Das Reboot and the Road to UEFA Nations League & EC2020

Discussion in 'Germany: National Teams' started by Ger90, Jun 27, 2018.

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  1. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    But then that is a 10 or support striker

    Or do you mean to play him as a 9?
     
  2. Karl-Heinz Riedle

    Aug 27, 2009
    Dublin, Ireland
    Club:
    Cork City
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    ——————Neuer
    -Klostermann-Sule-Hummels-Max
    ——————Kimmich
    ————Goretzka—-Kroos
    —Brandt——-Havertz——-Sane

    Best lineup so far
     
  3. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Mueller's entire career is as an attacking midfielder or a 10
     
  4. Karl-Heinz Riedle

    Aug 27, 2009
    Dublin, Ireland
    Club:
    Cork City
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I m saying if we are using 433 as the primary formation, Havertz shouldn’t be used as either 6 or 8. Even there isn’t a 10

    If no one has the imagination , Lewandowski/Firmino/Alex Meier/Kruse will never be used as striker at 9

    In my opinion, Havertz has better potential to become an allround striker than any above
     
  5. Karl-Heinz Riedle

    Aug 27, 2009
    Dublin, Ireland
    Club:
    Cork City
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Thomas Muller was a special scenario:

    Was primary used as a supporting striker in a 442 when he emerged, being the partner of Olic for Bayern

    Then the SS role was no longer existed so he was used everywhere basically.

    And 4231 was a popular formation until recently. So Muller can play as an AM

    Now things changed again

    I used to think Mueller could’ve bulk up and improve his back-to-goal n aerial threat so he can develop as a 9.
     
  6. Karl-Heinz Riedle

    Aug 27, 2009
    Dublin, Ireland
    Club:
    Cork City
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    We shall consider a two striker formation , if we failed to bring in a targetman as CF

    I think that’s the best way to utilise Mueller, Timo Werner, Havertz or even Philipp( who I think has decent potential)

    But we need another setup in that regard. Maybe we shall use traditional wingers rather than two inside forwards on both flanks...

    N we need more mobility n defence in midfield

    If 442:

    ———-———Neuer
    -Klostermann-Sule-Hummels-Max
    —Brandt—Kimmich—Can—Sane
    —————Muller—Werner

    Werner can play an Olic role
     
  7. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Two striker systems are basically with a 9 and 10

    Greasy effectively played as a 10 for France

    I think you just get caught up in a lot of semantics

    Not coincidentally, Atleti also play a lot of 4-4-2

    But this is where you get into hybrid systems.

    The playmaker is likely to be deeper (e.g. Modric/Kroos) or wide e.g Neymar

    Greizmann is in some respects a throw back to the early 00s when the 10 was still a forward. But you can call him a support striker if you want, but he has to do a lot of work in defence
     
  8. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Stindl is another who works well as player that works off the CF. Made a great partnership with Werner at the CC.
     
  9. Karl-Heinz Riedle

    Aug 27, 2009
    Dublin, Ireland
    Club:
    Cork City
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    IF we play a 442, we need a slightly different set up in midfield

    We need more pace on the flanks and maybe Meier toughness/mobility in midfield

    Kante alone is basically doing the work of two players

    I think Griezmann is a more rounded player than Mueller too.

    And 442 like Athletico Madrid or 2016 Leicester City, they played rather counter approach.

    I think Loew will most likely play with a 6 Plus two box-to-box workhorses in midfield though.

    Basically a 433. Kimmich at 6, Kroos And Goretzka at the central midfield...

    And I don’t want Havertz to play away from final third, his strengths can only be shown in half spaces
     
  10. Karl-Heinz Riedle

    Aug 27, 2009
    Dublin, Ireland
    Club:
    Cork City
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    For now, my 433:

    ———————-Neuer
    -Klostermann-Sule-Hummels—Max
    ———————Kimmich
    —————-Goretzka—Kroos
    —-Brandt———Havertz———Werner

    442:

    ——————-Neuer
    -Klostermann-Sule—Hummels—Max
    —Brandt—Kimmich—Can——-Sane
    —————-Muller—-Werner

    442 we need the central midfield to be more physical n defensive. And we might sit deeper to play with more counters.

    We have one cm less than normal in that regard, so there are a. Lot of adjustments.
     
