General discussion of how YA are perceived and valued (pulled from Pulisic thread)

Whatever they paid for Dempsey they overpaid. He is a very good player that is a lousy teammate and doesn't make teams better. They were happy to get rid off him. EPB wasn't going to take any offers after being the MVP, his agent knew the timeline. I don't see much of Brooks from BL, but apparently he is highly rated. There is not a single American player in MLS now worth more than $3M. That's why our NT sucks. 18 yo Jozy was sold for $10M.

 

John Brooks' Copa performance was special. His upside as a CB is unlimited which is why he commands the price he does. Clubs in Europe are spending crazy money to scour the country side for US players who can actually be trained into world class pros. If they didn't want to let us in the club, Pulisic never would have been signed. Is there a stigma against us players? Probably yes because MLS is a lower standard of play than top leagues and even weaker than Liga MX in most ways so why would they think highly of US players where we don't have that pedigree of producing classy players? At any rate, I don't see how both can't be true: They can think lowly of US soccer and still want to find good to brilliant US players to market back to us fans here AND be accepted by their club's supporters at home which would never fly with mediocre players. There is no conspiracy.

 

That's because Nagbe is 27, is what he is and has never played at a higher level than Portland. And because EPB is out of contract in like three months. Why would anyone bid anything for him? 20-30M for a player who couldn't beat out Ike Opara? Why should someone in Europe bid insane money for him when Peter Vermes doesn't even rate him as a starter?

The reason why Pulisic would get a massive transfer is because a) he's just that good, top 3 in his birth year world wide, b) because he's young and not only meets the global curve which most of our players don't who are behind it but he's actually well ahead of the global curve and c) because he ballin' at the highest levels already. C is important as countless prospects can never handle the transition to a top league.

For perspective, since I love it, Almiron is arguably the top young attacker MLS has ever seen. He's an MVP candidate. He's destroying MLS. There is nothing American in MLS approaching his talent level. Compare him yesterday to the USNTer on the other side, Zardes. Different universes. His transfer fee to ATL? 7.5M€. So damn right no one is going to pay 3-4X that for Nagbe or EPB as they aren't worth anywhere near that. It's no conspiracy.

 

Another example is Hirving Lozano, who most would agree is the 2nd best U23 in all of CONCACAF next to Pulisic. He lit Liga MX up, is far, far better than any American in MLS right now and received an 8M€ fee to PSV.

Is there a conspiracy against Mexico too? Nope.

 

Exactly. He's just got to prove it. Once he proves it against higher levels of competition, he will be given the due respect from the people whose respect is important to his career. There will always be haters. Some people hate clubs, countries or whatever but in general if you can play, people around the world will respect you. A system wide conspiracy to keep US soccer down doesn't make financial sense and it would be impossible to keep under wraps.

 

8m Euros is nothing to sneeze at, for a player not proven in Europe. That Porto didn't want to spend a fourth of that on EPB speaks volumes, IMO.

 

The way he played his first year in Seattle after signing the big $$ deal wouldn't have even gotten him into a Tottenham lineup.

 

The 8 million is part of a package deal PSV made with Pachuca. Lozano wanted to move to PSV, nowhere else, PSV didnot have ManCity money and Pachuca wanted more. So the package includes a substantial part of the transfer fee to be received over the 8 million, when PSV sells him.

 

Yeah, Fulham have been doing much better without him (6th last year!). And Seattle barely wins any trophies now. You know Spurs had 69 points the season before Clint and the season after Clint, 72 in his season there. Fulham had 3 of their 4 best finishes in this century with Clint there. he doesn't seem to make teams too much worse.

Or was that sarcasm? It's early.

 

There are some decent prospects. I doubt ATL would lose Carleton for less than $3MM. Acosta is probably worth $3MM-$4MM. I'm not sure about Roldan.

 

You forgot the UEFA cup final. That thing Mourinho got so much credit for winning

 

thanks for the prompt

 

Yes, he really helped Seattle to win the Cup. How could I forget that. Amd Morris is flourishing this year under his leadership. And he is a figure of legends among Fulham fans, they named a bar or something after him.

 

Some people here just highly overate MLS players.

Remember, there are thousands of those like Nagbe, Feilhaber, Nguyen, etc. in South America, Africa, and Europe. And even thousands of players more that are way better than them.

Nguyen tried Europe and failed.
Jozy tried and failed, besides a really good 1 year run with AZ.
Agudelo tried and failed
Shea tried and failed
Adu, we knew what happened

These don't necessary inspire major clubs in Euro to pony up millions for prospects from the US.

Let's get real and face the fact, Nagbe won't even make the reserve team for a club like BVB.

And that's no Euro dust. It's just fact, and you can't handle the facts.

 

There's THOUSANDS of players better than Nagbe? Not to include the THOUSANDS just as good as him?

 

plz list "thousands" better than Nagbe.

and lol Terrence Boyd scored 20 goals for BVB II. Nagbe is far better than him. what a weird post.

 

Do you see him play?

 

Nagbe is a small fish in a very small pond.

Look at teams and players across the globe and you can arrive at your own lists. Step outside the boundaries and limitations of MLS, and you might be able to see a little more.

 

There are 8 leagues across Europe that primarily contain the best talent on that continent.

England, Spain, Germany, Italy, France, Portugal, Belgium, Holland, and Russia. Generally speaking there are 20 clubs in those leagues, which is about 160 clubs, give or take, and about 25 first team players in those clubs ~ 4000 players. Throw in Argentina and Brazil and Mexico, and call it ~5500 players who probably compramise the the pool of the best players in the world (and we're intentionally not including MLS).

So your contention is that of that group, guys like Nagbe, Feilhaber, Nguyen, etc are right near 5000th?

In your opinion, none of those 3 would be among the best players at like, Mechelen?

 

and Junior Flores must be near there as well as he was BvB reserves team.

 

if Nagbe's ability doesn't warrant a spot on BVB II, you must REALLY rate terrence boyd!

 

And hell, you can even throw in the SECOND DIVISION clubs and double that number, and you'd still be at around 10K - 11K and you'd pretty much have any player with a shot of playing at a high level of football.

So what you're contention is basically that MLS standouts and all stars would barely be scrubs in BL.2 or Segunda. Because, remember, you said THOUSANDS similar and THOUSANDS better.

 

Deuce did well with the Spuds, but you'd never believe that if you had the misfortune of being in their forums. I've never disliked a fan base more. No matter what Dempsey did, even when he scored and was MOTM, they just criticized him.

 

And you forget the countless young prospects across the globe.

I would gladly take a 17, 18, or 19 yr with much more potentials over a 27 yr old average MLSer and a pedestrian Concacafer