ELIMINATÓRIAS- General Thread

Whatever the pre-1970s/1980s history between you two (and I'm not saying Chile was never on the right side), your country DID provide radar assistance to the British, and that's not the act of a neutral nation. I'm not judging - I'm simply stating that the Argentine claim that you guys were traitors isn't completely unfounded.

In any case, for the sake of this forum and the other posters, let's end this here.

 

Não duvido, mas vamos ver se acontece mesmo.

A propósito, eu pensei uns dias atrás… se o Brasil ganhar a Copa do Mundo e a Argentina tiver um desempenho bem abaixo da expectativa, vocês acham que a AFA tentaria contratar o Tite? Eu acho que se der Hexa, a CBF vai fazer qualquer coisa para que o Tite assine outro contrato. Mas se o Tite decidir sair ou se a CBF não quiser que ele fique, eu acho que têm vozes lá que dariam uma chance pra ele. No final duvido, porque os caras são tão tupiniquins quanto a gente. Mas imagina um técnico campeão da Copa do Mundo pelo Brasil trabalhando lá. Seria o messias futebolístico deles.

 

As I also told you before, we also gave help and assistance from a humanitarian point of view, to Argentina. And maybe you can believe it diferently, but from our point of view, our limited assistance to the UK, also saved lives.

And to be traitors, first we have to make a promise, or sign a treaty with the other part, or simply just be friends with the other part, and afterwards, go against everything.

With Argentina the only treaties and pacts we had with them, after a short period of time, they passed them through the crack of their butts, almost every time we signed one with them.

And specifically refered to this war in Falklands, we never signed any treaty with them.

While our agreements with the UK, didn't really start when the argentine invassion of the Falklands took place, as they were in place long before that. More specifically, they started almost right after the war against Argentina that didn't happen 18 months before that, as at that moment we had to do something, in order to avoid ever passing again through the flammable situation we have just passed through (the UK also realized after what we went through, the importance from a strategic point of view of the whole zone, and decided to help us; little they knew, that their support to us back then, would also pay back a few months later).

The neutrality pact existent at the time, was signed with the rest of America, after that war was started by Argentina. We didn't sign anything with Argentina.

And when that pact took place, we already had agreements in place with the UK, so these came before the other. If we would've gone against them , we could've perfectly been called as traitors. Not from Argentina though, but from the brittish instead.
And btw, as we didn't have any spy satellites, those were provided by the USA, another signatory nation of the same pact.

Oh, and for a little bit of context, let me remind you what the argentines were shouting the day Galtieri anounced to their masses, that they had just recovered "their" islands :

 

This conversation is over.

See you when your team visits us on the last match of World Cup Qualifying.

 

Sorry man, I really didn't want to continue with this stuff, as those were very sad days and not only for what happened there, but also for what was passing inside each of our countries, where normal citizens really had no impact on government decissions and were simply dragged into issues of their own selfish interest. Most chileans don't want war, and I believe it's the same in the other countries, as well.

But your last post related to the whole issue, although a short post, was still implying that we did have a traitor atitude towards our neighbors, which as I tried to explain it, is very far from reality.
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whatever, I'm through with it here, with this post

 

Agreed. But let's say we do win it in 2018 and with a brilliant campaign, and they flop horribly. I do think there is a minority there who would consider it, as they'd put pragmatism above pride. But as I wrote, they're fanatically nationalistic just as we are, and they'd never allow it.

Now wouldn't it be funny (for us) if Tite stays after an eventual 2018 World Cup title and wins it again in 2022. I think Tite's market value then will be so high not a single NT in the world would refuse having him if possible.

But let's work on 2018 first.

 

Argentina have a plethora of talented quality coaches. They wouldn't need Tite.

http://www.goal.com/en-gh/news/4349...der-and-neymar-is-a-better-player-says-former

 

I've seen rumors of Sampaoli. Not gonna lie that has me a bit nervous. His Sevilla were neck and neck with the Big 3 in La Liga in the first half of the season but seem to have fizzled out. Imagine what he could do in a 7 game tournament.

 

You don't need to imagine anything. He already has coached a national team and went to a 7 game tournament, but in it, only reached 4 matches.

Not a bad thing, though.

 

Joking aside, I want to see them with a good coach. As entertaining it is to beat them under guys like Tata, Maradona or Bauza, it far more satisfying to beat them at their best. Also, I like to think that have a stronger Argentina is beneficial comes WC time. Brazil can't do all the heavy lifting for Conmebol.

 

No offense but the talent quality of Argentina vs Chile isn't comparable. And I'm not even taking about the current crop who are all aging but the younger or outcasted players like Kranevitter, Icardi, Vietto, Lanzini, Garay, Rulli, etc who are waiting to be called up. Sampaoli could build something solid with them and go further.

 

About the bolded part, no doubt about it.

We beat them twice in finals (with 2 diferent coaches) in the latest years, where Messi was their only "diferent" player, where once taken care of , the rest simply crumbles to pieces. Almost everybody else in their team, very big names at club level, but very little talent playing for their NT whrere they usually choke when you press them a little.
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For whichever coach they get, their worst problem is, that its Messi whom decides whom to call or whom not. And Sampaoli, simply doesn't have it in him, to say "NO" to a top star player. In fact, he doesn't care what the players do, as long as when required, they play well.

If you don't know it, but during the Copa America 2015, played in Chile, one of our top players, at a moment where Sampaoli decided to give all players a small break during the tournament, the star player went to the Cassino with his wife, had some alcoholic drinks there, and afterwards when on his way back, he crashed at over 200 miles his brand new Ferrari on its first run (also destroyed the other car he struck), where fortunately no one got killed. And despite being detained and taken away to police head quarters to after face trial for his wrongdoing, the next day, once set free, went to the concentration camp where the rest of our NT was, and Sampaoli still made him play that same night.
That top player was Arturo Vidal ....

 

Every player is replaceable. A good coach knows how to make an absense not meaningful.
Specially if you are not playing against a top team. For that Copa America, the team we faced right after his highway adventure, was Bolivia, and at that point we already were qualified to the next stage (Sampaoli could've perfectly ground him, at least for that match, to set an example).

 

I don't think its Messi who is solely making this "callups". A former NT trainer came out yesterday and said Mascherano hands a list over to whoever is manager to callup. I don't think thats 100% true as well.

 

The one thing that never has changed though, is that lately, since the days of Maradona as coach, most of the names keep on repeating themselves over and over (wouldn't be strange if they were producing, but in many cases, they haven't), which really seems dubious given all the potential players which can also be of value for the team, but really never are given a real oportunity to show their worth playing for the NT, as they don't even get called (not even as a potential replacement, which is pathetic). Some of the "regulars" have been getting calls even when going through serious injuries that disallow them from playing.

 

I understand the blackball of Icardi even though I don't agree. But when guys like
Gerónimo Rulli are completely being ignored for Sergio "I make my living on the bench" Romero and 2 other over 30 randoms, there is some obvious behind the scenes stuff going on.

Lavezzi has barely played since he has been in China and scored 0 goals while making over 500k a week and is still a mainstay in the Argentina squad. Thats insane to me.

 

Making the call up list to me is a stretch but star players black balling certain players from getting calls, that is nothing new.