italian teams vs epl opponents [R]

How many leagues have more than 4 top level teams who can win a European trophy?

I sure as hell dont know of any.
unless you want to list them .

 

Lol, i love reading your posts sinner78, it helps that your on my side aswell though, if you was bashing us i wouldn't love them very much.

 

I just hate posers who talk trash.
Like the canadian nugget in this thread.
Like the kid in the school yard who tosses rocks from behind the bigger kids.

Reduced to hoping Blatters invents some restrictive rules to make "his boys" more efficient. ooooh

 

Hahaha. I love the guys that get all bent out of shape and start name calling. Well done. It looks good on you.

 

This is hilarious. You're critical because I'm being "selective" about giving the breakdown of the teams involved in this years Champions League but it's okay to talk about the teams that were fielded for the final last year. (2 teams, 1 game). Nice.

I love the sarcasm guys. Keep it up.

See next post for percentages and please...refute them.

 

Afew of Man Utds regular starters are injured .Brown and hargreaves would normally be starters. There are all kinds of factors involved in team selection for recent games.

The 6-5 ruling is never going to happen. If it did happen the teams would have afew years to prepare for it anyway. Your dream of having restricted team selections likely wont happen.

 

Sorry for the long post but it's just numbers.

These numbers don’t include players out on loan. Below you will find the number of players represented on each team from their respective country. The “impact” players are of course up for debate so you can take them with a grain of salt, if you like.

Liverpool- 7 of 31 English. 23%
2 of which are impact players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liverpool_F.C.#Current_squad


Chelsea- 6 of 27 English. 22% .
4 of which are impact players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chelsea_F.C.#Current_squad


Manchester United 13 of 37 English. 35%
7 of which are impact players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_United_F.C.#Players


Arsenal. 6 of 32 English. 19%
1 of which is an impact player.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arsenal_F.C.#Players


Roma. 12 of 26 Italian. 46%
8 of which are impact players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.S._Roma#Current_squad


Milan. 13 of 29 Italian. 45%.
9 of which are impact players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Milan#Current_squad


Inter. 7 of 28 Italian. 25%
3 of which are impact players.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F.C._Internazionale_Milano#Players

Juventus. 14 of 28 Italian. 50%.
9 are impact players. (that’s a very conservative count)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juventus#Current_squad

This also shows that Inter might as well be playing in the Premiership because lord knows they're a sorry excuse for an "Italian" team.

Now these are the current rosters for these teams. So please tell me, besides the stadiums they play in, and the supporters that fill those stadiums, what exactly makes those Premiership teams English?


Sidenote: Managers

Arsenal-Wenger (French)
Liverpool-Benitez (Spain)
Chelsea- Hiddink (Dutch)
Man U-Ferguson (Scottish)
National Team- Capello (ITALIAN)

Roma-Spaletti (Italy)
Milan-Ancelotti (Italy)
Juventus-Ranieri (Italy)
Inter-Mourinho (Portugal)
National Team- Lippi (Italian)

If this is a straw man argument then prove it. Show me some info that would indicate that the strongest teams in the Premiership are not managed by, and filled with people "other than" the English.

 

It's not my dream. I'm okay with the current state of club football. I also like to watch a few teams in the Premiership. I just don't like it when people start to beat their chests about the football prowess of their nation when it's obvious that said nations involvement in the success is negligible in most cases.

I WANT England to do well in International competitions. I think it would be great for the game and it's very much needed and missed. The sad fact is that they have not yet done so, and to misinterpret the success of the Premiership big 4 in Champions league as a victory for English football is very dangerous. It will, and HAS given many English supporters a very real false sense of superiority and more importantly, security.

Let's hope Capello can fix things.

I'd also like to note that this whole dialogue is all in good fun and I harbour no ill feelings towards any posters here. I will not call you names, and if you feel the need to do so, save it. It doesn't piss me off.

 

Whats that part about "impact players"?
Inter Milan sure as hell doesnt have 3 Italian impact players.
They have completely dominated Serie A for 4 years with a squad of imports.
They are the leagues premier team by far. The Italians they have a bit part players who rarely see the field.

Milan are the only high level team manned by a decent amount of Italians with any kind of legible success.
Unless you want to tell me what Roma and Juventus have won in the last decade with their "homegrown" teams. They havent won shit ,buddy.
Roma are nothing.

Having a team full of italians is over-rated ,as their teams results have shown.

 

The teams are moving in the right direction with a balance of home/imports.
Arsenal have got a high level crop of youngsters coming up. I think Liverpool are the only team who can really be compared with the inter milan situation.
The core of Man Utd and Chelsea is homegrown.



6 out of a 11 starters in the final!!!
thats not shabby at all.
And not how you paint it...

Comparing international to club football is a straw man.
Germany ,Brazil and Argentina are historically the best national teams I think you would say. Their leagues are way down the pecking order.

 

You're absolutely right on most points.

