Getting a Cup of Joe: Gyau in Sweden

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by FirstStar, Feb 8, 2012.

  1. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  2. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Joe played the last half hour. Little after he came in, Arminia was reduced to 10, so Duisburg managed a goal that was only enough for a tie. With this result, they're virtually relegated and Gyau becomes Yank #4 going down this season (after Ream, Williams & Wood).
     
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  3. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
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  4. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    damn nice goal....

    Since he's already shown well with the full USMNT (czech rep, ecuador, etc) and he seems to be fully healthy....I wish he would get a call-up.

    A healthy Gyau is much better than some of the recent wide-mids that have played for USMNT.
     
  5. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    This was his first start since February, so I'd pump the brakes on anything related to the national team.

    Plus, 2 goals and an assist for the worst team in the 2.Bundesliga doesn't scream "must call up" to me.
     
  6. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #1806 adam tash, May 5, 2019
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
    idk - he got injured while playing on grass over turf - WITH THE USMNT - (an issue with the upcoming Gold Cup tune-up in Cincy apparently)...that injury is the only reason he is in the second division now...he was on the fringes of Dortmund at the time.

    to me he seems "back" based on the last couple of performances.....

    If he had never played for USMNT before (and looked good while doing so) - I would agree that he needs to "earn it"...but in this case I would call him up over players like baird arriola morris etc who have never looked as good on the wing as gyau has for the USMNT. i mean jonathan lewis is barely making the 18 in MLS...
     
  7. DrakeSC

    DrakeSC Member

    Aug 28, 2017
    #1807 DrakeSC, May 5, 2019
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
    He played 112 minutes for the NT in the post-WC friendlies almost five years ago. that was several coaches ago, and he suffered a major injury in the mean time. He's played 600 minutes above 3L in the last five years, he should be viewed as a blank slate at the NT level IMO.
     
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  8. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    If Duisburg doesn't go down, it'd be an amazing save. They were given for dead until recently.
     
  9. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    he got injured with the USMNT.

    it wasn't "in the mean time"...and he looked better than many of the current/recent options...and he's only 26.

    unlike MANY of the current pool....Gyau has actually played well in a USMNT jersey.

    Has Roldan?

    2 bundesliga players julian green, andrew wooten, bobby wood, terrence boyd etc etc have played for the USMNT recently....

    if i was picking a 23 for a must-win match tomorrow....i wouldnt be picking arriola, baird, lewis, ebobisse, morris zardes etc over gyau at wide mid.

    i understand the logic of not calling him up based on league (though are you really sure that MLS is better than 2BL?)....but i feel like this is special circumstances.

    If he sucks and cannot compete then what is the loss?

    if ben sweat and lovitz can get callups ...i can't see why not gyau.
     
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  10. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    And he's soon to be a 3.Liga player. Also, those guys have all blown ass for the US, so that's not a ringing endorsement of the 2.Bundesliga's quality.

    Yes.

    The next call-up opportunity is a continental championship, so kind of a lot.

    If you're advocating that he be called up for a friendly, sure, screw it, see how he fares.

    They play a position of total weakness with no alternatives, so trying shit out makes sense. There are other options on the wings for the US that haven't really been tested that should be there before Gyau; Weah and Tyler Boyd come to mind most quickly.
     
  11. randomnoise

    randomnoise Member

    United States
    Mar 26, 2017
    #1811 randomnoise, May 6, 2019
    Last edited: May 6, 2019
     
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  12. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    1. idc what league a player is in...merely how good they are. there's bad players in good leagues and good players in bad leagues...league doesn't = level AS A RULE...like you seem to imply.

    2. gold cup is lame in my opinion....even if you give it great importance...i'm not on-board with the idea that more important matches MUST mean more conservative rosters...i actually hate that convention. soccer isn't chess...it's not THAT complicated that a professional left winger cannot jump into the national team at his club position.

    3. yeah...i'm all for him being in a friendly match. i think it would be fair...considering his history with the USMNT....he should get the "jordan morris treatment" too....

    4. i think there are a bunch of other options on the wing - i wanna see holmes, boyd, mueller etc

    5. i'm not saying he's a no-brainer MUST callup instead of all other players...he's not. but considering the other callups at his position....i dont really see those players as verifiably better...and i'd like to see him get a chance to prove he is better than a 2/3 liga player.

    6. you can be sure that mls is better than 2bl but the mls players in the usmnt lately have all basically laid eggs all day.

    7. there's other option besides sweat and lovitz...i can think of 15 left backs i'd rather see than those 2. but my point isn't about them...its about gyau being worth a flier.

    8. weah isnt a winge, imo...he's a striker.
     
  13. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    There can be exceptions, but Gyau is a guy bouncing between the lower edge of the 2.Bundesliga and the 3.Liga. If he was better than that, someone else would have picked him up by now.

    If you discount the continental tournament then I genuinely don't see the point of rooting for a national team.

    Great, no one said that. Calling up a guy who isn't a national team-caliber player to a tournament with a limited roster is stupid though.

    He's had that chance at club level every week for years and hasn't proven that.

    Doubling down on bad call-ups is a bad strategy. Though Sweat and Lovitz were the two best-performing American left backs in MLS last season that don't have one foot out the door to the retirement home, so putting 15 guys above them is pretty funny.
     
