http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/arti...-shows-referee-red-card-over-penalty-decision I like the gutsy no call here, and I expect I'd take a ton of grief in most of the MBB games I do. I also hope the Schalke mascot loses his job.
That's handling all day. I get the ball carromed off his attempt to play it onto his arm on the opposite side of his body, but he had both arms upraised and wide. He seems pretty clearly to be making himself wide and high as he came in. It's bad luck but if you don't want to be affected by bad luck don't make yourself that big.
Baharmast, based on the USSF handling video we discussed previously, probably would say handling: defender took a risk, had to accept the consequences.
Before he reached that likely or possible conclusion, he would most certainly point out that this thread is a prime example of what gets coaches and players most frustrated with referees. There isn't a ton of nuance to what happened here. Establishing consistency on what the appropriate call is in this sutuation should not be that hard. But time and time again, we show that it is.
Honest question. This a bit of sarcasm? Or do you honestly think this is why players and coaches get upset?
No sarcasm. But perhaps I should have put the word "rightfully" in front of "frustrated" and made it clear I was talking about the professional or similar level. I was alluding to the intro of Baharmast's presentation at National Camp, however, where he made this very point about inconsistency.
Here is another source: https://www.si.com/planet-futbol/20...ruhr-derby-controversy-handball-bartra-mascot Back to the subject for the OP. In my opinion this is not handling. Yes his hands are in a unnatural position, but you can not honestly deduct from this play that it was a deliberate action. He is stretching out his foot in order to block a shot, He is not stretching out his arms to do that. You have to judge every action for what it is. If the ball struck his hand directly from the shot than yes, this would be handling. But In this case the ball deflected from his own foot to his hand and he had no time to react to this. Remember having your hands in an unnatural position in only one piece of the puzzle.
@MassachusettsRef's comment is sort of why I posted the clip. For me, the ball is going in an unexpected direction, from close range. The arm isn't in a particularly unnatural position. It's not like the arm is there to take up space and prevent a cross. The defender isn't taking a chance, he's desperately trying to clear. And when I no-call, I thoroughly expect the offense to freak out.
To MassRef's point, and what was clear with Baharmast's "close your eyes and raise your hands" experiment, is that the inconsistencies are what drive coaches and players alike mad. Somehow we as referees need to work to do a better job of eliminating those inconsistencies. And its not just at the professional level. It would be everywhere. From around U14-15 rec, through very competitive U18/19, HS, adult leagues, you name it. In this one clip alone, we are all over the place. I am in the deliberate handling camp. So are some others. Others are not. And in the not camp we have "arm is in an unnatural position but it was not deliberate" and we have "natural position, weird and unexpected carom" Two totally different reasons for why its not deliberate handling. The question is: is this a gray area isolated event or are we struggling because the referee education system needs to give us better guidance to narrow the gray area down so that we can be more consistent?
i would say that 1: his hands are not unnatural. if you are lunging forward, it's natural that your arms go up at least shoulder high or higher. 2: it's not the same situation as the national camp directions- in those examples, the defender has committed completely and has given up control, his entirety is in the potential path of the ball, and the attacker plays the ball. none of those things are present here. in this case, the defender has kicked the ball onto his own hand. if there is a single example of such a thing that can be perceived as deliberate, i'd like to see it.