Pre-match: ELIMINATÓRIAS, R4: Brasil x Peru, 17/11/15 [R]

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Century's Best, Nov 16, 2015.

  1. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Gee. 3-0 but Peru had *too many* dangerous opportunities. Shaky defense, ours. We got lucky.

    Anyway, that's a relief. We got much more comfortable now, in third place.
     
  2. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Qualifiers are long enough that our true colors will be shown. The team will have to improve as a unit if we are to qualify without problems.
     
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  3. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    That last minute in a half we could of conceded 3 goals. Like I said somehow, a Dunga decision are not burning him.
     
  4. Doc_Exec

    Doc_Exec Member

    Jul 7, 2004
    Thanks so much.
     
  5. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Brasil 3 x 0 Peru - FT

    Nothing more than obligation. The team needs a midfield. Just spraying the ball to the wings and hoping for them to do magic vs 2-3 players won't work all the time. RA played because Dunga knows he will honor his position when needed. He is used to playing different positions. Not sure he will keep the spot. He is a heavy player. But Dunga has a real big problem. Willian is doing well. DC also doing well on the wing. But Neymar is a bit wasted in the middle. That's a big problem for him to solve. A lot can change until the next WCQ game in March.

    MOTM - Willian. Mito. Nunca critiquei.
     
  6. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Dunga needs to do more than just simply putting Neymar in the middle and say "do whatever you want." If you want him to get more involved in the build up and be able to suck in the opposing CBs up field, you are going to need to train it. He has the ability to succeed there.
     
  7. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I typically refrain from criticizing the defense after the game is wrapped up. We have tendency to loosen up after going up by that many goals. Having said that we were terrible vs Argentina and the defense needs plenty of work.
     
  8. Bakaman

    Bakaman Member

    May 8, 2008
    São Paulo, Brazil
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Victory as expected, bad football... as expected :thumbsdown:

    William and Douglas Costa MUST be starters, no doubts. Neymar as well, of course, though he didn't play well in those two games. Dar o Neymar pro Dunga é jogar pérolas aos porcos.

    2015 squad review

    GK
    Allison wasn't bad in those two games, but I still believe that Diego Alves is our future, together with Rafael Cabral if he manages to get more play time. Jefferson was unfairly benched, but to be honest it's better for us to search for younger options.

    CBs
    We used to be very solid here :(. David Luiz can't be trusted and the longer he stays in the pitch, the bigger is the risk we take. Miranda is pretty solid overall and Marquinhos has potential, but Thiago Silva must be recalled. Not as captain, that is VERY clear that he is not capable of being, but e is one of the best defenders in the world... Even though his image is pretty burned among brazillian fans and for good reason, but still, he is too good to be dropped.

    SBs
    Daniel Alves is terrible at defending, that much isn't news for anyone. Same for Marcelo. We could certainly use some more defensive options there and Filipe Luis definitely isn't one of those, he sucks at defending AND supporting. Danilo has potential but isn't in good form atm. I'm gonna bet in the future, with Wendell and Abner for LBs. I can boast that Santos has some great talents in those positions, but...

    DMF/CMFs
    The only certainty here is Luis Gustavo, one of our most consistent players. Elias and Fernandinho must be dropped ASAP, they don't have what we need...Though I'm 99% sure Dunga has already placed his unconditional trust on them, for God knows what reason. Allan definitely MUST be tested, he is my biggest hope atm. Danilo (the volante from sub teams), Casemiro and even Romulo must be watched closely to see how they develop.

    AMFs
    Lucas Lima and Renato Augusto made decent claims for this spot, but I wouldn't count Coutinho off yet. Oscar must regain his form again as soon as possible.

    Wingers
    William and Douglas Costa, period. They were our two best performers in those two matches. Lucas also deserves a spot, even if in the bench... The last spot can be fought by Felipe Anderson, Teixeira, Gabriel Jesus etc.

    Forwards
    Neymar, of course... Plus RO as a bench option is interesting, for games that demand a focal point in attack. Gabigol can earn a chance depending on how he develops (so far so good) and on his performance with the sub teams (looking great as well).
     
  9. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Keep in mind Neymar, while very talented, will be playing a role that is very alien to him. Not only that, he may not be happy with that position. He won't be able to roam as much even if he gets to come back. We'll have to see. I see this as a problem and not a simple one to solve.
     
  10. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    I remember him playing the false 9 under Tata and doing well for a couple games. I think with a better midfield setup and tactics it can work but ultimately it isn't his best position.
     
