Learning to "Vary Your Pace" - Dempsey

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Casper, Aug 3, 2005.

  1. Casper

    Casper Member+

    Mar 30, 2001
    New York
    A popular criticism of Dempsey not being able to "vary his pace" has emerged on another thread. I have never heard of a coach or player wanting someone who does play quickly to learn to "vary their pace" to play more slowly. I've heard tons of people try to get a player to "vary their pace" to play more quickly. I appreciate a player who knows when a possession pass is the right pass as much as anyone. But if there's a problem with Clint, I don't think that it's that he can't "vary his pace." He's got a wider range of pace than anyone else on the Nats behind Donovan and Beasley. He varies his pace more than Reyna, O'Brien, Armas, Lewis, Noonan, Ralston, Mastroeni, Klein, Olsen, Davis, Convey and Zavagnin. Maybe Quaranta and Mapp can vary their pace comparably; Cobi could once do so; Gaven and Adu have the potential to.

    I believe that what people don't like is that he loses the ball more often than they'd like while attacking at top speed. That can happen, particularly against better defenders. But he loses the ball precisely because he is taking chances in the offensive third to go to goal. His confidence in his ability to beat a defender off the dribble at the international level may exceed his ability to execute. But playing slowly in the offensive third is no great shakes most of the time, either.

    I just want to squash what I consider a myth. Dempsey has weaknesses; pace variation isn't one of them.
     
  2. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Please, let's clarify what is meant by the phrase "needs to vary his pace." People are using the words in different ways.

    Is it -

    1) Clint is always rushing toward goal? (Meaning that he is overly direct, doesn't know when to pull the ball back Reyna style & let his team's shape recover.)

    2) Clint always tries to run at top speed with the ball? (Meaning that he's always trying to sprint past guys, doesn't know how to hesitate & feint & pull back so as to get the defender off balance.)

    3) Or both #1 and #2?

    We'll talk at cross purposes until we define the phrase.
     
  3. Heathens '87

    Heathens '87 Member

    United States
    Mar 4, 2004
    Michigan
    Club:
    RSC Anderlecht
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As someone who has criticized Clint for this weakness, I've meant it in the #2 sense from JohnR's post. While he does tend to be a little direct, he hasn't quite figured out how to use his speed and ball skills to create space effectively when moving forward.

    He likes to sprint, but at the international level, he's not going to be faster than many of the defenders he's facing. Cuts, hesitation moves, through balls to himself, give-and-go's with a teammate, etc.. become far more important in the attack.

    Varying your pace is like a change-up in baseball...it's not how slow you go, it's the difference between other speeds and a full-out sprint that throws off timing. If Clint is coming at me as a defender, I'm going to start running well before he arrives at my position to get up to speed where a dispossession is easier as it's harder for him to control the ball at full pace. He'd be better served forcing the defender to come up, and then using his talent and speed in an attempt to move past him, while maintaining control of the ball.

    His habits have been formed by being faster than the opponent at Furman or in MLS. Take that away, and he needs to make a change in approach. He can do these things, and has shown the skills needed. However, incoporating it into his game on a regular basis is not something he's mastered....

    It's not just playing slow....it's using your speed effectively.
     
  4. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    The first one. I also think I might be the first person to use that phrase in the thread so let further explain myself.

    once again, let me say that I haven't seen ay of the Gold Cup matches so I don't know if he has improved on this in the course of those 6 matches.

    Against Panama in the WCQ he came in as a 2nd half sub for a central midfielder as a central midfielder....and immediatly ran himself out of that position into being a forward. He'd recieve the ball, and immediatly attacked. Over and over. Seemingly with a thought. You can't do that at this level. He MUST learn hoe to play at varying paces. Otherwise he's going to pidgeon hole himself and won't be a 90 minute player
     
  5. Dave216J

    Dave216J Member

    Aug 1, 2001
    DC
    Do you think that this is a product of training style or just of opposition? I ask because even our quickest/fastest players, DMB and Landon, both seem to rely on wall passes or sheer speed to beat defenders. They both are successful at it (more so than Dempsey) because they both vary their pace and their timing on runs, and whether they will cut to the end line or the middle. But the only person I’ve seen really use “moves” to beat an opponent, rather than a quick fake to unbalance and then superior speed, is John O’Brien.

