Das Martina-Upgrade: Sickle Cut Into Your Defense - Road to WWC 2019 [R]

Discussion in 'Germany Mädels: NT and Frauen-Bundesliga' started by Lea_Schueller, Dec 1, 2018.

  1. Core

    Core Member

    Sep 14, 2012
    My House
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I'm personally very OK with Huth. Does she need to improve? Yes, and same applies to everybody. She may have some deficiencies but in my opinion she's one our performing attacking mid/wingers. She was involved in a lot of good things vs China. She almost scored a header from Popp's cross in the early minutes had the defender not deflected the ball. She also broke away and passed the ball to Marozsan in the box who flopped it. If my memory served me well, she created the team's best scoring chance by dribbling and cutting from left and shooting, unfortunately she could not put it on target. I think she did the same thing on the right side as well, if I'm correct.

    Gwinn's goal was not a perfect goal scoring opportunity. The ball has to go through a crowd to hit the back of the net...9 out of 10 that ball would have been blocked or deflected but I take a goal like that any day as long as it wins us the game:).

    I'm not a Huth fan but I don't think she's a Thomas Mueller version at crossing the ball:). She might not be a specialist but I think she can cross. Even C. Simon places bad crosses at time. I just watch the ladies play. Some players do better for country than club.

    I'm most disappointed in Marozsan at the moment. She's heavily underperforming by her standard and the least effective of our attacking midfielders. I'm afraid her poor form is not going to hurt us as she won't get bench, at least not early enough, due to her status. The only way I can forgive her with this poor form is if one of her moments of brilliance saves us or win it for us:):)
     
  2. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    isn't Kimmich lil Leo's twin bro? they certainly play the same........all flash upfront, but NO defense! lol
    so far I ve only watched the 1st half, but totally agree, Huth seemed by far the best attacker. It was nice to see Germany finally making quick, transition attacks(you see, batfink, it can be done!) but alas, it only lasedt for about the 1st twelve minutes. Then it went back to ponderous,short passing game giving the Chinese plenty of time to set up their defense.
    Popp is not a natural forward. When I see at lone striker, can't help but think of Low & his beloved imobile, Gomez! Maro's super club, Lyon has no real competition 9/10th of the time, which might help explain why why she seems out for a stroll out there. I wish MVT would either start Dallmann, Magull or Dabritz insteead of her at AM.
    But most of all MVT got to worry about defense, I mean what was the CB Doorsoun doing so far upfield on the way right side, when making those crazy, central passes? It looks like the DM, Leupolz has to run back & become the last defender so the CB's go to the far sides so the FB's can go up to the attack. But from watching some of the other games in the WC, this would be a recipe for disaster alal Low as most woso teams are learning to transition faster these days just like their male counterparts.

    Going to watch the 2nd half & get back
     
  3. Core

    Core Member

    Sep 14, 2012
    My House
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I'm going to rewatch the whole game and have my assessment of every player for this game.

    I think Popp not playing center forward for club made her lose some automatisms of a true center forward but i still prefer her to Lea Schueller at this point. I might be wrong :).
     
  4. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    @Core like the others have already said, welcome to the thread...:thumbsup:

    She has a strange problem of randomly panicking when the mid-field doesn't provide her with obvious/clear passing options. But like you said, when she does remove the nervous energy from her game, Doorsoun's fully capable of looking like a strong defender at this level of wnt football.
     
    Core repped this.
  5. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    If Marozsan is going to needlessly continue sitting so deep, MVT has to start Magull to partner Leupolz. And this simply because of Magull's ability to execute accurate defense splitting passes, and still have the intelligence to join the attack (help Popp) with well timed late runs into the penalty box.

    The odd inability of Marozsan to get herself into the penalty box, becoming a increasingly negative factor now, that only seems to have been slightly alleviated during the pre WC friendlies, with MVT's inclusion of Magull as the teams box to box CM.
     
  6. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I know your fully aware of Huth's history.... but I think it's strange comparing her style of effectiveness to Hansen, during a match she was one of the only points of attack who actually appeared relatively effective inside the opponents half of the field.

