I actually like these domestic cups. I'm glad argentina finally has one and it's exciting when smaller teams make Cinderella runs. The Copa Libertadores berth is so the big teams can care about it more. But unfortunately the incompetent AFA doesn't know how to schedule these rounds properly. The fact that a new season has started and we are just barely is in the quarterfinals is dumb.
I disagree, the qualifying for the copa libertadores should be based on merit, IE a league season. The best 5 teams over 38 games should go in directly. Abusrdly for the AFA, the best teams over 38 games qualify for the useless Copa Sudamericana, while the Copa Libertadores has teams that quite frankly shouldn't be there, minues Newell's and the Inicial Champion. Velez was a disaster in the Torneo Final and they won 1 game ("Superfinal") that Newell's didn't even care about and that qualified them for the Copa Libertadores, meanwhile River and Lanus, who finished 2nd and 3rd respectively in the Inicial + Final (combined league table 2012-13), have to make basically win the Inicial or Copa Sudamericana to qualify. What is the point of putting in a great season if you don't get to play the Copa Libertadores? Sure, I'd like to win the Copa Sudamericana, but its a second rate tournament, and the way you perform in it shouldn't have anything to do with qualifying for the main tournament, the Copa Libertadores. The Copa Argentina is a 3rd or 4th rate tournament, just look at the teams playing in it. To be honest, the AFA in general is really pissing me off lately. It should be simple. 38 games, the best team is the champion, no "super finales" or any such nonsense. Top 5 teams make the copa libertadores, end of story, no need to over complicate these things. The Copa Argentina winner can play the Copa Sudamericana
True, In a perfect world I would definetely like to see a longer season. Top 5 qualify for libertadores. 6th, 7th and Copa Arg winner go to sudamericana. Sort of like how the euro leagues have it. But the federation is such an unorganized hell hole it will never happen. Maybe if CONMEBOL moves the copas into a European style schedule where they begin August and end in June. Only in a perfect world. But for now, I'm rooting for Gimnasia de Concepción del Uruguay tomorrow. Woot!
I'm a big fan of cups, and like how they are interwoven with divisional matches (La Primera, etc). I'm glad to see the AFA doing this again. I'm a Boca fan, but want to learn more about TdF clubs, too.
I don't mind domestic cups, I think they could be a good idea, the problem is this cup is new. Argentina clubs are only used to having the local league and copa libertadores/sudamericana (in the past there was the MERCOSUR and the Super Copa) Thats why I don't think a Libertadores spot should be up for grabs. But I do agree with you. It would have been great to have had this tournament decades ago when the league was the best in the world. I think its very cool the relationship the english have with the FA Cup for example. Hopefully it will catch on, and of course I am going to be rooting hard for Gimnasia.... Unfortunately, there are no Tierra del Fuego teams that are very competitive, but hey given how this tournament has gone this year, maybe some team from down there could emerge.
Yeah, good point. The US Open Cup winner gets into the Concacaf CL, IIUC. Not sure I care for that. And the FA Cup is the boss! Always will be.
The tournament continues to creep along. 3 semifinalists are now known: Estudiantes (BA), San Lorenzo and All Boys. The final will take place on 26 September in Catamarca. Which I think is about 12 months after the tournament began.
...and its still going. Arsenal beat All-Boys last night in the second semi-final. So it will be Arsenal v San Lorenzo on 16 de Octubre in the final. Winner plays in the 2014 Copa Libertadores. Question: Is there even going to be a Copa Argentina in 2013-4?
LOL In 2011, it was announced that -for the first time- the Argentine team to reach the furthest stage in the Sudamericana would qualify for the following Libertadores. As many were expecting, that team ended up being Arsenal. This year -for the first time ever- the winner of the Copa Argentina will qualify for the Libertadores (previously the winner was only given a Sudamericana slot). Guess who's playing in the final??
Regarding the 2013-14 Copa Argentina, that's a good question. I have yet to see something concerning the cup's fixture/organization, yet at the same time I haven't heard anything about the cup seizing to exist either. The current edition began in late October, so there could be a chance the smaller teams will begin playing the initial phases later this month.
This is the stupidest cup of all time. Seriously I didn't even realize it was still going on until I picked Ole yesterday and saw the small part on the cover about the arsenal-all boys game. Apparently, the referee was, surprise surprise, on arsenal's side. No question they'll win this cup and enter the copa libertadores for what has to be the 3rd of 4th time in a row The organization is also shocking. I'll never forget when river played defensores de Belgrano, two team separated by less than 10 blocks, and the played the game in Chaco. Hopefully, this cup gets discontinued
Right now on bwin Over under of San Lorenzo players sent off 1.5 2 to 1 odds arsenal get a pen before the 30 minute mark 2 to 1 odds arsenal score a goal in offsides after the 60 minute mark
Hasta en la copa argentina arrugan.. 3-0 arsenal. y eso que decian que iban por los tres titulos este semestre. mamita..
