It's never too early: A look ahead at the 2012 Olympic pool

I think attitudes on Mexico are changing....................but you have a good point.

Regardless of how well they've played on the World's biggest stage, they haven't made it past the round of 16 in the World Cup since 1986. It doesn't matter how many Gold Cups they win, it doesn't matter that they've won a Confederations Cup, it doesn't matter that they've won the Olympics, it doesn't matter if they've won a U17 World Cup......................there's a category of Eurosnob that will only show you respect if you beat a "big team" in the knockout stages of the World Cup.

 

Senior National Team results don't come in a vacuum. They are a cumulative end result of quality play and comprehensive player development of their youth teams years before them. Name one top international team that had poor youth teams?
Youth teams over years lay the foundation for the Full National Team's to be built upon. Its deductive reasoning but I'm going out on a limb and say that as these players who not only won these youth tournaments but even in losing games play quality soccer, that Mexico will in fact beat a top team in the knockout stages of the upcoming World Cup because of their quality youth play years before and not inspite of it.

 

Italy rarely wins anything in youth toournaments.

 

Actually many of the bigger national teams never win anything on the youth level.

Germany, Italy, England, Spain, Argentina, the Netherlands, Uruguay, Portugal, etc. have never won a U17 World Cup. Most haven't been close.......................

Their kids are being trained at pro clubs to be pro soccer players..............not to win youth competitions. It's not a mutually exclusive goal, though.

 

I have a question for somebody who knows more about Mexico's youth rules than I do.

So they have a rule about having X number of youth players on each gameday roster. Do they have to be Mexico-eligible players?

Many MLS teams have 3 U21's on their gameday rosters. They're simply not US-eligible. FCD, for instance has Fabian Castillo, Ruben Luna, Jonathan Top on their roster tonight. Sometimes they have Richard Sanchez and Bryan Leyva there, who we're developing for Mexico.................

 

We're smarter than that. Its not about winning one U17 youth tournament. Its about quality play and doing well at youth levels. Most of those teams you mention have historically played very well at youth levels. U17 has a disproportionate of teams from outside Europe. Argentnia, Brazil, Portugal, Spain, Germany has won something like 15 of the U20 world cups not to mention the numerous runnerup and top 3 finishes. You can pick and choose your information but the truth still exists that countries with top development systems play quality youth football and that over long periods of time that leads to results and youth victories (not just U17 World Cup champions) and that translates into talent later turning into top full national teams. Europe emphasizes the U21 format and the teams you mention repeatedly are the top U21 youth teams in Europe and the results show it. Spain, Italy, Netherlands, Germany have won 10 of the last 11 U21 Euros. Guess where that talent went.

http://www.uefa.com/under21/history/index.html

 

Oh yeah you're right. My mistake.
The Internet says otherwise.
From 2004: 'Italy claimed their fifth UEFA European Under-21 Championship in seven attempts'
The google is a good thing. Please use it.

 

I agree with you my friend. I just think we overemphasize the results of some of these competitions on these boards.

Consider this. Holland has never even made the semifinals of a U17 World Cup, U20 World Cup, or U23 Olympics. And they're a nation known for their youth development!!! Do they care about these results? I doubt it.................... (They do have greater success at a competition they care about, which as you say is the European U21 championships) When I lived in Europe............you would never, ever hear about youth competitions

I just take some youth results with a grain of salt. Developing players is more important than sheer results at a youth competition.

Who exactly did Mexico beat to win this Olympic title. In the group phase they beat Gabon and Swizerland (& drew with Korea). Then in the knockout stages they beat Senegal and Japan........before beating Brazil.

They beat ONE of the "big boys" of World Soccer. It's why the Olympics can be a bit of a tricky competition. A good draw and all of a sudden you're in the medal round. Does it mean Mexico's on the verge of competing with Germany, Italy, Spain, Argentina, Holland, etc. for World Cup glory? Hell no................

 

You're picking and choosing again. But they did win back to back U21 European championships.
Europe does not get a proportionate amount of spots in youth tournaments. Netherlands got a 3rd in 2005 Peru U17s. Just sayin'.
And I think as Big Soccer fans we overemphasize US results when we lose.

 

Its not just this one tournament. Mexico over the last 4-5 yrs has proven they can play attractive quality winning youth games over a long period from U17 to U20 to U23 and those players grow up.
I say that Mexico is poising themselves as potential competitors to those teams on the world stage over the next few years. If it was a few games, I'd agree with you but Mexico has proven over time that they are in fact developing some top world talent and I guess we'll just have to see if they are Portugal or Spain. I'm just saying that no matter the ultimate outcome of these group of youth players they have laid the ground work to make that jump while other countries can only dream of it.

 

Then how did Pirlo get the golden ball at the 2000 European U21 Championships? Italy has since 1992 won the European U21 Championships 5 times and has the most titles in the competition. The 2006 World Cup winning team featured the golden ball winners of 1996 (Cannavaro), 2000 (Pirlo) and 2004 (Gilardino).