    I’d like to see Dempsey learn to do what DMB and Landon do but I’m not sure he’s quite fast enough. He may have the technical skills to emulate JOB, but is that something that can be learned? Does it mean he needs to go to a high-level Euro-league where more of his opponents are better athletes, or is it just a function of practicing/training the new style?
     
  6. StillKickin

    StillKickin Member+

    Austin FC
    Dec 17, 2002
    Texas
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Here you go, straight from the horse's mouth.
    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/writers/grant_wahl/05/09/power.rankings/
    Plus, I've read interviews where Arena was quoted directly saying he needs a change of pace.

    I don't necessarily see it as a slowing down of your overall play; it's that quickness, that burst of speed, slow down slightly as you're coming to the defender, then burst with the ball; or on your runs sometimes, as I've seen Donovan, where he seems to just sort of float, then that quick take-off. I'm not sure, with Dempsey's long legs, he can have such quickness.

    I think that's what I'm meaning when I say change of pace. It's the quickness.
     
  7. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    I have no issue with how Demps beats people or how fast he runs at players. He beats people fine and players should learn how to beat people on the fly in their own fashion, with which they are most comfortable with. And you don't neccasarily have to do it with a dribble, you can do it with a pass. Dempsey can do both, as can Donovan and Beasley ($5 says thats why Arena doesn't want Cunninhgam on the National Team). And he's got adequate speed for the International level.
     
  8. FirstStar

    FirstStar Hustlin' for the USA

    Fulham Football Club
    Feb 1, 2005
    Time's Arrow
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think the issue from Feyenoord is that Dempsey was too predictable with the ball. He's a smart player and needs to learn to play in a style that will maximize his imagination and intellegence. The coaches are asking him to do this- change his pace up and down to make him harder to predict (and thus defend).
     
  9. lmorin

    lmorin Member+

    Mar 29, 2000
    New Hampshire
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "Change of pace," as used in the SI article quoted above, usually refers to insertion of increased subtlety and less predictability in the style of play. That's my interpretation, at least. I do think Clint sometimes presents too clear a view as to what he is going to do next. He is quick and has generally good ball control, so he often gets away with fairly direct play even when the defender has a good idea about the direction of attack. A bit more hesitation, or a slowing, slight change in apparent direction followed by a quick burst might be all that BA is looking for. I've stated my opinion elsewhere that all that's missing from Clint's game is a higher level of sophistication. Increased subtlety would go a long way toward achieving it.

    (I see I have just essentially repeated what FirstStar has said :rolleyes: )
     
  10. Heathens '87

    Heathens '87 Member

    United States
    Mar 4, 2004
    Michigan
    Club:
    RSC Anderlecht
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Thanks....always nice to see that my observations aren't always wrong. ;)


    It's a simple change to make, but when you've played the game a certain way for your entire life, those habits will die hard. I'll say what I said in the other thread - not playing during the MLS off-season, other than USMNT games, would be a mistake for Clint. He should seek a loan where he can play and work on this aspect of his game. He's not going to break his habits without putting new ones into practice.......
     
  11. sidefootsitter

    sidefootsitter Member+

    Oct 14, 2004
    And, as in baseball, the difference between speeds is as important as the absolute top speed.

    Top ball handlers will accelerate quickly, then almost stop, then change directions 90 degrees and accelerate that-a-way.

    Most US players will "round-off" their moves.

    Wide receivers in American football have similar requirements. They have to burst out of their stands, then slow down on a dime when their marker goes into a full sprint and cut into the open spot. They don't cut when their marker is still back-pedaling because this gives the defender a chance to break onto the pass.

