Dutch clubs in European Silverware chase 2017-2018

Discussion in 'The Netherlands' started by feyenoordsoccerfan, Jul 26, 2017.

  1. The big clubs in their drive to secure their profitable places in the CL are in fact killing the goose with the golden eggs. CL matches are because of the time slot only valuable in Europe as prime time event. As Orange14 mentioned the time slot of the matches is out of synch with both the USA and Asia. So it will be difficult to get profitable commercials around the matches, which diminishes the value for the networks. Combine that with the sliding down the hill of the interest in most of Europe, which also includes the big league countries as well, the goose with the golden egg some time from now will give a final quack and die.
    The spiral down of the interest in the CL should give the top clubs threatening with a seperation into a superleague food for thought. If the CL is going back wards in popularity while in the final 16 stage it is composed of those socalled Superleague wannabees, I cannot wait until that yank with those billions ready to invest in the SL lures them into the quick sand. I'll be watching on the edge of it and see billions go down.
     
  2. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    It won't happen but the best thing to happen to the CL would be going back to the roots by limiting the number of teams from any one country to only 2 for the top seven leagues and then have more of the other leagues in the mix. The big clubs will not go for this which is why they modified the CL to include four teams automatically from the top four leagues (though it is questionable whether Italy is a top four league these days). All this does is drive down the viewership in all the other countries.

    One of the reasons that I like the Eredivisie aside from Ajax being my team for a lot of years is that the league is very competitive. Almost every year there are surprises and a team on top of the table in December often doesn't win it. The old saying "...on any given Sunday..." is quite true as we always see upsets throughout the season. You seldom see this in the EPL.
     
  3. Yup. I read the Mexican comments when they watch a match like PSV vs Twente. They really like what they see, lot of goals, lot of action and also the last minute win of course. Most of them find our matches quite entertaining.
    They love our urge to attacking football.
     
  4. https://www.vi.nl/nieuws/nederland-verliest-ondanks-zeges-cruciale-plek-op-coefficientenlijst
    Hoewel Feyenoord en Vitesse overwinningen boekten in respectievelijk de Champions League en de Europa League is Nederland de twaalfde plaats op de coëfficiëntenlijst verloren aan Zwitserland. Dit betekent slecht nieuws voor de KNVB-bekerwinnaar van 2019.


    Voor het Europese seizoen van Ajax, Feyenoord, FC Utrecht, PSV en Vitesse was het hoofddoel nog om het directe Champions League-ticket voor de kampioen van de Eredivisie in bezit te houden. Deze doelstelling werd al spoedig bijgesteld door de prestaties van de Nederlandse ploegen in Europa. Met de twaalfde plaats zou in ieder geval de bekerwinnaar van 2019 nog een rechtstreeks Europa League-ticket bemachtigen.


    Feyenoord won in de laatste wedstrijd van Napoli (2-1) en Vitesse bleek te sterk voor OGC Nice (1-0). Desondanks is Nederland er niet in geslaagd om de twaalfde plaats op de ranglijst vast te houden. Zwitserland wipte namelijk over Nederland heen. De Zwitsers hebben met FC Basel nog één ijzer in het vuur. De formatie van Ricky van Wolfswinkel is namelijk door in de Champions League
    .


    — Aanbevolen —
    [​IMG]
    Dit is de club die Ajax, Feyenoord en PSV willen zijn
    Zes van de laatste zeven jaar overwinterd in Europa, waarvan drie keer in de Champions League. Voor Nederlandse clubs is dat een utopie, voor FC Basel realiteit. Hoe de kampioen van de kleine voetbalnatie Zwitserland grootmachten vloert.
     
  5. Antario2

    Antario2 Member

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
  6. Blondo

    Blondo Member+

    Sep 21, 2013
    - they missed Denmark who are also closing in fast. TBF Copenhagen will have to reach the SFs (or final) to overtake Holland on the 2017/18 ranking and can't afford to drop many points along the way. It isn't impossible but highly unlikely.

    - Greece's AEK will need to reach the quarters but can afford to drop quite a few points (e.g. lose 2 and draw 1 at worst).

    - the czechies are the most likely ones to take 13th place from Holland in a couple of months. They only need Plzeň to get a win and a draw (or better) in February.

    If somehow these 3 clubs get those results Holland will be limited to max. 4 teams in Europe with 1 instead of 2 teams in the CL Q rounds.
    Don't worry it won't happen. For the 2018/19 ranking however Basel can already drag the Swiss over Holland, Copenhagen can do the same for Denmark, Plzeň for Czech Rep., AEK for Greece and Red Bull can help Austria gain ground on Holland. In the coming years Holland will be in the thick of it.
     