Well, I suppose the silver lining is that now that they won Copa Argentina and made it to Libertadores there will probably be less pressure on the refs to hand them the local title.
Am I the only one who didn't even have any idea that the Copa Argentina 13-14 was being played since October? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_Copa_Argentina We're in May, practically the end of the season, yet no team from Primera has even begun their participation in the tournament. It hasn't even reached the round of 16 yet! And to think this unorganized tournament grants a slot for the Copa Libertadores 2015. Ohhh AFA...
Well the tournament starts in October and it is scheduled to end in October. Currently the teams in La B Nacional are playing with whoever is left from the lower leagues. After this phase the round of 32 introduces the 20 primera teams. I'm probably the only one on this board that likes this tournament as I like seeing little small teams face giants like in the FA cup or Copa del Rey. It also gives big clubs such as River a chance to try out the young players if they were to face smaller clubs. This is probably the only idea out of all the crappy ideas Don Fat Bastard has created that works. (Because it works in other countries)
I don't mind the tournament. I actually like it for the same reasons as you. I just think it's ridiculous that the winner gets a spot in the Libertadores (it'd make a lot more sense if it were in the Sudamericana) and that the scheduling is so unorganized without prior plans. Last year the final was supposed to be played in June, but it ended up happening in October. After squad changes that take place between June and August, a team could end up being completely different from the team that played the entire copa, depending on who they sold and who they brought in as reinforcements. Like I said, I don't have anything against it, I just wish things were more organized and planned out.... but that's too much to ask from the good folks at AFA.
I'd say give it time. This is only the third year it's held (not counting '69-70) and it's following a schedule similar to last year so there might be some consistency. If the round of 32 with the primera teams doesn't occur until after the summer transfer window then there's no lineup changes mid-tournament. But as far as the Libertadores spot is concerned I wouldn't mind it if they got rid of the "best-placed copa sudamericana spot" that was made to reward Don Fat Bastard's team. I do agree that it should reward a Sudamericana spot instead. But since the tournament ends in October that's unlikely. My guess is that they are trying to emulate how Brazil rewards their domestic cup winner with a libertadores spot. (Which is dumb).
Round of 32 Matchups: River - Ferro Boca - Huracán Racing - San Martín (SJ) San Lorenzo - Almirante Brown Vélez - Estudiantes (Bs As) Rosario Central - Juventud Unida (SL) Newell's - Talleres Estudiantes (LP) - Douglas Haig Lanús - Colón Tigre - All Boys Gimnasia (LP) - Argentinos Juniors Arsenal - Instituto Godoy Cruz - Defensa y Justicia Olimpo - Atlético Rafaela Belgrano - Independiente Quilmes - Banfield
That River vs Ferro matchup reminds me of that badass goal by Trezeguet. Hopefully we get him back to play in this tournament. Here are my predictions: River - Ferro Boca - Huracán Racing - San Martín (SJ) San Lorenzo - Almirante Brown Vélez - Estudiantes (Bs As) Rosario Central - Juventud Unida (SL) Newell's - Talleres Estudiantes (LP) - Douglas Haig Lanús - Colón Tigre - All Boys Gimnasia (LP) - Argentinos Juniors Arsenal - Instituto Godoy Cruz - Defensa y Justicia Olimpo - Atlético Rafaela Belgrano - Independiente Quilmes - Banfield
River 3 - 0 Ferro Boca 2 - 0 Huracán Racing 1 - 1 San Martín (SJ (4-5) San Lorenzo 2- 1 Almirante Brown Vélez 1 -0 Estudiantes (Bs As) Rosario Central 2 - 1 Juventud Unida (SL) Newell's 2 - 2 Talleres (4-2) Estudiantes (LP) 1- 0 Douglas Haig Lanús 1-1 Colón (4-3) Tigre 1-0 All Boys Gimnasia (LP) 3- 0 Argentinos Juniors Arsenal 1 - 1 Instituto (1-3) Godoy Cruz 1 - 2 Defensa y Justicia Olimpo 2 - 1 Atlético Rafaela Belgrano 1- 0 Independiente Quilmes 0- 2 Banfield