DVR after it's over. I really could care less about results right now. With a theoretically new lead man we should see new talent (oops) and new ideas (we'll see) but not holding my breath.

    In the end, I start caring in about 12 months and if we're still bantering on about highly questionable roster picks then we're doomed to more Arena/Sarachan blah.
     
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  18. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Wha...??? Morris wasn't even in Couva, he was injured with a muscle tear in his thigh. Is the guy high?
     
  19. butters59

    butters59 Member+

    Feb 22, 2013
    Morris is a scapegoat du juor.
     
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  20. ebado

    ebado Member

    May 2, 2008
    Am I missing something with Corey Baird? He just doesn't seem to be a very good MLS player.

    There are bigger head scratchers on the roster but the Baird thing is just something I've never fully understood.
     
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  21. Pragidealist

    Pragidealist Member+

    Mar 3, 2010
    I think he and Lewis fit very specialist versions of roles where the us is a bit weak
     
  22. #1 Feilhaber and Adu

    Aug 1, 2007

    I cant handle the truth. Don Garber is best buds with baby Bwadley and Don Garber personally ordered Bradley on this team …………...but but but conspiracy but but but

    Lets lower BS USM N&A to deflect.
     
  23. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    This has nothing to do with the Olympics. That is just another disingenuous smoke screen. Sargent and Weah and others are with the U23s so their absence with the NT can be explained away. Why they feel the need for a smoke screen is the baffling part. Just say the Cupcakers are here to provide a control for the experiment of integrating Adams, McKennie, Brooks, and Pulisic.

    How can we tell they haven't suddenly decided to prioritze the Olympics?

    1. Not just a few weeks ago the USSF offered to host a combined Copa in the USA in 2020. Do you think they would host a tournament with some of our best players not participating because they are in Japan?

    2. There is no reason to believe Werder Bremen have committed Sargent to Olympic games during the next Bundesliga season (October) or in the Summer of 2020. He might not be on their books in 2020. Celtic can't commit Weah for October and PSG might not own him or have him on their roster.

    3. The USSF hasn't even hired a coach for the U23s.

    This U23 camp is just a Camp Cupcake for European based players. GB obviously picked the roster as their is no coach. It is just somewhere for these players to get some reps in the new system while the Core is assimilated in NT camp.
     
  24. Pragidealist

    Pragidealist Member+

    Mar 3, 2010
    Too Cynical for me- I don’t have any reason to think they’d lie about it.
     
  25. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    By law, this is exactly what the CEO of every public company has to do. You can go read the Prospectus on any public company and get the complete business plan signed by the CEO. It will explain how they will make money, borrow money, lose money, what their markets are and the biggest risks to their model. You will not read that they are going to try and acquire company X next quarter, that is a proprietary secret. But that is more like, what will be the USMNT's pressing trigger next match. Not why the coach selected players for the roster. The players are right there for everyone to see. Do Chile care why he selected Baird? Of course not, the only information they need is that Baird is on the roster.

    Prior coaches have answered such questions with, "MLS guys play that position" or "other players are ahead of him". GB had started by talking more to the press and fans as if they would understand more depth. But now he has retreated behind smoke screens of babble that is mostly internally self-contradicting.

    Omar and Morris are outliers that are hard to rationalize, especially Omar. But them aside, you see the identified core of the team being experimented with surrounded by known constants. Nothing wrong with that. But why doesn't GB just say that then? Why talk about Olympics that guys who are at U23 camp will never play, or guys needing more minutes, or guys doing well against a terrible Panama team.

    Just level with us GB. By him not leveling with us we are left with two conclusions:

    1. He is not leveling with us
    2. He really believes these Camp Cupcake holdovers are the best players he could possibly have.
     
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