Is Zico the best Brazilian Footballer? (Pele not included)

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Mibu Clan, Jul 24, 2006.

  1. Rivelino87

    Rivelino87 Member

    Aug 10, 2008
    Boston, Ma
    Club:
    Atletico Belo Horizonte
    I agree with all minus the first suggestion. I think Wright's performance in for your team Flamengo in that game is a little more impressive than Zico's! ;)
     
  2. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    That's pure Atlético whining.

    In two games against Flamengo Reinaldo deserved to be laid off (too bad he was such a temperamental guy, although a genius).

    In the 1980 Brasileirão final when he aggressively challenged a referee's decison about an off-side that really hadn't existed but which wouldn't result in goal for Atlético anyway.

    And in the 1981 Libertadores when he cowardly tackled Zico.

    In both opportunities there was nothing to do but give him a red card - too bad for Atlético, because he was being fundamental.

    Besides I was talking about Zico's performance & not about the referee's.

    And that was unreproachable.:rolleyes:
     
  3. Rivelino87

    Rivelino87 Member

    Aug 10, 2008
    Boston, Ma
    Club:
    Atletico Belo Horizonte
    I was joking, hence the smiley... However, whining?

    To say that Reinaldo deserved to be sent off, or that the tackle was cowardly is disgraceful, regardless of being a Flamengo supporter or not. In '81 Libertadores he went for the ball and the trailing leg came up after Zico had already tripped - even if it was a scissor tackle at the time there were many players that got away with alot worse without even a yellow. But what a better chance to send the team's best player off?

    Secondly, He takes the ball from the Atlético player as he's going by and sends him off when he accidently bumps into him to get the ball, then he makes no attempt to get the game under control and sends off the entire team!Wright is from Rio, and you can't tell me that it wasn't unprofessional to have him be in charge of a game involving the state's and Brazil's biggest team during its golden age.

    O Flamengo talvez não precisaria, mais o jogo foi roubado sim com cara de pau. E qual jogador que não discute com um bandeira quando ele erra um impedimento em uma final, independente do poderia acontecer?

    We can take this to another thread if you wish to argue against the obvious. Wright is sempre Flamengo.

    As far as Zico, and I don't wish to derail the thread. I'm not sure if he is Brazil's best footballer after the king, personally. I would have to say Garrincha as well, regardless of them playing different positions. It gets very hard when talking about Brazil, but to me he is the best Brazilian after my personal hero, Rivelino (behind the two) - whom on a sidenote I'm pretty sure Maradona considers to be the best Brazilian player. It's almost as if graceful footballers get all the credit, not that Zico doesn't deserve it.
     
  4. Rivelino87

    Rivelino87 Member

    Aug 10, 2008
    Boston, Ma
    Club:
    Atletico Belo Horizonte
    I was joking, hence the smiley... However, whining?

    To say that Reinaldo deserved to be sent off, or that the tackle was cowardly is disgraceful, regardless of being a Flamengo supporter or not. In '81 Libertadores he went for the ball and the trailing leg came up after Zico had already tripped - even if it was a scissor tackle at the time there were many players that got away with alot worse without even a yellow. But what a better chance to send the team's best player off.

    Secondly, He takes the ball from the Atlético player as he's going by and sends him off when he accidently bumps into him to get the ball, then he makes no attempt to get the game under control and sends off the entire team! Wright is from Rio, and you can't tell me that it wasn't unprofessional to have him be in charge of a game involving the state's and Brazil's biggest team during its golden age.

    O Flamengo talvez não precisaria, mais o jogo foi roubado sim com cara de pau! E qual jogador que não discute com um bandeira quando ele erra um impedimento em uma final, independente do que poderia acontecer?

    We can take this to another thread if you wish to argue against the obvious. Wright is sempre Flamengo.