Inter have Balotelli, Santon and Materazzi. I only classified them as "impact" players because they play on a semi regular basis. I did the same for all the other teams. That's why I said you can take the "impact" thing with a grain of salt.

As for Roma and Juve. They haven't won much recently but they are still among the better teams in Europe...definitely not the elite though.

I don't get why you get so angry about this stuff. Yes, Roma and Juve have done very little in Europe...JUST LIKE ARSENAL AND CHELSEA...so what's your point?

You may be right about having a team full of Italians and it being over rated but at least, when a team like Milan does well I can say that it's at least in part, due to Italian players.

How does it feel when you don't even have one manager of prominence at the helm of one of those premiership teams?

I think England has some great players. (especially Gerard. One of the best on the planet). Unfortunately the English are really poorly represented on the best "English" teams.

It's sad to say but I really think that Man U, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal are successful, but not because of English players. The numbers prove it.

(And before some of you guys start digging up stats and team make up from the past decades...don't bother. It goes both ways and if we start bringing up the past England starts to look even worse)

 

What part of 6 out of 11 starters for the Champions do you not understand? That is a nice representation. To think in the biggest game on club level, 6 out of the 11 on the field for Manchester United were English. You really are quite dense aren't you...

 

That's a fantastic picture Sinnie. Worth another look.

 

I'm not saying that the Serie A teams are better than the Premiership teams because the Italian National team is better than that of England. That would be a straw man argument.

I'm saying that the best teams in England have very little to do with English players, managers or ownership for that matter.

Please look at their rosters and tell me otherwise.

The core of Man Utd and Chelsea is homegrown.

I guess our definitions of "core" must be different.

 

Arsenal and Chelsea go deep year after year.
Roma and Juve are 2nd round fodder these days and have been for afew years.
No comparison really. if you say that Roma has a record identical to Chelsea than you clearly dont watch any football.

Just as I can say manchester utds success was part down to their English players. Or are their 6 regular starters just passengers??? hmmmm dont think so.
Manchester utd are probably the best team in the league and they have a solid home core. Where as Italys league is bossed by a team of imports.

How does it feel that the italian leagues only foreign manager is cleaning up?

 

Yes....it was a good showing last year but if that's your only argument then I'm sorry...it's just not good enough. What about this year? What about next year? What about Liverpool and Arsenal last year? It seems that I'm not the only person who tends to get "selective" when trying to prove a point.

I've posted the numbers and percentages and you've said nothing. You know why?

Because now that those figures are right in front of you I would imagine that you are speechless. Please refute those numbers.

The fact remains that for every English player on one of the big four, there are 3 or 4 and sometimes 5 foreigners.

Prove me wrong, please.

 

He isn't, and he isn't.

 

It feels terrible. It's a shame. Inter are a blight on Italian football from top to bottom.

Theres the difference my friend. A guy like Mourinho comes to Italy and almost everybody (Inter fans exluded) think he's an idiot and over rated.

He comes and runs one of your teams and you call him "the special one".

There's the difference between you and I. It makes my stomach turn to see something like the current state of Inter.

You on the other hand see a team owned by foreigners, managed by foreigners, and made up (65% and up) of foreign players and jump and scream about how strong English football is. What a joke.

Again...yes...the Premiership 4 are among the best club teams on the planet (i would also include Barca)...just don't tell me that they're "English" because the facts show otherwise.

 

Core meaning their key performers.
Every team has a spine of 4 key players in each position..
For example ,man utds spine is probably...............

Man utd - Ferdinand ,Carrick ,Rooney ,Scholes

If you say these players are non contributors to the teams success than I cant take anything you say seriously.

 

You've proven yourself wrong by delivering some extremely over the top babble. I know it hurts to see so much English still left in the Champions League, and so little of the Italian club representation. Deja Vu eh..

 

I'd much rather the poster explain the intricacies of ice fishing, or curling personally..

 

All the top teams are well stocked with imports.
Doesnt matter if you list Bayern, Inter, Real madrid or whoever!!!!
They all have imports from all over the globe.

If Inter Milan won the champions league it would be a win for Italian football despite the imports!!! It would go down as a win for Serie A.

 

Im wasting my time on this I can tell.
Just regurgitates the same rhetoric each time.
Apparently no english players will get their hands on the champions league!!!
Tell to that to the 6 guys who have CURRENT winners medals ,duuuude.

 

Of course those guys are integral to the team. Just don't forget to mention Van Der Sar and Ronaldo. (although they didn't look great today). They're pretty important too.

Truthfully, if the other 3 big clubs in England were at least built like Man U it wouldn't be so bad. The sad truth is that they're not and the "English domination" talk stems from all 4 teams doing well.

 

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You've almost figured it out.

If Inter won it would be a win for Serie A, but not Italy. Not Italy because Inter is a sad example of an Italian team. They are an Argentinian team with Italian fans.

Just like...(insert whichever "English" team wins this year)

A win for the Premiership has nothing to do with a win for England. Sorry but it's just my opinion.