LOL, I can only wonder what would happen to the collective Brazilian psyche if the Argentina captain lifts the WC trophy this summer...By the way, it is a bane in Brazil's history never to have won the WC in one of the big footballing nations soil, including their own (Sweden, Chile, Mexico, USA and Japan are all good but not footballing powers). Haha, Tarantini's kiss to Maradona's brillo sponge Afro after he was shown the red card had brought tears to my eyes, it was conflicting emotions really. Loved Brazil for their style and they represented South America, but wanted Italy in a sense to avenge Argentina. What I remember from watching that match with father and uncles is the tension throughout it, I was completely exhausted after it was over. PS: If you notice, Argentina's only goal by Diaz occurs because Tarantini takes the ball from Eder right in front of the Brazilian defense, a very similar play to Cerezo's pass being intercepted by Rossi in the second goal. In a way, Argentina in defeat showed Italy the way to beating that great Brazilian side by exploiting it's Achiless heal: a central defense and keeper who were slow to react to a change in direction.
@Giles, for sure I understood you were joking...it was funny...I couldn´t stop myself of saying something about Brazil and Argentina rivalry! I admirise Pipiolo because he really likes the football well played.
@Pipiolo, I have the same question... I suppose thst game you mencioned was hard for people from Argentina ( that time Maradona also showed his great football before...) You are very creative teasing as it´s the first time I listen this kind of argumentation Well, 5x2. I hope the best for Argentina in the World Cup, just not the first place. Sorry! @Giles, look of the kind of conversation between people from this two nacionalities... I hope both national teams ( as all the others ones) show nice football ( for all of us have a good time)...
That's easy: the minute I saw them play. Yes, that second half against the USSR is one to remember. IIRC that was their first game in that Cup. But I have to say, I wasn't so much sad about them being sent off by Italy, but first of all disgusted by the way they did it. I never liked players like Gentile (there are those who like them; I'm not one of them). If they had done it fairly, even by playing catenaccio or park the bus, well, I wouldn't have enjoyed it but wouldn't have minded very much either. Gentile aside, Italy was a good team to watch too and had those beautiful counters (less so against Brazil but in other games). Sandra, if I was you I'd worry more about other teams. Spain and Germany first of all. I can't see Argentina winning it. Of course I could be wrong.
@Pipiolo, I would like to say I liked what you wrote, I agree the 1982 Brazilian names were special, as the team. I laughed when I saw the angry face, good sense of humor! Are you coming to Brazil for the 2014 World Cup?
Well said. Thanks. Unfortunately, it really looks like about the only thing that could be done right now against wrong football decisions is what I did, that is a site to correct the results post-match, as well as it can be done. I know it's very little, but IMO it's still better than nothing. If i didn't think like this I wouldn't have done it. It doesn't look like the governing bodies will want to apply instant video decisions anytime soon. I have this phantasy that some day this idea, or something close (there are some flavors that can be done, they resemble the one I did but there are also little differences) could be done by a reputed ref or group of refs and attract some notoriety. Unfortunately, so far it hasn't been the case.
I understand the love at first sight for that kind of football they played. We are not worried about Argentina, just respect them. Mainly, the fun of the World Cup here in Brazil is specially to support Brazil and about Argentina the opposite in a funny way ( Sorry! Pipiolo. I guess you understand it, the same happen in Argentina, I guess). Fan Video, what a great surprise when Brazil won the Confederation Cup. Before I had the same felling when we went to that final. After the last World Cup we got a not good coach, the Brazilian team was awful ( Corruption and commercial interest came first). We almost stop watching Brazilian national team. It was so serious that a football journalist here wrote that he was in the zoo with his grandchildren, instead of watching Brazil playing against a very weak team that time. We were in 21st or 23rd place, I guess, in Fifa list of best national teams. The coach Felipão entered and started a new job with the team and they had just some days to practise together. I think Spain and Germany are favorites for this World Cup for sure, new team, some of our players like Oscar (very important for the team) are with tecnical problems, although we have passionate fans and playing at home! I think that time( Confereation Cup) Spanish player were not very smart, they didn´t have many experience playing against Brazil and the Spanish press ( and some of their players in interviews) writting that their team was better than Brazilian ones in 1970 and 1982! Come on! They talked about 1982 team! It´s too much, for me, at least! Brazilian are a also latin country (although the only one that speaks Portuguese in América), motivation is very importante, as we are very emotional, Felipão used that. Our coach also remembered when Brazil lost the World Cup in the final of 1950 WC in Brazil. Nightmare! The funny ( that in Marca Spanish newspaper) was that just an Argentine poster warned them not to do that before an important game against Brazil. I´m not saying Brazilian players don´t have skills and that Felipão isn´t usually a good coach, much better than the other one. FanVideo, what´s your nacionality?Are you coming to Brazil for the World Cup?