    I mean... an attitude adjustment from the team as a whole still needs to happen too, with there appearing to be a constant inability of all the players in this team to maintain a high intensity for a full 90 mins.

    But seeing Gwinn once again doing absolutely nothing as a wide AM, while Popp just lost all focus being fouled and left completely isolated, as Marozsan retreated towards being a CM rather than a CAM... I don't see how Huth should receive any real blame for her otherwise positive performance vs China.
     
  7. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I think I've repeated the same thing a few times already... this being MVT potentially having a far tougher time with opposing coaches using a more tactical approach to their in game team management.

    Which is why Germany appeared to struggle for at least 15 mins of both the late 1st, and late 2nd half versus China, seeing the Chinese coach adjust his teams approach in ways that negatively effected Germany's overall ability to maintain a high tempo ball movement, and individual focus.

    This also witnessed during their pre WC match versus Chile too, where after Chile suffered a solid 30 mins of being completely overrun, you saw them slightly adjust tactics to slow down Germany's quick approach play; just enough to stop the close to 40 German attempts, from turning into anything more than 2 goals.

    A problem for MVT, seeing how both times this has happened, it's seen her teams ending the match in a very disorganized manner. Featuring Oberdorf in a unnatural CB role, Gwinn in a FB role, Hegering running around randomly in CM, and no clear point of attack....:confused:
     
  8. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    When opponents apply high pressure to Hegering and Doorsoun, both CB's usually evade the pressure with dribbling, and find passes into their mid-fielders. But when China started fouling and obstructing Leupolz and Marozsan from being able to receive the ball, you saw it lead to the individual defensive errors.

    So after MVT does the correct thing and moves Däbritz out wide for the 2nd half, allowing her team to regain an actual presence in CM to combat aggressive Chinese pressing, I'd like to think she's finally learnt something important, and takes this into the next match versus the next tactically strong opponent.
     
  9. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Germany's been unlucky due to so many promising youth forwards having injury plagued, adult careers(Bremer, Lotzen, Malinowski, Kayniki, Petermann)

    but somehow I fear that the stigma(or stench) of Jorige Low's has taken hold on the women's side as well

    from what I'm seeing in some of the other WC games so far is the end to end transitiion game where really you want top qualit/.speedy fwds up there leading the attack rather than DM's, FB's & CB's ala Jorgie's more total football concept. Shame, the interim coach of the wnt, Horst Hrrburch(spell check) had the right idea with a more free flowing type style, making a star out of Schuler & bringing in more fast paced playerrs like Rall & Lattwein, who MVT promtly discarded(she did bring in Buhl though, but so far she ain't used her)
     
  10. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    @hotjam2 I don't know why you persist rewriting the history of this team with Hrubesch, but the game where you constantly mistake his German wnt playing this superior direct style of football, also featured them looking like complete trash for long portions of the same match too.



    And you can't watch this match, and honestly believe it to be better than anything your seeing with MVT. Even with MVT's minor faults....
     
  11. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Hrubesch did a very good job stabilizing what appeared to be a post Jones sinking ship, but I can't see anything he did for his team appearing vastly superior to anything I've seen with MVT's version of the wnt.

    Not even with Schüller scoring 4 goals in one match, when it's clear to anybody being truly honest here, that most of Germany's play in this match very underwhelming, allowing a low ranked Czech Republic to be far more relevant than they should have really been.
     
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  12. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    #362 Batfink, Jun 10, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
    Oh, and this opinion coming from somebody who went into MVT's appointment as head coach with nothing but pure skepticism; only later with each game after that with me having to soften my stance to this initial negativity, watching a reality where MVT had actually constructed something that looked like it had far more potential than I originally imagined.

    So as Hrubesch left the wnt for MVT to continue it's progression, he also suggested he'd left behind a team fully capable of becoming a problem for anybody at the WC. And I can't dismiss what MVT is accomplishing post Hrubesch, when Hrubesch only had 45 mins versus Italy as his teams finest performance.

    This not even being anywhere near as convincing as MVT's first match, where she beat France away from home in a manner that for all the doubt, was unquestionably a strong performance for a team that couldn't even beat Iceland at home a few months prior.
     
