Lewandowski - the best Bayern striker ever?

Discussion in 'Germany' started by Sportlad, Apr 11, 2017.

  1. Sportlad

    Sportlad Member

    Jul 12, 2016
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Okay, he's only been at the club for two and a bit seasons, but his goal scoring regularity is second only to Gerd Muller in the history of Bayern Munich goalscorers, as this statistical analysis shows - http://www.thestatszone.com/article...-the-all-time-great-bayern-munich-goalscorers

    Given the fact that Lewandowski plays in a more competitive era, there's an argument to be had that he's one of the most lethal forwards in Bundesliga history. That article certainly puts forward a compelling case.

    Thoughts?
     
  2. Gregoriak

    Gregoriak BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 27, 2002
    Bolzplatz
    This is a far less competitive era than in former decades. Bayern is head and shoulders above all other Bundesliga clubs. The team is stacked with players of world class unlike any Bayern team of the past. Bayern never had two wingers of such extraordinary class as Ribéry and Robben, just one point. Bayern faced much stiffer competition in decades past than today.
     
  3. Gregoriak

    Gregoriak BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 27, 2002
    Bolzplatz
    Thus the answer: no.
     
  4. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    This era is not only better, but the best of all time, still players score more now than they have in past 20 years (which, btw, doesn't contradict it).
    It's true that Bayern is way more dominant now than, possibly, ever before, but i don't think Mueller or most of earlier players could cope with modern football, but Mueller was regarded at the time moreso than Lewandowski is now so it depends from which perspective you are sking this question.
     
  5. Super Mario Gomez

    Super Mario Gomez New Member

    Nov 14, 2012
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    I personally would take Muller as our best of all time. Lewa is a great player, but he doesn't have that killer finishing touch Muller had. I would say that from a technical and nutrition aspect, the competition is as tough as ever. The Bundesliga however was way tougher back in Muller's time. More German sides were making deeper runs in Europe. But the defenses of today ship less goals then the defenses of back then as well. As that one poster said, it's a matter of perspective. But I would certainly say Muller should always be considered the best striker in Bayern history.
     
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  6. vlado11

    vlado11 New Member

    Bayern München
    England
    Oct 21, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    Swaziland
    I thinhk, Lewandowski is the second best striker. Gerd Muller was, is and will be the best. Just look at his incredible stats, it can't be beat.
     
  7. Remiggio

    Remiggio New Member

    FC Schalke 04
    Belgium
    Jan 18, 2018
    He's definitely one of the best strikers or centre forwards, whatever you want to call it in the world. There are not many around with his quality...
     
  8. Footballtopscorers

    Footballtopscorers New Member

    Bayern Munich
    Germany
    Dec 23, 2018
  9. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    he cost bayern quite some points this season
     
  10. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    #10 Gilbertsson, Dec 28, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2018
    Gerd Muller is beyond of all Bayern Munchen strikers. He scored 66 goals in UEFA competitions, Lewandowski only 36. Giovane Elber is better than Lewandowski in technical sense. Even Thomas Muller scored more goals for Bayern than Lewandowski and he often plays slightly back, he fights more for the ball.
    The contribution in striking position is also for Arjen Robben.
    Lewandowski is maybe fifth top striker of Bayern.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_FC_Bayern_Munich_records_and_statistics#Goalscorers

    Gerd Muller also had huge impact in German NT, but Lewandowski doesn't bring Poland on some much higher positions.

    K. H. Rumenigge is the second striker of all time.

    I remember Bayern starting from 1994, 1995, all earlier decades are unknown for me in Live sense.
    Statistics is maybe cruel, but it helps. In last periods, Bayern didn't had some strong competition. Other teams were much stronger in 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's than today.

    Bayern today only needs to buy top player from each clubs and they are safe, players like Elber, Goetze, Mario Gomez, Mandzukic, Olic, Lewandowski and they are safe in Bundesliga. This makes other clubs much weaker, that's why we see HSV, Werder, Leverkusen, Schalke on these low positions.