 

I can't argue with that, because you can't argue with success. And Mexico's having it. Of course they probably invest hundreds of millions of dollars more on the sport each year than we do.

We've only been able to promote our youth players to pro teams for a couple of years. I mean, we're in our absolute infancy as far as youth development goes.

We just have to build slowly and steadily. Why slowly and steadily? Because we don't have the level of investment they do in other nations. People come up with all sorts of schemes to improve the game in this country, and many of them involve significant investment. It's easy to spend other people's money. The USSF is a break-even organization. And I bet many MLS clubs are break-even too. I remember the pre-MLS days when the only soccer I could see on tv was late-night games on a grainy Italian-language station. The first live USMNT game I went to we lost to Bermuda. We've made such ENOOOOOOOOOOOOORMOUS progress in the past 20 years, that it bothers me when people act like we're "falling behind." We've been faaaaaaaaaaaaaar behind the big boys for my entire lifetime. It doesn't bother me. Slow and steady..................

 

Funny I always respected your posting, now I'm not so sure anymore. I probably used the wrong words in my post as youth tournaments is a very broad category, but that's a hazard of posting on an iPhone where typing is a pain.

Italy have never finished 4th in a U20 world cup, ever. They have one 4th place finish in the u17s ever.

I'd add some snarky little tag line about googleing stuff, but i find that petty and immature.

 

We'll see soon enough. I have no problem seeing Mexico going deep in Brazil.

 

All of this success Mexico has means nothing. Let's continue discussing whether to call up Lenhart.

 

That's not right. They have both a U20 league and a young player rule. See, for example:

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liga_MX#Regla_22.2F11

You need a place for young players to play regularly, but you also need that bridge into the first team.

 

The U20 World Cup isn't the only youth tournament in the world. Your argument rests on the assumption that the U20 WC is the benchmark for comparison but that is not the case because European countries arguably care more about the U21 Euros than the U20 World Cup.

In Europe,success at the U21 level generally leads to moves to bigger clubs and international selection for up-and-coming players. The last time Italy qualified for the U20 World Cup, they sent the past year's U19 team. The team had barely any professional experience. The most experienced and exciting talents that were age-eligible were playing with older guys at the U21 level because that tournament is more important to the country and features older, higher-level competition.

 

Yes it was a late night petty and immature night for me. I apologize. Its ok to admit a mistake I do it all the time. Europeans don't get alot of U17 spots commenserate with their quality and they do not emphasize U20's they emphasize U21's hence their own championship, not U20's. I did not limit my youth comment to only one's they didn't succeed in I include all of them across the board.
Italy has won alot of U21's making your post incorrect. Again I apologize. What happened to neg rep I should have gotten one for the over the top snarkiness of my post. I should have only used a small amount of snarky. I like alittle sarcasm every once in a while and can admit when I'm wrong. With that said Italy has had alot, ALOT of success at youth tournaments.

 

Mexico is doing both.

Developing players at home and fielding strong national teams in all age competitions.

Not really sure what you're referring to.

Japan was the Asian champ and a team with similar history when it comes to the sport as the US but who has made bigger steps towards improving

Korea ended up being one of the best teams in this tournament and brought a good number of their "A" team players

Gabon was the African champ

Switzerland were runner ups in the Euro U21 championship

Senegal was considered a medal contender after their group stage showing.

ooooo but Holland and France and Argentina weren't there!!!!

Germany, Italy, Spain and the others you mention have an established system in place that helps their players develop while Mexico only started to implement theirs less than three years ago.

The plan was never to win the gold medal in London or any other youth World Cups.

The plan was to make sure Mexico was competitive at all age levels and to finish in the top four of any tournament they played. A plan that was expected to bear fruit in either 2018 or 2022 with a semi final appearance in the senior WC.

The plan is to ensure consistency at all levels and that consistency will be key to any long term growth.

You can save the useless and uninformed comments about Nigeria or Argentina winning Gold at past Olympics since the issues that plague both countries are vastly different to what Mexico faces.

 

Man for a fanbase that just won a historic competition, you guys sure are sensitive.

 

mehh

winning those youth tournaments and a gold medal is not what is impressive, it's the fact that it all happened after the administrative changes that took place less than three years ago.

Those who keep looking for ways to play down what is happening are the sensitive and uninformed ones.

 

............In My Defense is actually one of the good pro-Mexico posters.

I don't have a problem with what he's saying. I just take these kinds of results with a grain of salt.

Mexico invests a hell of a lot more in the sport than we do. The question is why they haven't had results like this for decades.......................

 

I'd say the majority of people here are impressed by Mexico's efforts and results recently and many have repeatedly called to emulate them.

 

My post was equally shitty. I was mostly referring to the world international tournaments but you'd never know that by how badly it was written. You were right to call out the post as terrible.