    Core repped this.
  13. Core

    Core Member

    Sep 14, 2012
    My House
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I think MTV has done a good job. I like what I've seen from her better than Jones and Hrubesch. I just hope she can get her lineup and tactic right.

    Gwinn, despite her winning goal, was useless in the first half. I was wondering if she was still playing. I saw her only 3 or 4 times during the entire 1st half. The first time was around 19min when she wanted to take a throw. The 2nd time was around 33min when she committed a foul. I personally have not been impressed with her performance. I would drop her from the srmtarting lineup. The right side was pretty quiet in the first half. It was hendrich that did some attacking moves on that side.

    I don't know what MVT saw in her but defensively she's not in the same league as Hendrich who I think is the best defensive fullback we have although she's playing out of position. Ofensively, she's average to me. I would like Däbritz on the right.

    Popp did not get enough service. Simon's cross in the first half was too high to be headed on target. I still prefer her upfront to Schueller. I might consider putting Marozsan upfront and Popp behind her to give Maro 1v1 chance against defenders.

    Lea Schueller, with all her incredible goal scoring record, is a technically limited player in my opinion. She has a poor first touch and ball control. She can do well when chances are created for her but she going to be a turn over machine. Not to forget four of her goals came against a minmow. I won't use er goal against France as a measuring stick. Something didn't look right about that goal. I could see it from her body language.
     
  14. Core

    Core Member

    Sep 14, 2012
    My House
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    My impression of the first game. First, China is not a pushover!!

    First half was good until around 30min when it started getting ugly.

    Doorsoun and Gwinn were the luckiest in a sense that that Doorsoun's mistake did not cause us a goal. She owed it to Hendrich. I know a lot people thought Doorsoun redeemed herself by blocking the shot but it was Hendrich that ran and closed down the Chenese player and attempted a slide block forcing the opponent to pass the ball wide to allow Doorsoun to make the block. Without Hendrich, the Chinese player would have shot straight at the goal.

    Gwinn was poor in the first half. She did better in the 2nd half and scored the winning goal. This will most likely guarantee her a starting position for next game. Not fan of her starting unless she keeps scoring

    Schult was secure and did well whenever she was called upon, but I thought she was part of our problem because the team could not control possession under the Chenese pressure. A goalkeeper with a ball playing skill is an asset in a situation like this but Schult's antics against Japan are fresh in everyone's mind including her own so the denfenders avoided passing the ball to her as much as they could. This caused clearances that landed straight at the opponents.

    I give passing grade to Hendrich and Simon. Hendrich had one crucial moment when she missed to clear the ball, but looking closely showed she was backtracking when the pass was played making it very hard to kick the ball as she was moving backwards.

    Hegering and Doorsoun were poor. Doorsoun almost caused us the game. She made not just one but many bad passes. However, she did some great defending as well so I will be easy on her for now

    Wasn't too impressed with Hegering. She made few bad passes as well. She was out of position most of the time as she was bombing forward on a slightlest opportunity. She did not close down the Chinese player whose shot hit the post. That's almost a goal.

    Not impressed with Marozsan.
    Däbritz was involved in some nice moves. She has some fine ball skills. Would like her on the right side so she can have the chance to curl some shot on goal.

    Was very impressed with Huth. Always running, pressing, and trying to do something good

    I have a mixed feeling about Leupolz. What's her best attributes as a dm? Passing, tackling, heading, physicality? There were some 50/50 moment where she lost the ball in our own half. Fortunately the call went in our favor. I want stability in front of the defense.

    Oberdorf is impressing me. I think MVT is feeling the same. I don't know if she can handle the dm role.

    Magull needs to be given a chance to start.

    Popp was ok.
     