Romanian. No, unfortunately I won't be there. I'm not that much of a football fan. Besides, our national team didn't qualify. Yes, Scolari is a good coach. He already has a world title. They say nobody was ever able to win a second one, maybe he'll be the first to do it. You're definitely among the favorites. I just hope he doesn't do like Pareira and use the wrong player because everybody wants him (I guess you know who I mean). From what I know Scolari is more stubborn, in a good sense, and does what he thinks is right. Which is what a coach should do. You have to consider that Spain already have done a thing absolutely nobody before them was able to, that is 2 european titles and a world title in a row. So it's understandable if they feel they're very good, which they are. Of course I agree they shouldn't compare themselves with the great teams of the past, first because it's very difficult to compare great teams from different eras, second, that's just not something you do. You have to show respect for the likes of Socrates, Zico and the others. Even if in private you think you're better, which as I said is understandable to some extent, you just don't go public with it. Also, I have to say that that confed cup victory - I wouldn't make too much of it. That's little more than a friendly, usually these things tend to go to the hosts. The world cup will be a completely different matter. I saw a part of that final and Brazil looked indeed very good, and Spain were dominated as I've never seen them before. If that had been a WCup game I would have barely trusted my eyes. But in the confed cup - that's not that much of a wonder. So, as you said, let's hope for a great Cup and hopefully the refs won't influence it in a bad way. And that the best wins it, whoever that is.
@FanVideo, I agree with you: Confederation Cup means nothing, Brazil won the last ones and said good-bye in the middle of that related World Cup competitions. Anyway, talking about the Confederation Cup last year, It was just important to give some credit for the team. After the bad results in the last years and as it was the beginning of Felipe Scolari work we thought the team would lose most of the games at that point. The president of Brazilian Football Confederation (CBF) had also changed then. As a lover of this sport I agree with you: "So, as you said, let's hope for a great Cup and hopefully the refs won't influence it in a bad way. And that the best wins it, whoever that is." As Brazilian supporter, I would like another good surprise. P.S.: I had a good friend from Romenia some years ago. Cheers for Romenia! Interesting, your language also comes from Latin. So, I noticed my friend and I had the same accent speaking English.
Tarantini took the ball off Batista mate not eder !! I remember john motson saying " that should be a reminder to brazil not to be careless against italy"... And brazil were careless in defence but i dont think they had a bad defence just lapses in concentration i thought their achiles heel was serginho ..its quite possible they would have scored more in that tournament with a top forward.. But the thing about brazil 82 was that you always expected them to score ..you always felt that they were Only a moment away from doing something to open up a defence no matter how good the opposition
Well pipiolo talks alot of sense about football and he is unbiased like me.. I like great football from any nation .. What made/ or what makes international football great for me is the contrast of styles ( not so much nowadays because i feel that national teams today more or less play similar styles ) but going back a few years each nation had their own identity .. In recent years italys conveyor belt of talent has hit a drought the same as brazil .. But i enjoyed watching the great italian players just as much as i enjoyed watching the brazilians.. But for different reasons.. I watched brazil for the entertainment and flair and i watched italy for their tactical nous and intelligent team play..you have to admire both styles.. People were bitter towards the italians because they didnt play in the style of brazil !! Which is ridiculous..they played to their strengths . If the italians had tried to play brazil at their own game they would have got slaughtered ! On that day in the sarria stadium italys style of play won the game ( but only just ) on another day brazils style could have triumphed. Take away the brazilian lapses of concentration and brazil would have got to the semis and more than likely won the world cup.. So i dont think there was anything wrong with brazils approach to playing the game - all this talk of their joga bonito style being out of date is complete crap.. All this talk about bearzots tactics exposing brazil is also crap- it was just a game where two contrasting styles went head to head and individual error was the difference
Yeah i know exactly what you mean.. But human error is a common part of the game.. Infact some bad decisions have added drama to epic world cup games. I would love a referee to be allowed to watch instant video replays on the sidelines , but i think it would also ruin the game. It would take away the soul of the game if a referee could watch every incident on a tv screen. The game wouldnt flow. Goal line technology i totally agree with - but too much technology will take the human element out of the game. As we are on the topic of brazil - what about stopyra's penalty for france against brazil in the 1986 penalty shootout.. His shot hit the post and rebounded back into the net off goalkeeper carlos' head ?.. Rebounds do not count in a penalty shootout surely ?
Not sure yet, if I go would be for one week at most. I love visiting Brazil (been there a few times). You're right, it was Batista. But a very similar play in that the DM was a tad careless and the central defense to slow to correct the mistake. By the way, who did Batista replace in that match? He was not a regular starter. That's one of the greatest aspects of international football, how the identity of a nation is expressed in its football. Hopefully the lines do not become totally blurred in this era of globalization.