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  14. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #1814 adam tash, May 7, 2019
    Last edited: May 7, 2019
    i think you need to review this player's history.

    he made the 18 for dortmund 5 times appearing once...he's not a "3 liga player"

    how many 2/3 liga players have EVER made the 18 for a club like dortmund?

    the issue with him has only been health. he's healthy now.

    in his last 2 highlights ...he's literally blowing by defenders in 2 bl like they arent there. and just scored a great goal from outside the box.

    if his speed and athleticism are there...there's no reason to think he has somehow regressed tactically or skill-wise from the player who was on the 18 for BVB 5 times and subbed in once. he only left that club because of severe injury...not performance.

    look at aron johansson. similar sitautions...in my opinion. no bundesliga team is likely to buy AJ...but when healthy AJ has shown he is clearly a good bundesliga player. its just not a sound move for a bl team to buy aj at this point....its not about his quality though. same thing with gyau in my opinion. a bundesliga team will shrewdly shy away from any player with such an injury history....but the idea that gyau is a "3rd liga" player is just ridiculous.

    just looking at the skills necessary at wide mid. ...speed? check. dribbling ability? check. shooting? check. crossing? check. good in possession? check. tactical awareness? check.

    on the other hand...lets look at recent players like zardes, yedlin, ebobisse, arriola etc they don't have the necessary skills for a wide mid....arriola doesnt score or assist (kinda important!), yedlin cannot cross shoot or score (kinda important) ebobisse is a striker and is not a winger, etc

    you realize we are facing a lineup in gold cup of arriola and yedlin as the wide mids, right???

    i'd rather callup players like ariybi or lyndon gooch or tillman or sabbi or de la fuente or amon or mueller or holmes..... before some of the options that have featured at wide mid lately for usmnt...and would have zero problem with a 1 game audition for gyau. that's all i'm saying. at least he has the necessary skills for the position...especially speed dribbling and shooting....which mnay of the other options don't.

    i'd rather try a "new"unproven player than a player who has proven to not have the necessary skills.

    you seem to say the player must prove beyond shadow of a doubt that they deserve a shot...but at the same time do not hold the players currently getting shots (but not meeting the standard!) to the same criteria.
     
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  15. munichfan9

    munichfan9 BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Aug 7, 2005
    Burke, Virginia
    Just off the top of my head, Ryo Miyaichi was at Arsenal and is in 2. Bundesliga, Julian Green from Bayern now at Greuther Furth, Felix Platte is at Darmstadt now and was at Schalke previously. I also am pretty sure there are quite a few other Bayern youth flameouts in the lower Bundesliga. There are also players in the lower leagues of England that used to be at top clubs as youths that just moved on to lower level teams.
     
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  16. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    oh it does happen.

    i think a distinction should be made when it happens b/c the club just didn't rate a player (like green) or when a catastrophic injury forced a club to move on despite rating a player (like gyau).
     
  17. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    This is not the place for NT discussions, but we do need a left winger. Since we already gave Saief a shot, and seeing that Joe has finally recovered his speed (his best attribute), I wouldn't be opposed to giving him a try, before he gets hurt again.
     
  18. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    With Ingolstadt solidly beating Darmstadt 3-0, all hope is gone and Duisburg is going down (and losing at home 3-4 to Heidenheim to finish last in the 2.BuLi).

    Thus, Joe Gyau becomes officially our fifth Yank Abroad to go down this season.
     
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  19. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    You're underestimating the effects of injury.

    Since Gyau was hurt, he has had one good, healthy season. That was 2017-18, in the 3.Liga.

    He has spent this season either injured or as a reserve for the last-placed team in the 2.Bundesliga.

    So, barring a transfer, (and who's going to buy him with his injury history?), he's headed back to the 3.Liga next season which, again, is the only league he has had any success in since sustaining his injury.

    If all of this doesn't describe a "3.Liga player," I really don't know what does.
     
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  20. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    There are dozens. Just to take the Julian Green case, back then so many of his fanboys were saying that "maybe he'll turn out like Gianluca Gaudino and get some starts". Well, yes. Gaudino is now, sort of, playing in Switzerland for Young Boys after 6 months without a club. I say "sort of" because, with 290 minutes in 10 appearances since joining in February, his option is unlikely to be picked up.

    Of the Bayern players who were under 22 in 2016-17 (Green's last season), only Coman and Sanches are still there, and only two others (4th choice GK Weinkauf and Felix Gotze) are still in BL1. The others are squad players in BL2 or mid-table sides in the Austrian BL.

    It happens everywhere. The step-up in level from being "one of the best U20s in Germany" to being "good enough for BL1 relegation fodder" when every year brings a fresh crop of "young men most likely to succeed" is enormous. Staggeringly few make it.
     
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  21. Bruce S

    Bruce S Member+

    Sep 10, 1999
    I’m not sure not making if from BM youth to 1st team qualifies as a flameout. Most don’t make it.
     
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  22. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    the attrition rate is indeed very high....but how high is it for players who actually see the field for a team like bayern or bvb?

    obviously the players who never get on the pitch are liekly not going to be in the top teams...but i would imagine that for those players who actually do make the becnh/see the pitch multiple times that their outcomes are substantially better....even if they don't end up sticking at their mega-club.
     
  23. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  24. zlatan_but_a_car

    Botswana Meat Commission FC
    United States
    Oct 16, 2017
  25. m vann

    m vann Moderator
    Staff Member

    Colorado Rapids, Celtic FC, & Louisville City
    Sep 10, 2002
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Celtic FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting inclusion in the 40-man roster. No way he makes the final 23 but a nice feather in Joe's cap. I'll be honest, I've kinda of lost track of Joe this season. I know Duisburg were relegated but how was his individual season?
     

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