Alert: Downtown to Avaya: VTA Line 231 is no longer in service

Discussion in 'San Jose Earthquakes' started by Muy Cerca, Feb 23, 2018.

  1. Muy Cerca

    Muy Cerca Member

    Jan 10, 2002
    Downtown San Jose,CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    [​IMG]
    http://www.vta.org/getting-around/event-service/avaya-stadium

    Spoke a few weeks back to Earthquakes Ticket Rep and she said Team is still negotiating with VTA. This service was an awesome way to get to the game with like-minded fans and even a few away supporters staying downtown. This service made Avaya seem like it was built right downtown. There are other VTA options, but nothing so convenient. Send email or speak to your ticket rep to let the Earthquakes Mgmt know of your dissatisfaction with VTA's decision.

    This is the email I received from VTA:

    On Feb 7, 2018, at 8:27 AM, VTA Customer Service customer.service@vta.org wrote:

    Thank you for contacting VTA. The VTA Board adopted a Special Events Policy for Event organizers to reimburse VTA for services beyond its regular service. Avaya has chosen not to have the additional service for their stadium events. Customers can access Avaya Stadium for all events and stadium tours using Line 10 service or take bus lines 22, 32, 60, 81, 522 or Caltrain to the Santa Clara Caltrain Station and use the pedestrian tunnel to access the stadium. For other trip planning help contact us 408-321-2300 or email customer.service@vta.org.​
     
  2. billward

    billward Member

    Oct 22, 2002
    El Cerrito, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hope they continue the extra buses on the 10 line... that's my parking shuttle ;)
     
  3. Socarchist

    Socarchist Member+

    Feb 21, 2010
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    VTA and the Quakes must communicate widely the termination of this bus route. Otherwise, next Saturday, there will be plenty of people accustomed to using it stranded downtown scrambling for an alternative way to the stadium.

    Look for increased traffic and a greater percentage of grumpy attendees.
     
  4. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Wake me when elected officials start showing some seriousness about public transportation policy. Meanwhile, I will be keeping my car.
     
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  5. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The main downtown option on the regular schedule is the 22 or 522 to Santa Clara Caltrain and then walk to the stadium. The other routes (32, 60, 81) listed serving the station do not run late enough on Saturdays for postgame service.
     
  6. Ultan

    Ultan Member

    Jul 1, 2013
    Pacifica
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    What an incredibly short sighted decision. The 231 was always packed, for the love of God just chuck an extra 50 cent on the fare if the overtime was putting you in the red.

    Thanks for serving the city so well, jerks.
     
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  7. bannerman

    bannerman Member

    Dec 6, 2004
    SF Bay Area
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The VTA Sharks downtown shuttle that ran for years? Dead.
    The VTA express buses to Levi's for non-49ers events? Mostly dead.
    No surprise here...
     
  8. due time

    due time Member+

    Mar 1, 1999
    Santa Clara
    They apparently prefer to run empty buses around town instead.
     
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  9. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    VTA's new special event policy is described in this document, starting on page 11:

    http://vtaorgcontent.s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/Site_Content/sstpo_051917_packet.pdf

    It says that they lose $17,500 per game on the event service for Avaya. The new policy requires the teams/venues reimburse VTA for these costs.

    For about half that figure, they could restore 231 service only. I think that should be the priority, since the extra 10 service brings people to a location within walking distance, and the regularly-scheduled buses are still there for people who need them.

    I also suspect that they could charge double fare on the 231 without losing much ridership.
     
  10. onemormor

    onemormor Member

    Oct 11, 2008
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  11. Kirk33

    Kirk33 Member

    Oct 18, 2015
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    What needs to happen is the 49ers need to follow the lead of both the Sharks and the Quakes, and refuse to pay VTA's ransom fee. Once VTA's new policy generates exactly $0 in revenue, they will throw it in the garbage. But, as long as the 49ers are paying, the policy is here to stay.
     
  12. mjlee22

    mjlee22 Quake & Landon fan

    Nov 24, 2003
    near Palo Alto, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Here is the referenced tweet, which was posted by a consumer advocacy group.
     
  13. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    #15 don gagliardi, Feb 28, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2018
    This gets to the heart of the matter.

    As was obvious on the face of it, VTA is simply cutting a bus line altogether without exploring the alternative of simply increasing fares on the same line to make it self-sufficient. The underlying data suggests that VTA is ignoring a ready alternative to slashing service. Less than $10k per game for 20 games is less than $200k for the life of the season. Doubling fares likely bridges most if not all of this tiny gap.

    There are, of course, other alternatives that could make up the less than $200k required for self-sufficiency of line 231. Instead of increasing revenues, costs associated with the line can be cut. But it is quite apparent that this has not been adequately explored, either, even though less than $200k is effectively the burdened salary of only half a bureaucrat.