    We need to divide periods in decades and create statistical decision. Modern era starts from 1970 I think. Or maybe since 1960. I prefer 1970. We still compare today's players with Cruyff, Muller, Rossi, not with someone from 50's, 40's.

    Gerd Muller

    Bayern Munich[2][15][16]
    International
    Germany[2][15]
    Individual
    Robert Lewandowski

    Club
    Lech Poznań[151]
    Borussia Dortmund[151]
    Bayern Munich
    Individual
    Records
    International
    Bundesliga
    Bayern Munich
    • Highest number of scored goals in a game by a substitute: 5 (matchday 6 of 2015–16)[8]
    • Shortest elapsed timespan until a scored hat-trick: 4 minutes (between minute 51 and 55 of matchday 6 of 2015–16)[8]
    • Shortest elapsed timespan until five scored goals: 8 minutes 59 seconds (between minute 51 and 60 of matchday 6 of 2015–16)[8]
    • 100 German top flight goals quicker than any foreign player[168]
     
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  11. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    That is a huge, bold statement for which you provided zero evidence. I am not saying you are wrong, but try to explain it without falling into either Begining the question, or Circular reasoning fallacy..

    It's an overused argument that has no foundation in truth whatsoever, but here is the fun part. You, yourself, in listing all of their acheivments, showed that Lewandowski won Bundesliga twice with Borussia Dortmund scoring 22 goals in 2011/12 campaign while competing against Jupp's, back-to-back UCL finalists, Bayern, which, basically, shits (contradicts) all over your points about lack of competition in Bundesliga and Lewandowski having it easy because he plays in dominant team.

    Yeah, it must have been damn hard scoring 7 goals against mighty Omonia in the R16 in 1972/73 season, etc. European cup used to have 3-5 competitive games a season, often teams had no serious competition till the final itself, and you are comparing that to the numbers of, still in prime, 30 year old, Lewandowski in modern UCL?,.. your analysis is biased and superficial as hell and i actually agree with the statement that Gerd is a much greater goalscorer.
     
  12. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    The main evidence is that Bayern Munchen buys top players from other stronger clubs. With that act, Bayern makes them much weaker.
    Niklas Sule, Sandro Wagner, came from Hoffenheim, who is one of threats for Bayern.
    Arrivals of Hummels and Lewandowski should create bad road for Dortmund.
    Goretzka came from Schalke, and they are very weak in last seasons.
    Kimmich came from Leipzig.
    This is their strategy in last 10-15 years. Buy key players of other clubs, so that they lose their power. In Germany, many people started to dislike Bayern, because of that. It seems that players of Monchengladbach resist somehow, I don't see a lot of arrivals from there in Munchen.
    That's why I think that Bayern doesn't have some real competition in Bundesliga. Something similar to PSG and Juventus in their leagues. Bayern doesn't invest so much effort in national league, so that they achieve 15 points of advantage.
     
  13. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    Hummels and Lewa are only proper examples of such behaviour, others had little to no influence on the league. Kimmich was bought from 2nd league, etc. Anyhow, those kind of transfers are not unique to Bayern in Bundesliga. Every big team has been doing it for decades and it almost never has resulted in so dominant team.. that's not what makes them dominant
     
  14. footy14wiz

    footy14wiz Member

    Nov 13, 2018
    I guess so, Lewa was a brilliant signing for Bayern, as it also weakened Borussia, at the same time.
     
  15. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Spanish, English leagues are much stronger, if we compare the intensity of quality. I am sure that Everton, for example, might make a lot of problems in Champions League against top teams. They are 10th at the moment.

    There are six evident top English clubs. Even some others swim in nice amount of money, transfers and highly paid contracts.

    Valencia, 11th team at the moment, also made problems in Champions League.
    Villarreal is 19th, but I could say, that they could end in the knock out stage in one equally distributed group.