    Another key is the sharpness of their cuts. The US soccer players will round off the move here as well. When the ball is at 12 o'clock against the defender, the have to move it to 8 or 9 to keep it out of the defender's reach but they usually just tap it with the outside of their foot to 10:30 and lose the possession. Donovan and Beasley are very bad at it. O'Brien, Cherundolo and Reyna, to their credits, will make a much sharper cut.

    Once again, this is akin to Am. football. A WR has to break sharply and not round off his pattern. They break at basically a right angle (90 degrees) instead of taking a far more shallow change of direction.
     
  12. Fulham Fan

    Fulham Fan New Member

    Apr 26, 2004
    Bay Area
    Agreed about the wide receiver in football analogy. Varying your pace is a way of hiding what you can do. It's to give you the element of surprise. Cunningham caught Fulham by surprise, but he was an unscouted late-game substitute. A top player can go ninety minutes against you and you may still have no idea how fast he is. If he didn't need to show it, you didn't see it.
     
  13. kevbrunton

    kevbrunton New Member

    Feb 27, 2001
    Edwardsburg, MI
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #2 is where I think he needs the work. When my son was U17 and playing in their 2nd season of National League and Super Y, he had a teammate that was blazing fast - like 4.3. Up to the point of playing this level of competition, Nick would just get the ball and take off. He could quite simply blow by just about anyone on the field. Starting with the coach they had for U16 and U17 (who was a D1 college coach), he was constantly harping at him.

    "Nick - STOP is a speed too. So are 1st, 2nd, 3rd & 4th gears. Don't jump right to 5th gear every time you get the ball."

    You also see this from Beasley a lot more now than you used to - probably one of the key things he improved on over at PSV.
     
  14. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    The method for teaching these kids how to change speeds a lot earlier in life than U17 (and thus, probably more effectively) is very simple - play them against older kids. There ain't nobody fast enough to run past smart, athletic defenders who are a year or two older than them.

    But I would guess that at a younger age, his club coaches weren't too worried about that stuff. He was scoring goals and the team was winning games. Player development, U.S. style. :rolleyes:
     
  15. Casper

    Casper Member+

    Mar 30, 2001
    New York
    I think you're all confusing changing speeds with ability to beat someone off the dribble. The analogy to a baseball changeup strikes me as particularly strange - when you're fast, it's not that the defender thinks you're fast but you come at him slow that makes him miss, which is what a change-up does. In soccer, it's the ability to accelerate faster than the defender expects or at a time they don't expect, or an ability to flat out run faster than the defender or pick a better angle that beats him.

    Change of pace in baseball = looks like a fastball, comes in slowly, batter swings too early. Hitting is timing, pitching is disrupting timing.

    Change of pace in soccer = you go fast at an interesting or important time. Clint does this all the time - off the ball, he's constantly completely ditching his defender and getting wide open in the box for a shot. Beating someone off the dribble is the ability to get a half-step on them for a shot or pass; defending someone off the dribble is the ability to keep that space closed.

    And the "Bruce said so" defense just makes me think that some of you were mindlessly parroting what I consider a bizarre comment made by Arena.

    No one has even mounted a challenge at the statement that Dempsey changes his pace more than everyone in our national team pool save Donovan and Beasley. He's interesting because he CAN go fast, and until Quaranta gets better, or Mapp gets a cap, we don't have other players in the pool like that. Would you rather have Dempsey attacking with speed too often, or Reyna never attacking with speed at all?
     
  16. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Put me down as meaning #2 when I mention it. If he's had a problem with #1, he never would get past anybody, even in MLS. Knowing you need toss in those little hesitations when you're dribbling by someone is very, very basic kinda stuff. Hell, a little stutter and go is often one of the first things even kids learn to slide by people.

    Knowing when to slow the game down and when to break out in the attack, however, is a much more high level skill kinda thing. People on this board seem to have some sort of pathological hatred of passes back and square, but when you don't have numbers and the defense is holding their shape and positions well, slowing things down is the necessary play. The best at this find a way to hold possession, swing the ball around, and still maintain some sort of offensive pressure. Right now, Clint pretty much puts his head down and heads to goal. And, I've still yet to see him play for the US where he hasn't missed at least one chance to hit a teammate for an easy shot while doing so.