    The 231 is is not an isolated route. The timely San Jose Inside piece I posted indicates VTA is facing a $20 million deficit this year and is confronting it by reducing service rather than increasing revenues or cutting costs. In the private sector, this would be suicidal. At VTA it is business as usual.
     
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  14. Socarchist

    Socarchist Member+

    Feb 21, 2010
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    New acquaintances that happen to attend matches at Avaya invariably complain about the difficult access because of its poor location and about the high parking rates. So the team decides to address these problems by pulling the plug on special event public transit and by raising the parking prices.

    The team better be excellent on the field this year; otherwise, lots of casuals will stop attending and STH renewal rates will continue to fall. Consumers will only tolerate so much price inflation and logistical hassle. I'd say many are close to their limit here in the Bay Area, increasingly priced only for the rich.

    Apparently, the sales tax revenue is tied up in court: http://www.svtransitusers.org/news/measure-b-blocked-again.

    The tunnel is fine, but the walking distance is pretty far. Who is going to take Lyft/Uber? Either you drive all the way or you take transit. Maybe a few will take an app based taxi from the train station or downtown. $10 off for the first ride. Beware post-match surge pricing.

    1 step forward, 3 steps back.
     
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  15. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    #17 don gagliardi, Feb 28, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2018
    It seems that VTA is the party that decided the pull plug on route 231. VTA's special events policy linked above is apparently less than a year old, which suggests VTA was not requiring a subsidy from the Quakes in the past. If the Quakes were negotiating with VTA, as a reddit poster said s/he was told by a ticket rep, then the Quakes may have been willing to absorb some costs, just not the full $9,500 per game shortfall. And why should they, when it is arguably in the team's interests to secure increased parking revenues instead?

    The 231 is VTA's bus line, not that of the Quakes. VTA is in the transport business and it ought to be in VTA's interest to provide bus service for us, the taxpayers who pay their salaries Yet, the 231 line is not the only one being discontinued. The San Jose Inside story I linked shows a history of ever-reduced bus service dating back to broken promises from the 2000 bond measure ("VTA has a third less bus service than what it promised voters who approved Measure A back in 2000"). The Quakes left and returned under new management in the interim. Did the Quakes decide to pull the plug on every bus line VTA has abandoned or is abandoning?
     
  16. Socarchist

    Socarchist Member+

    Feb 21, 2010
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    According to VTA, it was Avaya Stadium's/Quakes' decision:

    "Per its Special Events Policy adopted last June, VTA has offered to provide increased service to Avaya with additional buses on Line 10, before and after the game, and Line 231 running from downtown San Jose to Avaya Stadium. At this time, Avaya has chosen not to request an increase in VTA service. As a result, no additional buses will run on Line 10 before or after the games and Line 231 has been discontinued." (http://www.vta.org/News-and-Media/Connect-with-VTA/Avaya-Stadium-Service-Updates#.WpbHuOdG3ct)

    The Quakes are free to provide their own explanation; better than speculation from internet commenters. Jilted riders are going to care less about whom to blame and more about having to pay a $20 round trip cab fare (I'll admit to guessing on the amount) or a $20+ parking fee instead of a $4 round trip bus fare, especially if caught by surprise.
     
  17. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    You are being incredibly obtuse. Based on the other information we have seen, VTA's website is a model of governmental deflection of its own failures to meet its responsibilities. VTA's special events policy, purportedly adopted in June 2017 (less than a year ago), is to make someone else pay to run its service, where VTA believes it can get away with it. The choice was VTA's when it adopted its misguided policy.
     
  18. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    If VTA charged line 231 riders $10 per round trip, riders will still come out ahead over a $15 parking fee or any ride service or cab fare in excess of $10 round trip. And VTA would need only 950 persons to use the service to break even for a given game.
     
  19. bsman

    bsman Member+

    May 30, 2001
    MadCity
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    On another topic: Whatever happened to the "bike corral" idea? I very much want to ride my bike to games, but not without a safe place to "park" it...
     
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  20. Socarchist

    Socarchist Member+

    Feb 21, 2010
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    It's in the same pile as the folders with the outer skin and roof plans, just below the folder with the Academy and public soccer fields.
     
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  21. due time

    due time Member+

    Mar 1, 1999
    Santa Clara
    If VTA loses $17.5 per game at Avaya, when they run 4 buses that are completely full...how much money do they lose when they run around a fleet all day with 1 or 2 riders per bus? The $ lost per customer is way, way lower on a full bus. You don't need to be good at maths to understand that.

    And who reimburses them for that?!?
     
  22. Earthshaker

    Earthshaker BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 12, 2005
    The hills above town
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You and I and everyone else.
     
  23. John_Martin

    John_Martin New Member

    Jan 20, 2015
    don gagliardi repped this.

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