@FanVideo "And that the best wins it, whoever that is." @giles varley "I like great football from any nation .. What made/ or what makes international football great for me is the contrast of styles ( not so much nowadays because I feel that national teams today more or less play similar styles ) but going back a few years each nation had their own identity ..." @Pipiolo "That's one of the greatest aspects of international football, how the identity of a nation is expressed in its football. Hopefully the lines do not become totally blurred in this era of globalization." I admire everybody in this forum and like to read the posts here because the main focus is the great football. What a great surprise to find this forum, the oportunity to specially read and write a little about it with my enthusiasm ( like everybody here) and a little bit of knowledge about. Of course we always have pleasure to watch the teams or national teams that show interesting games in their own style, if possible. In 1982, for instance, I usually watched URSS games to see their goalkeeper in action with also nice plasticity style. There are always the tradition teams that we want to check and the some non expected teams that play very well in the World Cup and we always want to see their games. I remember some African teams some years ago. I read and learn about different aspects of the 1982 Brazilian team that is provided here. Grateful for that.
Human error should be limited to the players. If we could have perfect refs, it would be definitely great to have them. The challenge is to have instant replays while the game still flows. I have some ideas on the subject on the video ref page of my site. It would be pretty costly so they probably could do it just for the upper rounds of the WCup and Champs League. And I can't be very sure it would indeed work, nobody can be sure of a thing like this before it has been tried out. I'm sure though it would be worth a try. Interesting question. If the ball comes back to the taker and he shoots again, that definitely isn't a goal. But rebounding off the keeper's head - I guess that can count as the same shot. They gave the goal as I understand ? I don't remember it myself. As long as they do it consistently the same way it's OK I guess. (There might be explanations about this situation in the laws of the game, you can look it up if you're interested.)
Yes, it was allowed and considered valid because the ball did not hit the ground after it rebounded off the post - it hit Carlos' back and went in while still in the air. Possibly the only time in football history when it would have better for the keeper to have guessed wrong
Romania once had a great team and great players ... Hagi and vlad the impaler are my favourite romanians..
When we discuss the brazil 82 team we should talk about what made them great instead of looking for their weaknesses and why they lost .. Great teams lose matches - it is the way of football.. But why are brazil 82 still remembered when they didnt even make the semi finals ?.. No other quarter final team in the history of the world cup is mentioned alongside the greats.. It was a special generation.. There were other great players that never made the team or squad in 82 and 86.. Infact the brazilian team from 1980 - 82 and 1985 -86 under santana deserve a thread of their own ! ..i know some people will not be aware of brazils friendly games and world cup qualifiers in these years but the football they played was much the same as it was at the world cups.. the european tour of 1981 are great games to watch vs france england and west germany.. They totally outclass their opponents ..
LOL, it was the only way Argentina was going to stop Zico that day. LMAO...I would add Johnny Weissmuller, Nadia Comaneci and of course Django Reinhardt.
I said I'm not that much of a football fan. Not one to travel on another continent for it. Yes, our golden generation with Hagi, Belodedici, Popescu and a few others. They came within an inch of making the semis in 94. Unfortunately, from then on it went straight down and today we're struggling to qualify and most of the times fail. Corruption, better opportunities elsewhere, you know the story. Our biggest achievement though was winning the Champion's Cup in 86 with Steaua. That's unique for a team from the socialist block. Not even the russians or the jugoslavs managed it, who usually were stronger than us. I'll admit we had a ton of luck winning that cup, Barcelona were IMO a much better team, but we've won fairly as far as I can remember. Nobody was going to favor us, if anything they would have favored Barcelona. But it didn't happen, not too much anyway. Just pure luck, especially at the penalty shootout. And they came back with the silverware. But this was just one time. Other than that Steaua played one more final when they were crushed by Milan in 89 IIRC and then never came close of winning anything else.
Actually, Red Star Belgrade also won the EC, I believe in 91. That team featured Prosinecki, Stojkovic, and Savicevic.
They did. But they weren't actually in the socialist block. Not behind the iron curtain anyway. They were always free to work and travel to the west, much more than us anyway. So yes, I made an error when I said the yugoslavians didn't do it. They did but they weren't actually in the socialist block. Besides, in 91 the situation had already changed in Europe, the iron curtain had fallen. Belodedici also was in that team. He won it first with Steaua in 86 then Red Star in 91. The only 2 eastern teams ever to win it. What an achievement. And he was the first to win it with 2 different teams. Actually, Stojkovici wasn't in that team. Mihailovici and Pancev were. OK, enough about romanian football. Back on topic: I came to answer the question of the thread. It wasn't so much victory for football defensive as victory for dirty football.