England U-19 Discussion Thread #3 (2005 born) [R]

Discussion in 'England' started by revelationx, Feb 22, 2011.

  1. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Yeah, most of our centre backs are versatile which is nice to see. Wisdom and Thorpe you would assume will make the U19 elite qualifying squad. Hard to say for certain what Blake will do with the other two.
     
  2. zXen

    zXen Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    England
    Let's just hope we don't see Angus MacDonald and Jack Mills again.
     
  3. Garibaldi11

    Garibaldi11 Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Has there been any substitutions?
     
  4. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Italy U18 1-1 England U18 FT

    So that is the last exercise before the main qualifiers now then. It will be interesting to see the squad Blake picks.
     
  5. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I assume they all got on. They usually do in games like this but I don't have any confirmation.
     
  6. Garibaldi11

    Garibaldi11 Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Yeah, definitely all would have come on.

    Interested to see who came on for who and when though.

    Also intetrested in the final squad, Blake picks now. Will he annouce the squad before the seasons up you think?
     
  7. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    He announced the squad for the elite stage last season a little less than a month before the qualifiers. So it will probably be announced around the beginning of May I think.
     
  8. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    The changes are up on the FA site now -

    Thorne off for Bamford at the start of the second half.

    Lascelles off for Bidwell at the start of the second half.

    Hall off for Fowler on 65 mins.

    Berahino off for Hopper on 65 mins.

    Moncur off for Nelson on 72 mins.

    Alnwick off for Long on 82 mins.

    Some odd changes there.
     
  9. Garibaldi11

    Garibaldi11 Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Cheers, mate.
     
  10. Garibaldi11

    Garibaldi11 Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Thorne and Lascelles were involved with the u19's...therefore seen what they can do and is obviously happy with them.

    He must have played 3 up top in Hall, Berahino and Bamford at the start of the 2nd half. All not out-and-out strikers.
     
  11. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I have no problem with him bringing off Lascelles and Thorne as HT but I can't understand why he's brought off Lascelles for Bidwell because Bidwell is a left back. I know Gibson can move into centre half but he's not going to play there in qualifying is he? He may aswell have given Nelson a half considering he's never been capped at any level before.

    Considering Aneke and Obita weren't properly replaced we would have to be versatile in other areas so fair enough.

    Also I always think it's harsh when they give young keepers a couple of minutes. Give him 20 minutes at least or don't bother bringing him on imo.
     
  12. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
  13. zXen

    zXen Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    England
    Each game Blake just keeps showing his failings as a coach to do some basic things, this is a friendly after all where we are supposed to test out players / tactics. Him bringing on a goalkeeper in the 82nd minute compounded why he shouldn't be our U18/19 manager. He doesn't even get his damn preparation right, is that so hard to ask?

    Sad news, I really him to play in todays friendly and show Blake what he is missing.
     
  14. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Yeah, Aneke seems to be picking up a few injuries lately. He started the season so well too.
     
  15. Garibaldi11

    Garibaldi11 Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I guess when you've got an unbalanced squad it isn't easy but he is in charge of picking the initial squad and even in that squad, certain areas were lacking in depth.

    The difficult thing is...where can England youth find better managers for u16, u17, u19 & u21 level.

    Someon like Glen Hoddle is at an academy in Spain...I'm sure he would do a better job for example than the current England youth managers. Not saying Hoddle should be in contention but someone of tht ilk...there surely are a few out there.

    On the keeper issue...totally agree. I would even go as far and say that 45min is minimum for a keeper to be given a chance.
     
  16. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I would have given each keep a half too. But I can understand if a coach wants to see more from an individual keeper at times, so gives him a bit more time in the second half. Just giving keepers a couple of minutes so they get a cap is pointless from a development point of view though.

    It's not just coaching but scouting too that I think is an issue at times. Organisation and preparation is just not good enough alot of the time either.

    You can understand poor coaching at times if you don't rate the individual coach but you can't excuse poor organisation or basic preparation.

    Most of the top coaches would probably prefer the day to day work that you get in the club game but there is no doubt that the FA could create and hire better staff if they wanted too. The likes of Brooking don't seem to care though, which is why Pearce is getting another contract.

    I've got nothing against Blake but he was working at Stoke and they weren't even investing much in their set up and the youth coaches were even fighting to keep it running because Pulis wanted to scrap the whole thing. How you can go from having a job like that to U19 head coach I don't know.

    What is laughable is that Eastick who had the job for years is still around doing odd jobs. So it's almost impossible to get fired.

    They are also hiring random coaches to go to tournaments on short contracts it seems to help out every now and then. Which I don't think is ideal in the long run.
     
  17. zXen

    zXen Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    England
    Tbh I do think that the male side of the FA didn't have any black individuals, whereas the Women have Hope Powell, who is doing quite a good job. Blake possess a UEFA Pro License, so that gave him a big advantage over the other candidates.

    There is an interesting article that the BBC did a quite in depth study on the state of black managers in England (albeit this was in 2009, but still worth a read imo)

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/6376121.stm

    Eastick should have been retired after Blake took over the U19s. We should be more pro-active with recruiting promising well qualified managers. If Brooking is adament that the youth of the nation is so important, then the coaches that are in charge at each level should be of a high pedigree.
     
  18. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Possibly that was part of the reason but I don't think Blake would have cost much either. If he had done they wouldn't have hired him I don't think.