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  15. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #365 hotjam2, Jun 11, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
    Maro's out for at least the next two games with a broken toe. Hopefully either Magull or Dallmann will finally start

    btw..........yesterday, once again the key word was 'transition'. The CA/JA game had it from both teams. Argentina had it, unforutnately the more deliberate Japan didn't, & thus tied vs what was probably rated the weakest team at the WC)they actually lost a game few months back to the #170 ranked college team in the states)

    will MVT figure this out(obviously Jorige didn't last summer)
     
  16. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    here's starting lineup vs Spain. guess MVT ain't no fan of Lea, Linda, Lina & JoJo
    D83n8mkWsAI82pR.jpg
     
  17. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    MVT started a 4-4-2 versus Spain...:speechless: using Däbritz in CM, and Oberdorf wide AM...
    [​IMG]
     
  18. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nice to see they won again... but is this the only way MVT thinks her team can succeed..? Randomly moving from match to match, rotating her formation and players for reasons that don't positively effect team performance...:confused:
     
  19. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I'll watch the match later, but it's starting to feel like MVT and her coaches just came to the WWC without any kind of basic game plan lol.

    As every time I look at the starting line up, I'm constantly confused now; which means the players can't be having the best of time with all of this erratic coaching either...:cautious:
     
  20. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #370 hotjam2, Jun 12, 2019 at 2:44 PM
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019 at 2:50 PM
    cuz Dabritz moving up from that dreaded DM spot was the reason she scored(slow poking Maro would of never move that fast!

    btw........Buhl was a joy to watch in the 2nd half(finally an attacker with some burst of speed,welcome to the new age, lol) but MVT seems to have her favorites

    & yeah, if you havn't watch yet, don't go into shock mode on how many times Spain once again gets behind the lines only to flub their final shots!
     
  21. Thomsen

    Thomsen Member+

    Aug 6, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Well, I wasn't able to watch the game either but I think Huth proved me wrong as I watch the extended highlight and she looked influential and provided a good cross to Popp which resulted in Däbritz's goal
    Still wish she had a better shot though, but perhaps we'll see it

    Reading the stuff from the game though and watching the highlights, it seems to me like they struggled in the 1st half but got better in the 2nd... Spain is a good opponent but yes I think an early exit in the KO-rounds is at stake and therefore losing the Olympics next year... :thumbsdown:
     
  22. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #372 hotjam2, Jun 13, 2019 at 5:43 PM
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019 at 5:55 PM
    blissett repped this.
  23. Weltmann

    Weltmann Member

    Sep 9, 2012
    Nice little documentation about the history of german women football from lifting the ban in 1970 to nowadays. Love those old clips from the unofficial world cup in 1981 in Taiwan. Germany didn`t have a national team, so the german champs Bergisch Gladbach were sent and won, which led the DFB to establish a national team.
     
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  24. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    #374 Batfink, Jun 14, 2019 at 4:17 AM
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019 at 4:23 AM
    LOL... did you actually watch the entire match, or just find extended highlights...? Because it's pretty obvious MVT's repeated error of starting Däbritz at CM needed correcting (again) 20-30 mins into the match. Seeing Däbritz moved back out wide, so the superior CM Oberdorf could try and help stabilize the failing central mid-field battle versus Spain's far more organised 4-3-3.

    Meaning the only reason Däbritz was able to find her self in a scoring position, was the simple fact she was put back into a left AM role; allowing her to be in a more offensively advanced scenario as Popp's header fortunately found itself spilled by the Spanish GK.

    Making my constant questions of MVT's suspect tactical abilities completely valid here, as this latest dysfunctional performance becomes another showcase of her teams slide backwards, towards the ugly days of Neid's sloppy, individualistic, highly disorganized style of football.
     
  25. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I'm not shocked though... I said this would happen if MVT didn't put a team onto the field fully capable of neutralizing/countering Spain's mid-field. And the moment I saw her ridiculous team featuring a 4-4-2 with Oberdorf out wide, I knew what was likely to have happened.

    I mean... it's honestly just more of the same persistently amateurish attitudes towards tactical discipline I've come to expect now. Which is really disappointing when you consider how much the wnt program's top youth players continue to accomplish with such horrible leadership.

    See... Spain are clearly only going to play one way... but MVT, just like the past senior wnt coaches, suddenly decides she's going to remove the CAM system from the team, and just use a two player CM to try and combat their technically strong opponents having superior numbers in mid-field....:confused:
     

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