  7. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Link is 404 dead, FSF
     
  8. No, it isnot. Just tried it. But the 404 message I got from other sites too recently. It's about the browser, taking too long to link up and then you get that message. Solution is just to do it again!
     
  9. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Why all the concern about CL football when the whole system is corrupt? I just read in the paper today that Milan are on the chopping block regarding financial fair play and the Chinese owners who apparently do not have the money they claim to have. PSG has to sell players in January to be OK because of the debts from Neymar and Mbappe. All five English teams have qualified for CL knockout and Arsenal will probably win the Europa League showing the power of TV money.

    Dutch clubs will never have a chance and we will probably continue to celebrate the Ajax run to the finals of last season's EL as the final big opportunity. It's time to face reality.
     
  10. To be honest football pundits declared Feyenoord win in 2002 something we will not see anymore because the power of money would make us even in the EL uncompetitive, but 15 years later Ajax was in the Final.
    It was progress, as we did take 16 years after the last Dutch Euro final in 1996.
    So in 14 years Feyenoord will be in a Final again and win it. We always win after an Ajax final loss:p
    So predictions are what they are, predictions. FC Basel shows what to do with those predictions, shrug your shloulders and get on doing your job.
     
  11. Parel

    Parel Member

    Jun 16, 2010
    Club:
    NAC Breda
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    FYI, 2002 is 6 years after 1996, not 16 ;)
     
  12. Antario2

    Antario2 Member

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Wat a strange article. It advocates to remove teams from smaller leagues in exchange for small teams from the Big Five. That reduce the potential viewer market for the CL even more. Like anyone outside of their domestic regions is interested in seeing Villareal or West ham compete in the CL.
     
  13. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Even teams from the Big Five leagues are not created equal. Look at how poorly Monaco did this season in the CL compared to last year. Of course they lost some fine players just like all the other Euro teams except the 6-7 top sides who have all the €s. Other than Juventus, no Italian team is threatening and the same can be said of France with PSG and probably also Germany with just Bayern. The CL is a joke because only 5-6 teams ever have a realistic chance of winning.
     
    Brilliant Dutch repped this.
  14. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Which is exactly why I stopped watching it. Whats the sense in watching Messi win every time and scoring 3 goals, and then the week after that its Ronaldo winning almost every time and also scoring 3 goals.

    UEFA needs a CL overhaul because its total crap the way it is now
     
  15. It's an american article. Ptobably they have too much a vision molded by the big Yank sports leagues. But they have no clue about the tribalism in soccer in Europe. That's something the American pusher/financier for a superleague also doesnot understand. Interest falls from a cliff if clubs are restricted to a few very rich ones to win everything. I think we have seen the last CL match on tv over here when Dutch clubs arenot there. That or the UEFA must sell it for a dump price.
     
  16. :Dtesting if people really read my posts...Really ..it's true:whistling:
     
  17. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    No it's English; we do not use the word 'whilst' over here. The Economist is published out of London. Also, look at the date of publication. It is over a year old.

    EDIT: I would add that the big three American sports have a huge national television audience. You find supporters of various teams all across the nation. It's a lot different from Euro soccer. I think you are right about CL television ratings dropping. It will be that only three or four countries will support it going forward in terms of viewers.
     
  18. Blondo

    Blondo Member+

    Sep 21, 2013
    With a win at home against Partizan tonight Plzeň will help the czechies overtake Holland.

    AEK still have ways to go and after the draw at home they need a result tonight to go through.
    In case both Greece and Czech Rep. overtake Holland the Dutch champions of the 2018/19 season will be confronted with an extra round of qualifying in the CL (and they lose a guaranteed EL play-off round spot/loser's path is downgraded to an extra round of qualifying as well, i.e. the EL third qualifying round).

    Atleti have basically eliminated Copenhagen. Not a chance the Danes will overturn the 4-1 from the first leg in Madrid. However if Atleti take their foot off the gas and Copenhagen come away with a result Denmark starts breathing down Holland's neck in the 2018/19 ranking. The others that got a mention in my quote could also get results putting Holland in the thick of it. Let's see if Januzaj puts in another great performance against Salzburg tonight.

    I'll probably watch the Atalanta - Dortmund game instead and if I find the time RB Leipzig v. Napoli.
     
  19. Blondo

    Blondo Member+

    Sep 21, 2013
    Holland fell behind Turkey, Switzerland and Czech Rep. in recent years. Now Holland have fallen behind Austria as well. Salzburg are going into the EL quarters and even if eliminated Holland will have to outperform Austria in the coming years. Will Holland be overtaken by the likes of Denmark, Greece and even Cyprus next?
     