    Blake being hired isn't really the main issue. It's the fact that Brooking and co have been around for so long and hired people and got their staff in or kept ones they like. But all they did with Blake when he came in was put him as assistant to Eastick, Swain etc. Then into a job and allowed him to do what he wants.

    There is still no philosophy and no link between the age groups that I can see. So nothing has changed at all since Brooking took over in his development role. None of the coaches seem to have to answer to anyone either. None of their methods are questioned at all.

    There aren't any new coaches being moulded into the set up either is there? It's all mates and hired help like Irvine.
     
  19. zXen

    zXen Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    England
    A man of Blake's inexperience should never have been cast into this role. It is a job that needs someone more experienced, or someone that has shown clear signs of intelligent managment potential.
    This is something that needs to be discussed at St. George's Park when it gets built. Hopefully when we have a single NFC where coaches come together to actually talk, then things may change. But atm I worry about the disorganisation at each level, especially when players graduate to the u18/19/20/21s.

    This is something that I am also hoping will be addressed by St. George's Park.
     
  20. mo0.

    mo0. Member

    Apr 2, 2011
    Club:
    Swindon Town FC
    perhaps we should have a rotation of professional managers, or managers currently unemployed, continue to come in on a rotational basis and pass along their tactical knowledge to the coaching staff and assist in some capacity. Alan Irvine recently stepped in to some degree, but it's just a thought. then again i'm posturing this as though i'm raising a point to Sir Trevor...

    just imagine if The FA actually read forums like this.
     
  21. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    I don't see what merely building St George's Park will solve considering very little seems to ever change with regards to any genuine type of philosophy. There is no critical review created to improve the coaching set up that is in place. All these crappy reviews mainly are aimed at club level or bringing through better coaches but nothing is ever said about the FA's own coaching set up at youth level ever as far as I'm aware. Even when we were never qualifying for anything and really in the shit.

    If you are building this centre then you should be working and investing in giving young coaches a chance now. Not waiting for it to be built but still hiring the likes of Eastick and paying odd job men to support the full time coaches at tournaments and qualifying campaigns.

    Offering Pearce a new contract before the U21 tournament starts just like last time sums the whole thing up. There has been no change. Brooking has had more than 7 years to do something. He cares more about giving Southgate a crappy role than development of players though.

    I mean what is the point of giving Eastick the U20 World Cup coaching job again?
     
  22. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    The issue of right backs has been brought up a bit with regards to 1993 born right backs. With Flanagan making his senior debut and Todd Kane mentioned by Scholesyy in the other thread who has never been capped. Kane has looked like he deserved at least a chance when I've seen him.

    It's a bit odd that neither have ever even made a standby squad as far as I'm aware because it is probably one of the weakest positions in the year group.

    Swain, Peacock and now Blake seem to like Pilatos from Boro and he has been the main right back for the age groups. Atkinson has also been capped a bit and he was on standby for the latest U18 squad. He also plays for Boro.

    The other player to be capped at right back at U16 level was Connor Morris from Charlton Athletic but he's just been released so will be off the radar now.

    Can't think of any other right backs that they have given a chance. The FA site is down for me so I can't check either.
     
  23. zXen

    zXen Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    England
    You're right that the FA coaches probably won't get critised or scrutinised once St. George's Park is built, hence why I was saying "hoping" and "hopefully" . I'm just clutching at straws that this could be the only thing that could help fix things for the better as I don't see much else being a catalyst of change unless Brooking leaves.

    I agree there should be new talented coaches being introduced into the setup now. There should be a U15 level where a youth coach can come in to work, that would be an automatic vacancy, unless Swain would try to claim it for himself. Eastick... Enough said about him really, he should have gone by now, he needs to step aside for the next generation.

    I don't even want to talk about Pearce, he has been here long enough, shown no signs of improvement. Completely undeserving of a new contract. He successfully lost us Victor Moses, well done Pearce, you get two more years where you can try to cause more problems with no heat on your back.

    Brooking is a fool for not noticing the FA coaching problems. Him again offering Pearce a two year contract before the U21 finals is a disgrace. Pearce will also probably get the job of managing the 2012 Olympic team.
     
  24. zXen

    zXen Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    England
    Flanagan should go in first choice now at this level after the way he handled his debut. It is strange that he hasn't been looked at earlier because a lot of players from the Liverpool Academy are in the England squads so their games must have been watched by our scouts. But remember Blake's scouting isn't exactly renowned, e.g. Mills, McDonald, Jeffers etc
     
  25. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Possibly. Hurst (92 born) was not being capped at all since U17 level until he made his West Brom debut and then he started getting regular U19 call ups. Maybe the same will happen to Flanagan or he will stick with Hurst.

    Jackson Ramm is another 1993 born who started the other U18 game against Poland.

    What I can't understand is that Blake has already capped Pilatos three times at U19 level. So why did he not use this game as an opportunity to look at someone else? Flanagan and Kane might have pulled out anyway because of senior duty and FAYC but surely he should look at Atkinson instead if he's put him on standby? :confused:

    I don't think Atkinson plays right back much for Boro now but Pilatos never used to play right back for them either but he's always right back for our youth teams.

    After all the exercise of these U18 games is to look at players that haven't had a chance yet. Same reason why I would question him picking Thorne who he has capped five times at U19 level. If they have been capped three or more times at U19 level then you have to question the point of giving them games in these U18 friendlies aswell.
     

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