  11. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    Unable to watch it. Based on comments here and on post-match reports, Dunga did change the team from the starting XI we saw on Friday. And while Peru is not as tough as Argentina or Chile, 3 goals at home is a good thing. For the first time, we have a clean sheet, and let's hope we have many others. We won the 2 home games we've played, and winning at home is always a must. And, thankfully, 2 of the toughest away games - Chile and Argentina - are behind us.

    All things considered, 7 points after 4 games isn't that horrible. The current CONMEBOL competition is far tougher than it's been before, and it wasn't a piece of cake going into 2014 or 2010.

    4 months before we host Uruguay (who blasted Chile at home tonight... they definitely had a lot of motivation).
     
  12. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    With a midfield 10x better and against La Liga teams. Not the best parameter.
     
  13. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Let me just say also that while Willian did good, Peru's LB was terrible. Definitely a weakness in their team.
     
  14. MerlinRM

    MerlinRM Member+

    May 5, 2014
    NorthEast USA
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Douglas Costa is becoming what we though Lucas Moura was going to be. He definitely took over on a night where Neymar was once again subpar.

    And thats coming from someone who wasn't convinced in the beginning.
     
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  15. MatthausSammer

    MatthausSammer Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 9, 2012
    Canada
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    If this whole Neymar in the center thing doesn't work out, who would everyone rather see start: Willian or Costa?
     
  16. Bakaman

    Bakaman Member

    May 8, 2008
    São Paulo, Brazil
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    That's an incredibly hard question to answer.

    William is our most consistent performer. God-tier workrate, he is like a box-to-box winger. Also one of the few players confident enough to dribble past opponents (and with a decent success ratio at that) and one of the bette rpassers in our offensive line... If I could only use one of them, it would be William.

    Costa however provides us with blistering speed, aggressiveness, dribbling second only to Neymar's and a good eye for a goal. He is also a great crosser of the ball and can take free kicks more suited to left footed players, though we are not taking good advantage of the former because of our lack of stature in attack. His omission would certainly be felt.

    I say since we still don't have an at least decent CMF, I'd drop Elias/Fernandinho rather than one of those two and pray that the great workrate from DC/William/Lucas Lima would be enough to compensate for the loss of a volante, but that will never happen. So I would try William at AMF:

    -----------------------Diego Alves
    Daniel Alves-------TS----------Miranda-------Marcelo
    -----------------------Allan-----Luis Gustavo
    ------Douglas Costa------William----------Neymar
    -------------------------------RO
     
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  17. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    It's unfair to drop either and a difficult choice but if I had to choose I drop Costa because Willian have been Brazil best player in the qualifiers but Willian can play in the middle and I seen Pep play Costa at AM too with success.

    I found encouragement that it wasn't Neymar having to carry the team to victory once again. So far, he has help. It rare to say Brazil won a game without any Neymar involvement.

    In saying that, Neymar was badly misused by Dunga in both games.
     
  18. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  19. IVO !

    IVO ! Member

    Feb 25, 2009
    RIO AND CHICAGO
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Douglas Costa definitely has won starting position after these initial qualifying matches.
    Willian is also killing it.
     
  20. IVO !

    IVO ! Member

    Feb 25, 2009
    RIO AND CHICAGO
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    The highlight of this match for me - 3 players from Corinthians on the field - haven't seen that since the 70's.
     
  21. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    It would be nice if it were Flamengo players.....
     
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  22. Kevin_405

    Kevin_405 Member

    Jul 30, 2012
    One of the best games our midfield has played in years. Controlling the ball while providing space for the forwards to operate.

    Dunga has definitely found something in the form of using a mid field of Elias , Agusto and Gustavo to control the midfield. The formation also seemed to provide more room for Neymar to operate in the center forcing double teams and in effect opening up the wings for William and Costa.

    I think this formation needs to persisted while strengthening the bench. Lucas moura with his speed and control might be a good addition to the line up to sub in the wings or the midfield.

    Finally we are seeing signs of a team over dependent on Neymar to perform.
     
  23. Emperor Adriano

    Emperor Adriano Member+

    Jun 17, 2009
    Utica NY (the refugee city)
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    give me what he's having!!!!!!!!!
     
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  24. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    Collectively, the midfield was dire IMO.

    I actually thought Renato had a good game overall. Elias was his usual self, just painfully average offensively defensively did well though so did Gustavo.
     

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