Ethan Horvath at Club Brugge

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by Dave Marino-Nachison, Mar 23, 2012.

  1. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    Arsenal
    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Dusseldorf would be 12.242 if they entered European competition tomorrow. That's 20% of the five-year German coefficient; no German team can be lower than that.
     
  2. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Guys, this horse is dead.

    Please stop flogging it.
     
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  3. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    I saw the notification and had hoped his agent found him some new home :cry:
     
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  4. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    #2579 The Irish Rover, Oct 14, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2019
    Me too.

    Which is why people need to leave dead horses alone.

    Ethan's lost his place. Steffen's gained his. Good on Steffen and let's discuss his career over in the place that God and nature (aka the Mods) intended.

    Ethan news (and, of course, baseless speculation ) here, please.
     
  5. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    If only UEFA ranked domestic leagues, then moms could finally be happy...
     
  6. soccersubjectively

    soccersubjectively BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 17, 2012
    Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "no German team can be lower than that", except for clubs no where near qualifying for Europa league play. But yes if they jumped 90% of the table to grab a spot they would have that coefficient, that is correct.

    Strap yourselves in for the next ten years of people comparing Steffen to Horvath : )
     
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  7. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that most folks, if push come to shove, are going to rank starting for a B1 team higher than bank for a Jupiler.

    And I like Horvath. I think he's talented. But his ferverent supporters who think his skills are somehow improved by demeaning Steffen, when the guy is starting - and looking pretty good - in a big 5 league, are going to have trouble with objective data points.
     
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  8. soccersubjectively

    soccersubjectively BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 17, 2012
    Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well I do think it's important to remember that Horvath was set to start for Brugge, a very comparable team to Dusseldorf, before a last-minute transfer. Both gks were on a fairly level playing field when it came to career accomplishments going into August, so it's not like Horvath got notably worse in two-month span. But in a general sense, starting for a team is better than being a backup, sure.

    Definitely agree that the polarization with the two goalkeepers' fanbases is odd. Although it's about 10:1 (from what I've read) with people downplaying Horvath vs. others devaluing Steffen's accomplishments. So the random potshot you'll read in this thread still pales in comparison. The howler Ethan had against Italy and Steffen's shortcomings against Mexico were treated drastically different, for example.

    That said, ideally people just support the two goalkeepers but I guess a binary option is just going to divide people naturally : /
     
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  9. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    I'm a fan of Horvath and have been rooting for him, just a bit sad that he's not playing now after showing so well.
     
  10. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    And that's fine. My point is stop arguing about inter-league rankings of clubs when one guy doesn't get PT for a club that in the CL and the other does get PT, but for a club that hasn't played competitively in Europe since Methuselah was in diapers.
     
  11. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Showed so well that his team had to over pay for an old keeper...
     
  12. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's like the Fridel Keller wars,except ...now I'm sad because we used to be able to choose between Keller and Friedel.
     
  13. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    For sure, but it's done now so it's all about his next move. As long as he's going to be the starting GK in a league that's as good as the Jupiler he'll be fine. IMO that should include loans: if he plays well, the offers will come in the summer
     
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  14. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    In general, most US fans are supporters of both. There is really only one, maybe two, posters on here feel that downgrading Steffen somehow improves Horvath.

    But the perplexing fact remains - no matter the politics - that Brugge could have started Horvath and saved a lot of $$, but chose instead to spend money on a keeper. That decision, whether smart or not, can't be ignored.

    I, for one, hope Horvath can find a spot where he can start, because I think he's a good keeper - particularly reactions and athleticism, and his game will improve as his decision-making and experience improves, and that is best done by playing real games when you're a young keeper.
     
    TimB4Last repped this.
  15. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Business decision. Mignolet is a Belgian international, it's like MLS making room for a returning Howard, even if he's old.
     
  16. soccersubjectively

    soccersubjectively BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 17, 2012
    Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Literally proving my point lol. Could not have timed it better.