    As far as Zico, and I don't wish to derail the thread. I'm not sure if he is Brazil's best footballer after the king, personally. I would have to say Garrincha as well, regardless of them playing different positions. It gets very hard when talking about Brazil, but to me he is the best Brazilian after my personal hero, Rivelino (behind the two) - whom on a sidenote I'm pretty sure Maradona considers to be the best Brazilian player. It's almost as if graceful footballers get all the credit, not that Zico doesn't deserve it.
     
  5. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I'm sure...

    ...he isn't.:p

    Ahead of him I'd put Leônidas da Silva, Zizinho, Jair da Costa Pinto, Garrincha, Didi, Rivelino, Tostão.

    Tying with him Zito & Gérson.

    The rest trails him (including Reinaldo, a genius).;)

    As far as Wright & the 'roubo', let's forget it, OK?...

    When Reinaldo was sent off in 80 it was already at the end of the game (31') & besides he kicked the ball against the Flamengo player: red card direct, no discussion.

    Hadn't the ref done that & the game woudn't end up.

    Atlético had a fantastic team & Flamengo too, but in both games Flamengo played better and deserved to win.

    Atlético bunkered & counter-attacked (very efficiently BTW) - Flamengo was all attack.

    I was there in 1980 in the row of chairs closest to the field & right behind the corner flag where Nunes ball entered - in my Flamengo shirt I (electrified) saw Nunes ball entering the net & coming right in 'my' direction, as if Nunes were saying to me: 'Here is a present to you, mate'...

    It's never too much to remember it:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzhErbBEefU&feature=related"]YouTube - 1980, Flamengo 3x2 Atlético MG, Nunes.[/ame]
    37' of the second half. I was seating at the field level right behind the corner flag (at the right of screen)

    Right after that Atlético almost scored the tying goal they needed to be champs.

    What a fantastic game (in my totally 'unsuspicious' opinion, the best Brasileirão final ever).

    It could have gone either way: if only Reinaldo hadn't blown it...

    I know it hurts, bud - and when it hurts we whine...

    See Chelsea with Barcelona? Absolutely normal :p ...

    Another great clip of that game:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsEtWiNYnOI&feature=related"]YouTube - Flamengo 3 x 2 Atlético-MG [Brasileiro 1980 Flamengo Paixão][/ame]
     
  6. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    And in that game the referee was not Wright ;) ...
     
  7. Bugre

    Bugre New Member

    Jul 24, 2009
    Campinas
    Club:
    Guarani Campinas
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Garrincha said Hi!
     
  8. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Wright é tricolor assumido. Só pra constar...
     
  9. Sinestro

    Sinestro New Member

    Aug 18, 2009
    USA
    Club:
    Corinthians Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    After Pele...
    Ronaldo
    Garrincha
    Zico
     
  10. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Don't remember if I posted mine, but there we go::D

    Pelé
    Garrincha
    Leônidas da Silva
    Didi
    Zizinho
    Nilton Santos
    Domingos da Guia
    Fausto
    Gérson
    Tostão
    Rivelino
    Carlos Alberto
    Djalma Santos
    Zico
    Zito
    Falcão
    Jairzinho
    Canhoteiro
    Sócrates
    Romário
    Ronaldo

    In this order...

    Add Gilmar as a goalie and we can form 2 great offensive teams.

    Gilmar
    Carlos Alberto-
    Domingos da Silva-Nilton Santos
    Didi-
    Zizinho
    Garrincha-Pelé-
    Leônidas da Silva-Tostão-Rivelino

    Gilmar
    Djalma Santos-Nilton Santos
    Zico-Gérson-Zito-Sócrates (Falcão)
    Jairzinho-Romário-Fausto (Ronaldo)-Canhoteiro


    In blue all primarilly Flamengo players (played in other teams but were raised and/or had their apex in Fla - only exception was Gérson who was raised in Fla but had his apex in Botafogo).

    And of course Friendereich (arguably the greatest capocannonieri of all times) as 'godfather' :D ...
     
    Marius Tresor repped this.
  11. Sinestro

    Sinestro New Member

    Aug 18, 2009
    USA
    Club:
    Corinthians Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Very good list. No Cafu? Good to see that you give respect to the past players.
    Love the RoRo combo. Man when they played together they made that field look like a beach party.
     