  11. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Griezmann is quick whereas Mueller isn't

    But Mueller has a lot of midfield skills Griezmann does not have

    The answer is probably just to play a quick 9 with Mueller
     
  12. DumFatAmerican

    Manchester United
    Germany
    Jul 27, 2018
    What about having Muller takes Kroos' role and putting Kroos at the 10. I believe Kroos played the 10 at the 2014 World Cup
     
  13. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
  14. Epitome990

    Epitome990 Member+

    Jun 27, 2013
    Club:
    SV Werder Bremen
    Nat'l Team:
    Austria
    Unless he has an epic 2019/20 season, I think the earliest that Arp potentially makes it for the senior team is WC 2022. Although it's not necessarily a bad thing as his age group in the youth NT levels need him.

    Euros 2020 should be between Werner, Selke, Füllkrug ideally for the striker spots. Stindl and Petersen may be options for experience but depends on form and production. Still a long time away of course, but Uth and Volland are fading farther away at this moment. If he stays healthy and consistent enough then maybe Ginczek could be a factor too.
     
    Ger90 repped this.
  15. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    and that epic 2019-2020 season needs to be in 1BL as well. That's one of the many reasons I want Hamburg promoted as it would give Arp time in 1BL instead of 2 seasons in 2BL.

    yeah sucks that Arp hasn't played for Germany in almost a year, since the U17 WC. Skipping the entire U18 and already the 1st 2 matches in U19. Makes one wonder if he plans to only show up for U19 ECQ?

    even though 00-onwards has numerous promising players. I would be surprised if any make EC2020, too early.I think the likely cap off will be 99. With players like Havertz, Maier, Maina etc having a better shot at making it.

    Ginczek's other issue is that for some reason he's the bench striker behind, Weghorst.
    He's only played like 45 minutes over 3 games. Compare that to Weghorst who's played something like 250 minutes over those 3 games. Both have 1 league goal but Ginczek has 2 in all competition to the Weghorst 1. He needs to establish himself as a starter.
     
  16. White/Blue_since1860

    Orange14 is gay
    Jan 4, 2007
    Bum zua City
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    10 days to the final decision

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Jordan Khamra

    Jordan Khamra Member

    May 21, 2014
    What about Pierre-Michel Lasogga? Seems like he is scoring a lot of goals in BL2!!
     
  18. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    there are a ton of options in 1BL why would we go for a 2BL CF?

    the issue is not striker, seems more of a tactical/Low issue.
     
  19. Jordan Khamra

    Jordan Khamra Member

    May 21, 2014
    I think some of the tactical issues might be due to not having a proper #9. He might be Bierhoff 2.0
     
  20. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    or more like we aren't playing any of the attacking players in their preferred roles.

    no 2BL player should ever make the NT it's pathetic and makes Germany look bad. There are tons of options in 1BL not sure why go for Lasogga who isn't even that good to begin with. Shouldn't be anywhere near the NT. The season just started. Last season there were tons of German strikers who performed in 1BL as well. And Stindl should play again soon with Gladbach, so another option.

    if one insists on a 2BL player in NT. Only to those that were already part of it when their team got relegated. Like Podolski and Hector.
     
  21. Thomsen

    Thomsen Member+

    Aug 6, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Hector
    is
    done

    I mean, playing 2nd Bundesliga and starting in international tournaments where the opposition will play their best players...? :thumbsdown:
     
  22. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Hector's "excuse" is that there is still time for Koln to get promotion and get 1 season in 1BL before the EC2020. But it's an issue if Koln doesn't get promoted.
     
  23. Epitome990

    Epitome990 Member+

    Jun 27, 2013
    Club:
    SV Werder Bremen
    Nat'l Team:
    Austria
    What an absurd thing to even bring up. Scoring against Arminia Bielefeld and Heidenheim doesn't make someone into a NT candidate. If Lasogga finally shows up as someone who can score 10+ goals on the first division level for 2 or more seasons consecutively while demonstrating leadership and team chemistry then let's talk. But in the meantime he's taking a seat behind Werner, Selke, Füllkrug, Stindl, Petersen, Uth and Ginczek among others.
     
  24. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Didn't someone here claim loew should pick Lasogga at 9 for worldcup 2014?
     
  25. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    This study tends to suggest that far from being washed up, Spain remain the dominant force in european football

    I think they just self imploded via politics in Russia with the managerial fiasco.

     

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