    Teams upgrade their starting player all the time. Look at Joe Hart. Even Mignolet felt the brunt of that at Liverpool, despite both playing to a respectable level. Mignolet is a better gk than both Steffen and Horvath and Brugge has a much larger budget to burn through than, say, the Columbus Crew. And again, it sounds like not everyone at the club was on board with the transfer, as we know many times coaches aren't in the conversation with what players are or aren't brought in (i.e Pulisic and Sarri). Not sure what the perplexing issue is here?
     
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  17. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    Any Horvath news at all would be welcome.

    Unless something happens, it looks like Horvath won't be playing again until the next Belgian cup match in early December. :cry::oops:
     
  18. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    @futbal nut, did they ever finish the investigations into the former manager of the club?
     
  19. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    What is perplexing is if Brugge thought that Horvath was a capable #1, they would not have handled this purchase the way they have. Even if they thought Horvath was a future #1 but not quite ready for prime time, they would have done it differently and not alienated him. Teams have brought in a "veteran" to aid the transition of a young keeper to #1, but that's not how this has been handled. So either Brugge is just hamhanded (possible) or they don't really believe Horvath is a future #1.

    So, if Brugge, despite a few years of watching Horvath, don't think he's good enough to be #1 at an upper Jupiler team, it makes one wonder about his day-to-day performance. Sure, teams are bad judges of their own talent all the time, but Brugge has done a lot of twisty stuff not have Horvath as the starting keeper, which is perplexing to me.
     
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  20. soccersubjectively

    soccersubjectively BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 17, 2012
    Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well I think this is assuming there is a complete consensus within a club about Horvath, which it doesn't sound like there was. There isn't just one mind acting as Brugge, there are several moving parts that can sometimes disagree.

    Also think of it this way, what about Horvath's three shutouts in Champions League play (vs. Monaco, Dortmund, Atletico Madrid) and a run that saw Brugge finish second in the table - including two matches against the first place Genk where they won one and drew the other - would communicate to the club that he was *not* ready for the number one spot? Sounds like a pretty good resume to me.

    I think MLS teams work a lot differently here in that they will only upgrade if the player is a clear detriment. Because of salary issues, it's rare that a good player will be replaced for an ever better one in MLS. But overseas, where there aren't as many handcuffs, teams are able to upgrade more freely. So I think that's just exactly what happened here + a disagreement with the staff/money spenders about who they should bring in.
     
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  21. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    I have no idea. I don't pretend to know how Brugge's back office thinks - although I do have a pretty good idea of how *some* clubs work (not *just* MLS). I have actually, you know, been around soccer since long before that, and in places other than the US...

    And the things you note are exactly what makes it perplexing. I'm not sure what is so perplexing about my finding it perplexing.

    Again, if Brugge were confident in Horvath, even if they wanted to spend big money on a veteran keeper (which is not completely out of the ordinary, but is also not the first place most "big" smaller league clubs look to spend dough) but had a lot of faith in Horvath for the future, they could have handled this differently. Mings is 31/32? He certainly could play for 5/6 years injury free, but if you bring in a keeper that could also do a hammy and you have a young keeper you value, you usually handle the transfer differently. Maybe Brugge is just hamfisted. Some of their coaching decisions and other actions suggest they are.

    But at the same time, given some of Evan's performances, he is at least a moderately valuable asset, and is one cracked rib away from being your starter. It's odd to handle him and Mings transfer the way it is being portrayed by *insiders* here.
     
  22. soccersubjectively

    soccersubjectively BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 17, 2012
    Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Now that's perplexing ; )
     
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  23. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  24. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    The life of a No.2

    do clubs usually give assurances for no.2 that they will get a fair shot or is it simply, "you're here to back-up the no.1 and you will only play if they're injured and then you're back to riding the bench?"

    Kinda reminds me of Nick Pope at Burnley. Played when Heaton got injured in 2017-18 and it got him the no.3 spot for England at the last WC.
     
  25. Jazzy Altidore

    Jazzy Altidore Member+

    Sep 2, 2009
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    what do you think
     

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