    In Germany there are two strong clubs, with several clubs of strong tradition: Monchengladbach.

    German clubs play around their 3-4 top players, they don't have all 11. So, if someone buys one of them, clubs can only sink.

    Serge Gnabry came from Werder. Goretzka, Neuer from Schalke.
    Schalke has now 30 years old GK Fahrmann, obvious decline in quality compared with Neuer in his best seasons.

    I don't see top Bayern players who end in Bremen, HSV, Schalke, Leverkusen.
    Lets not forget Kaiserslautern, who vanished completely.

    Ciriaco Sforza came from Kaiserslautern in Bayern, same as Andreas Brehme.

    Weaker ones left abroad, Asia, Rehagel took Greece NT and Kaiserslautern collapsed.

    New threats for Bayern are Dortmund, Eintracht, Monchengladbach, so we could expect that 1-2 players come from those clubs. Maybe Guerreiro, Witsel...maybe Plea, Akanji, Hazard...
     
  16. Raumdeuter

    Raumdeuter Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    Houston TX
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    This is rubbish.

    Every top club buys players mainly from their league. How is Hoffenheim a threat to Bayern or Leipzig that was in second division

    Of the list of teams you support you have Man Utd

    Valencia, Shaw, Jones, Smalling, Fellaini, Mata, Lukaku, I can name more
    If we take Dortmund,

    Wolf Burki, Delaney, Diallo, Gotze Reus Toljan, Dahoud, Phillip, Reus, Toprak Hitz, are players who were bought from within the league
     
  17. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    When other clubs buy players, like Real, Barcelona, Chelsea, Manchester...they don't harm the league so much, because the quality is pretty much wide in these leagues. In Germany, mostly domestic players play, there are not many expensive players like in Inter, Juventus, Real, Barcelona, both Manchester's, Arsenal, Chelsea, PSG...it's not the same, if Bayern buys from Hoffenheim, or if Manchester City buys from Everton, because Everton will still remain among top clubs, but Hoffenheim could drop easy, if they lose 1-2 players.
    Observe Tottenham, Kane and Alli are injured, bad results started, because they don't have large bench. Bayern is the only club with PSG and Juventus, who will win the national league titles, year after year.
     
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  18. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    whats the point of your comment

    Isnt Bayern 2nd atm while allegedly still doing it? There is no shortage of great players outside Bundesliga that teams, other than Bayern, can buy. Buying from your league is the most common and natural thing to do for two reasons:
    1. You can see a player performing week in week out.
    2. If they are already successful in Germany (for example), it means that adaptation period would be minimal. There is a minimal risk of player becoming homesick and all those off the field issues that often happen. Culture, climite, altitude,.. they all play a part
     
  19. The Potter

    The Potter Member+

    Aug 26, 2004
    England
    Club:
    Stoke City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Has opinion on Lewandowski soured; do more see him as somewhat of a flat-track bully?
     
  20. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Bayern is buying like "drunk millionaire" at the moment. If you don't accept my words, observe Effenberg, who said, that Bayern will buy bus drivers for 5 millions of euros. Instead of buying de Bruyne, Bayern buys Lucas Hernandez for 90 millions USD, for LB player. Now Kovac wants to buy entire French NT.:cool: They are great indeed, buy they can't last more than 5 years.
    At first Hasan Salihamidzic brought Niko Kovac as his friend. Now Salihamidzic says, that he wants to know some answers. Now he is making distance from Niko.:confused: I hoped that Bayern will win the title easy. But defeat against Liverpool and draw against Freiburg is really something bad. I don't like Balkan nepotism, especially if I don't see the value. Salihamidzic - sports director. On what ground, reference? Niko Kovac needs to coach clubs between 5th and 10th position. He doesn't have authority like other great coaches. After 27th round, Bayern is second, without Champions League and they passed barely in German cup against Heidenheim, 6th place in the Second German league.
     

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