  12. arun10

    arun10 Member

    May 31, 2005
    Looks like Zico is sacked as CSKA MOSCOW coach....:eek::eek::eek:
     
  13. arun10

    arun10 Member

    May 31, 2005
  14. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    No. Crooks from within our club have forced him out by falsifying stories and threatening his family.
     
  15. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    Must be careful when you have a woman president!!! ;)
    (note- this will not be the case with Dilma!)

    g1.globo.com:

    "02/10/2010 07h05 - Atualizado em 02/10/2010 07h05
    Ao elenco, Zico desabafou: 'Sempre me senti enfraquecido pela presidente'
    Ex-diretor também teve problemas diretos com outros aliados de Patrícia Amorim nos quatro meses em que ficou na Gávea"
     
  16. IVO !

    IVO ! Member

    Feb 25, 2009
    RIO AND CHICAGO
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    It is really sad to see my querido Mengao is in such a crisis situation. I knew something was desperately wrong when the coach was fired, right after winning the Brasileirao last year. When have you ever heard of firing a coach after winning one of the most difficult leagues in the world? And at the same time terminating Adriano and Love without any suitable replacement! I never knew Amorim, but she seemed fine for the position, after all she was raised in Mengao. But apparently, I was wrong. I feel so bad for Zico. I know Zico personally as he has his escolinha only a few blocks from my house in Recreio. Zico is a great, intelligent, humble guy. So maybe, Zico is right here. But hopefully eveything will work out and we will go back on track, but things now are a mess!
     
  17. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    We all share your feelings here about Zico, one of the greatest heroes of Brasil futebol....
     
  18. Rivelino87

    Rivelino87 Member

    Aug 10, 2008
    Boston, Ma
    Club:
    Atletico Belo Horizonte
    Apesar de odiar o Zico por ter jogado no Flamengo, e ter participado da robalheira contra o Galo, me sinto...não sei, o futebol e bruto! Não sinto nada por ele. Que volte para o Japão. O Rivelino foi melhor!

    Galinho, velho!
     
  19. Louis Soccer

    Louis Soccer Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Apr 17, 2017
    TOP TEN BRAZIL
    1. Pelé
    2. Garrincha
    3. Zico
    4. Ronaldo Nazario
    5. Ronaldinho
    6. Romario
    7. Didi
    8. Zizinho
    9. Tostao
    10. Friedenreich
     
  20. omajac

    omajac Member+

    Feb 9, 2002
    East Orange, New Jersey, USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    No Vava? :eek:
     
  21. Louis Soccer

    Louis Soccer Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Apr 17, 2017
    No, Rivelino, Rivaldo, Ademir, Kaka, Bebeto, are in front.
    Vava is at the level of Coutinho, Careca or Roberto Dinamite.
     
  22. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Ronaldinho above Romario ? Only for European fans.
     
  23. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    Great players almost never mentioned in these types of lists:

    Rivaldo, Gerson, Jairzinho, Nilton Santos, Djalma Santos, Zito, Rivelino, Socrates, Falcao, etc
     
    Marius Tresor repped this.
  24. Marius Tresor

    Marius Tresor Member

    Aug 1, 2014
    Pele,

    Garrincha,

    ...the rest.

    Has anybody else been to the Pele museum in Santos and seen that great display with the life-sized cutouts of Pele and Garrincha running together where you can stand between them? I think it was from the first game at the 1962 World Cup, before Pele got injured and it looks like the two of them are running to pressure a defender who has the ball. What an imposing sight that is!
     
  25. Doc_Exec

    Doc_Exec Member

    Jul 7, 2004
    In these latest discussions, one name did not come up, i.e., of rubber man Leonidas. And Vava's absence should not irk anyone. Sure, he scored goals in WC finals. As an example, Geoff Hurst did the same. But people regard Bobby Charlton far more highly.
     
    old_carioca_in_nyc repped this.

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