    Taking chances is great if tyhey pay off with some regularity. Clint has scored some goals, but they have been when he has put in good off the ball work and cleaned up chances. So far, for the US, his risk-taking has produced pretty much nothing but coughed up possesion.
     
  17. jeff_adams

    jeff_adams Member+

    Dec 16, 1999
    Monterey, Ca
    I'm not much of a Cobi Jones fan, but I will admit that his chance of pace was his best asset. Even when defenders knew how fast he was, they STILL took the wrong angle closing him down. He was able to fool them into thinking he was running at top speed. Then, when they committed to tackle him, he'd accelerate even more and leave them behind.

    I think the best way to do this is to shorten your stride. Make you legs look like they are running at full speed, but when the defender comes in to make his challenge, lengthen your stride and pull away. It's probably easier for Cobi because he's so short. Maradona made it look easy as well.

    Of course, even big guys like Marco Van Basten were able to do it....
     
  18. swedust

    swedust Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    Well, I think the baseball change-up comparison is at least worth noting. No, a defender won't miss because you slow down -- the point is it isn't what they expect or get used to looking at your other pitches.

    An organized defense (let alone competent individual defenders) will adjust once they realize that a player is always going to run toward goal full speed when they get the ball. They can even bait such a player into doing so.

    So I guess I'm entering the third leg of the "change of pace" definition: the mental side. If Clint takes three quick steps to get the defender to retreat, then pulls the ball back and makes an incisive pass, the next time the defender might stay higher on him, and he can fake the pull back and go by him.

    (Before I sound like I could be Clint better than he could, I'm just saying I'm interpreting this "change of pace" criticism based on watching him play and where I see room for improvement.)

    So to me change of pace is somewhat of a misnomer for what Clint needs to improve: unpredictability or deceptiveness. He needs to take the same guile he relies on for the trick dribbles and apply it more tactically to open room for passing, shooting, etc., not just to create an opening and charge.

    In summary: I like Clint and I hope he does whatever it actually takes to be a regular contributor for USMNT, whether he proves me right or wrong.
     
  19. Heathens '87

    Heathens '87 Member

    United States
    Mar 4, 2004
    Michigan
    Club:
    RSC Anderlecht
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not quite true with baseball. Take a pitcher like Greg Maddux. Fastball in the upper 80's, yet he has 3,000 strikeouts. But in addition to movement and location, he changes speeds to set up his fastball. It's not just that the change-up looks like a fastball, it's that the batter doesn't know what to expect. The change-up sets up the fastball, making it unexpected and the pace, even if it's mediocre, will be effective.

    In soccer, I think it's quite similar. Go hard when you need to in order to gain seperation, but like baseball, it's movement in beating a man off the dribble, but also using speed, cut backs, hestitation, ball skills, etc... to make your speed more effective. Gaining seperation from a defender doesn't always have to be done via a sprint.

    If Clint were a pitcher, batters would eventually time his fastball, and he'd find himself in the minors until he developed another pitch. Feyenoord told him the soccer equivalent - you've got the speed you need, and if you add movement and variations in speed, you could be in the big leagues. You can't learn to be faster, but you can learn to be more creative in the attack.

    Perhaps there'd be less disagreement if we said that Clint is over-reliant on a direct attack that's largely dependent on pace. We're all nuancing solutions, but there seems to be widespread agreement of the challenge he's facing in getting to the next step in his career....
     
  20. sidefootsitter

    sidefootsitter Member+

    Oct 14, 2004
    Which is why there'd been great dribblers who were relatively slow of foot. Guys like Felix Magath, Hansi Müller, George Hagi, Glenn Hoddle, Paul Gascoigne, Rui Costa, Alfonso, Deco, Tostão were/are not speed merchant.
     

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