Good mechanics should have gotten this crew to the correct conclusion. The "goal" to the CR could only have been during the goal line scrum part: if the ball had crossed the line and play continued, AR should have been flag up and wait to run for eye contact. The "goal" to the AR was the ball crossing the endline outside the goal (which is what happened because he started running up the line), at which point CR should have known the AR mistook the position of the ball since the ball was clearly not in the net. To be frank, I think the dissent in this case was a factor in the CR doubling down and demonstrably emphasizing that the AR had the call. I think that made it harder for him to go over and have a convo to work it out.
To me that is an ego problem. A problem many refs at that level have. Check your ego at the door. You are an arbiter in this case not a defendant.
I've been traveling and offline for awhile, so obviously way behind. But a few thoughts... 1) There is no "Carillos." The referee ended up being Marlon Mejia of El Salvador (maybe "Carillos" is a second surname, but usually that's listed on the FIFA site and is for all other Salvadoran officials). Anyway, it's a minor and mostly irrelevant point, given what happened, but I do wonder how this change was made. Because Guerra was announced and confirmed. Mejia has been the #2 in El Salvador behind Aguilar for awhile, and has a CONCACAF pedigree (Guerra doesn't). So I wonder if USSF pushed for the change. 2) I can't help but laugh about how Infantino is already exploiting the ghost goal to push harder for VAR. Sure, it would have corrected the horrible decision. Everyone knows that. Everyone wants that. But that doesn't mean everyone wants the VAR system that is being pushed currently. It's like the whole world only sees things in black and white now. Just because the current VAR system would save one horrible mistake does not mean it's worth negative interference in 5 other matches. FIFA, the IFAB and everyone else should spend more time developing and perfecting a system that adheres to the alleged principle (minimum interference, maximum benefit) than exploiting a horrific decision to score a PR victory. Besides, who is to say that the referee wouldn't have deemed his decision not to award a penalty right before the ghost goal to be a "clear and obvious error" anyway? People yell for VAR as if it would have saved the US here, and Infantino opts to exploit that. But I'd say there's a 50/50 shot that VAR would have resulted in a penalty, anyway. 3) As others have pointed out, the ghost goal cannot and will not lead to a replay unless match-fixing played a role. Moreover, unless I'm mistaken, the aggrieved party in the scenario (Costa Rica) would have to protest. In most competitions, you can't protest a match you didn't play in, so the United States and Honduras would have no grounds. It's a non-starter. Why would Costa Rica protest a match and play it again when it's irrelevant? 4) Not that they were incredibly high, given Geiger, Aguilar and one of the Mexicans, but the ghost goal has to kill Lopez's chances for the World Cup, right? 5) The CONMEBOL situation ended with four Brazilian referees doing two matches each on the final two matchdays. Ricci and his crew apparently canceled their trip to the U17s to handle two of the more important qualifiers. This was a dangerous situation where CONMEBOL barely got by and, you would hope, it will plan better next time. 6) It's already been stated and/or joked about, but the USMNT failure should be a bonanza for Team Geiger. I'm positive it's bittersweet, but barring a huge group stage mistake, there should be no reason why he and his crew do not see a QF or better next year. 7) Going off-topic into other confederations outside the Americas, Irmatov had the second leg of the Australia-Syria playoff and had to leave in extra time due to injury. His 4th replaced him and gave a 2CT against a Syrian player--pretty big moment to step in and have to do that. 8) The intercontinental playoffs will be interesting. Peru-New Zealand and Honduras-Australia. Last time it was four UEFA refs, the previous time three UEFA refs, and the previous time before that it was two UEFA refs. So not sure if it's a trend to just give them all to UEFA referees or not. Interestingly, three of the last 12 playoff referees have missed the cut for the World Cup, so getting picked for what is a pretty much the most prestigious non-World Cup Finals appointment FIFA can give does not guarantee a spot at the actual tournament. But it's obviously not a bad thing, either. I wonder if Geiger is in line for one of the Peru-New Zealand matches.
Might as well finish the non-UEFA WCQ appointments here, particularly since a CONCACAF team is involved: Honduras : Australia - ORSATO (ITA) That is rather interesting. Unless I'm missing something, Orsato has no chance of going to Russia as a center referee (he will almost certainly be a VAR). Usually these assignments are given to the absolute top referees in FIFA eyes and/or someone who needs a final test. Orsato doesn't fill either category. Australia : Honduras - PITANA (ARG) This one makes a lot more sense, given historical patterns. New Zealand : Peru - GEIGER (USA) Huge assignment for Team Geiger and seemingly a big vote of confidence. Of course, every big match like this carries risk, but a good performance here can help set the stage for great things next summer. Peru : New Zealand - TURPIN (FRA) Another one that is a bit curious. Turpin has an outside chance at Russia, but again, more likely to be a VAR. Perhaps UEFA and FIFA talked and they deliberately opted to assign the likely UEFA World Cup referees to the WC playoffs? Even then, that's only 8 referees and UEFA should get 9 or 10 on-field officials at the WC. We'll have to wait a little while to see if this appears to fit into some larger plan.
I should clarify or correct that Frank Anderson is on Geiger’s crew instead of CJ Morgante. I heard rumors that FIFA wasn’t quite impressed with Morgante at Confed Cup and that a change could come. Not sure if this is an official change or just a trial. But it’s notable.
I'm looking forward to reading about the Aussie reaction to playing in Honduras. It's gonna be a fun two leg tie I think
It's going to be quite an experience for Orsato, too. San Pedro Sula is a long way from the UEFA Champions League. I know some like to point out that top UEFA teams don't have to go to places like this to get results. Well, top UEFA referees don't typically officiate in environments like this either.
Don't know the answer to that. If this is a permanent change, it's really unfortunate for Morgante, as he's a great AR and has had a really good MLS season. But it also demonstrates how cut-throat this world is.
Didn't get to see either match but reports indicate Geiger had a smooth one. Seems like the only big talking point is what actually happened off-the-ball at 5:45 in these highlights: Note Geiger set a nice unintentional pick at 6:25, too! Orsato, on the other hand, got a trial by fire in Honduras, as expected. Many cards and just not the sort of environment he's used to. Apparently the Honduran players didn't shake his hand at the end. The big call was at 2:28 below. Apparently the AR flagged for a penalty and then, well, they conferenced and decided not to give it:
I guess this is the other potential KMI for Geiger & co. Given as yellow, possible argument for VC: https://streamable.com/t3u5b
I don't think that's a "possible argument for VC." I think that's pretty obviously violent conduct on the replay so the question becomes what did Geiger and the AR on that side (Anderson?) see?
Answer looks pretty clear: AR is looking at offside so doesn't completely catch it & Geiger can't see it exactly through the fouled player's body, but knows the guy did something
I think specifically Geiger saw the hold around the midsection and saw it as an attempt at stopping a promising attack.
Apologies in advance for dredging up an old thread. I know this is just a friendly, but this young Jamaican referee has been pretty solid in the Bolivia-USA match. Hope CONCACAF doesn’t screw him up, but they probably will.
Very impressive for 27. But if you're a Caribbean referee, you can do all the league games you want, but eventually you need to do a USA vs Honduras Gold Cup/WCQ match to prove yourself. Luckily for him, he'll likely have VAR if/when he gets the big CONCACAF games.