  20. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Who cares, it is all corrupt
     
  21. A glimmer of "hope":
    https://www.vi.nl/nieuws/nederland-en-feyenoord-mogen-hopen-dankzij-finaleplaats-marseille
    Nederland én Feyenoord mogen hopen dankzij finaleplaats Marseille
    4 mei 2018
    De uitschakeling van Red Bull Salzburg in de halve finale van de Europa League is voor Nederland goed nieuws met het oog op de UEFA-coëfficiëntlijst. Daarop kunnen de Eredivisie-clubs komend seizoen proberen de elfde plaats te veroveren op Oostenrijk om zo de kansen op een direct ticket voor de Champions League te vergroten.

    De elfde plaats geeft daar immers recht op als de CL-winnaar zich via de eigen competitie ook plaatst voor het miljardenbal. Oostenrijk begint bij de start van komend seizoen op die felbegeerde positie. Nederland volgt op de twaalfde plaats en moet een achterstand van bijna 1,2 punt goedmaken.

    Dan zullen de afgevaardigden van de Eredivisie wel een stuk beter moeten presteren dan dit seizoen. Nederland beleefde een absoluut dieptepunt met slechts 2,9 punten en vindt zichzelf terug op de 29ste plaats, nog onder landen als Wit-Rusland en Macedonië. Azerbeidzjan en Kazachstan deden het zelfs beduidend beter.

    Oostenrijk behaalde dankzij de halvefinaleplaats van Salzburg 9,75 punten, nog iets meer dan Nederland vorig seizoen verzamelde dankzij de EL-finaleplaats van Ajax, en eindigde dit seizoen maar net achter Duitsland. Daarboven vormen Frankrijk (11,5), Rusland (12,6), Italië (17,3), Spanje (19,1) en Engeland (20,0) de topvijf.

    Dat Olympique Marseille zich ten koste van Salzburg voor de finale plaatste, kan ook nog op een andere manier gunstig uitpakken voor Nederland. Het kan bekerwinnaar Feyenoord immers een ticket voor de EL-groepsfase opleveren, als de Fransen in de finale op 16 mei winnen van Atlético Madrid én in eigen land vierde worden.

    UEFA-coëfficiëntenlijst voor het seizoen 2018/19
    #

    Land
    2014/15 2015/16 2016/17 2017/18 totaal Direct CL Voorronde CL
    1 Spanje 20.214 23.928 20.142 19.142 83.426 4 0
    2 Engeland 13.571 14.250 14.928 20.071 62.820 4 0
    3 Italië 19.000 11.500 14.250 17.333 62.083 4 0
    4 Duitsland 15.857 16.428 14.571 9.857 56.713 4 0
    5 Frankrijk 10.916 11.083 14.416 11.500 47.915 2 1**
    6 Rusland 9.666 11.500 9.200 12.600 42.966 2 1
    7 Portugal 9.083 10.500 8.083 9.666 37.332 1 1
    8 Oekraïne 10.000 9.800 5.500 8.000 33.300 1 1
    9 België 9.600 7.400 12.500 2.600 32.100 1 1
    10 Turkije 6.000 6.600 9.700 6.800 29.100 1 1
    11 Oostenrijk 4.125 3.800 7.375 9.750 25.050 0 2*
    12 Nederland 6.083 5.750 9.100 2.900 23.833 0 2
    13 Zwitserland 6.900 5.300 4.300 6.500 23.000 0 2
    14 Griekenland 6.200 5.400 5.800 5.100 22.500 0 2
    15 Tsjechië 3.875 7.300 5.500 5.500 22.175 0 2
    16 Denemarken 2.900 5.500 8.500 5.250 22.150 0 1
    17 Kroatië 6.875 4.500 5.125 5.125 21.625 0 1


    De UEFA-coëfficiëntenlijst van 2018/19 bepaalt de verdeling van de Europese tickets voor het seizoen 2020/21.
    * kampioen direct naar groepsfase als CL-winnaar zich via eigen competitie plaatst
    * nummer drie direct naar groepsfase als EL-winnaar zich via eigen competitie plaatst
     
  22. It looks like "Mission Impossible", but Ajax has been in the same situation 13 years ago. Ajax faced Inter Milan and Ajax had a dramatic start out of the winterstop too, 4 matches and 4 points. They lost away at Feyenoord 3-2, FC Utrecht beat them up in the Arena with 1-4 and adraw against NEC. Yet Ajax took the lead with 2-0, ending in a2-2.
    So the CL is a different beast.
    Go my dear foes.
     

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