Coaching Philosophies and the Gregg Berhalter System

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Susaeta, Mar 14, 2019.

  1. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    Makes you feel superior, doesn't it? Don't forget, the more one judges, the less one loves.
     
  2. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    I don't think it's a club snob thing, but rather the pathological angst over Zardes that permeates the media and social media. We now see the younger players picking up on that.
     
  3. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    Why are you avoiding all the famous ones that apply so well to this soccer discussion?
     
  4. largegarlic

    largegarlic Member+

    Jul 2, 2007
    The other thing about the Uruguay game that lends support the optimistic view for me is that we actually played a CB in Ream who could make line splitting passes on his own. I think Brooks has only been available 1 game under Berhalter, and I've kept thinking that things could be quite a bit better when we're high-pressed if the CBs didn't constantly look confused with the ball at their feet and didn't constantly just dump it back to the keeper or a CM 10 feet in front of them. That just invites the press.

    Of course, it's a small sample size, and it's likely that Uruguay was never interested in pressing hard anyhow, but I would like to see them play a pressing opponent with a better distributor at CB and see if it makes a difference.
     
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  5. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    McKennie is clearly a CM, but he has been underwhelming for the US, especially in The System. He was lights out against Portugal. Pity the team with him didn't set up again like that.
     
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  6. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    Is it even possible to some here that McKennie could be an example of a great prospect's development being harmed by a top Euro league team?
     
  7. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    McKennie isn't a prospect. He is a young pro who has been signed to a long term contract.
     
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  8. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    Perhaps we should see him play without having a partner who is both (1) a poor defending DM with below MLS range and ball winning ability and (2) a regista who cannot break lines under pressure.

    That would be a really interesting experiment, no?
     
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  9. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    Do you think he's been playing well in Germany?
     
  10. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    I haven’t seen him recently but he looked good early on.
     
  11. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    Don't rush to nitpick if you're having a problem with the basics. He was clearly a prospect when he signed for Schalke.

    And he's played a lot and may have gone downhill - and its a real stretch to pin that on Gregg Berhalter but doesn't surprise me a bit to read here.
     
  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    England
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't know how young players like McKennie are supposed to settle when they rarely get to play with the same teammates.

    We expect McKennie and Adams to play and act like senior players when they're only 21.
     
  13. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    #2338 Honore de Ballsac, Sep 12, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019
    I think he looked pretty good early on too. But I stopped being impressed whenever I was able to tune in. I was just happy he was playing in the Bundesliga and figured that had to be good. But he's been played at every position, some reported he had a bad year, Schalke has not been a good team, I've rarely seen him play well for the US even given the benefit of the doubt. Doesn't seem to fit anywhere just yet. Hope is the new Schalke coach will get him back on track as a dmid or something correct?

    It's just possible Schalke has screwed him up as much as helped him! And it's just possible his weak individual performances for the US aren't the coach's fault. Folks here wouldn't be saying that about, oh, Will Trapp.
     
  14. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    Every time I’ve seen him play for S04, he’s been very strong and clearly belongs at that level.

    I’ll hold off judgment on him for the USMNT until we try partnering him with someone who complements him (like Adams or Williams last year) and not Bradley, who is a terrible partner for a player like Weston.
     
  15. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    So, is that an argument for not necessarily #playthekids? Maybe a more nuanced approach? Or should we just keep talking like our poor results are because we're not playing Dest, Sargent and (Pomykal? Tyler Boyd? Antonee Robinson? ) enough - due to some ignorant American conspiracy.

    I guess what a lot of posters here would like is Dave Sarachan's squads and line-ups as coached by Tata Martino. I still think there would be some dire days, and a process.
     
  16. Honore de Ballsac

    Oct 28, 2005
    France.
    Kinda sad to say, but wouldn't you guess Weston or Morales is supposed to be the ball winner buzzer guy who allows us to play Bradley/Trapp as our Pirlo?

    Believe me, I like Bradley and Trapp but I did just throw up in my mouth a little bit.
     
  17. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    LOL. McKennie went from a prospect to a young pro on a long term contract with a Big League team. How has he gone downhill?
     
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  18. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    England
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think you should play your best 11 available players, consistently. The experiment is over, it's becoming embarrassing.

    Not selecting Bradley or Altidore for the squad, and letting McKennie, Johnson etc go home early was a cop out. They had important league games but so did Seattle, who's place in the playoffs is a lot more tentative than TFC. Bradley and Altidore played against NYCFC who were without both center-backs due to call-ups.
     
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  19. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes!

    Weston has played very well so far in the young BuLi season under a new coach. He and the rest of the team shit-the-bed against FC Hollywood but in the other 2 matches he gave two of the better performances of his young BuLi career.
     
  20. largegarlic

    largegarlic Member+

    Jul 2, 2007
    Yeah, I think he's been underwhelming and inconsistent with the USMNT, but I've seen multiple games with Schalke where he's been one of the better players on the field. I don't think any failures with the US are because he just can't hang at that level.
     
  21. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Weston was arguably the 2nd best US player at GC2019 with 2Gs and 1 A in 5 matches.

    What position did GB have McKennie play v Mexico??
     
  22. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    Seems silly to me. I think Weston's been uneven with Schalke, while the team itself was a dumpster fire, and I think he's been mediocre or worse while being forced to play with a traffic cone in Bradley, or a pile of manure on fire in Trapp. Just as you can't evaluate a young QB if you hand him a putrid OL, you also can't evaluate midfielders if you surround them with mls lifers on the wings, and hamster dung alongside him in central midfield.

    For the most part, McKennie's had the worst Forward talent in at least 30 years playing in front of him, the worst talent I've ever seen on the wings pretty much ever, and then a guy whose 3-5 years past it alongside, and a guy who never good enough to begin with, when we were pretending we moved on from Bradley in 2017-2018 friendlies.

    I'm not about to tell anyone that McKennie is a stud in the same way that I know Pulisic is. Not about to. His play is too inconsistent for that. However he's a solid pro with a good career going in an elite league, as good as anything Bradley ever accomplished club wise, and a billion times better than the rest of the scrubs Berhalter continually insists on subbing in or starting alongside him in central midfield and around him on the wings.

    That's my frustration in general. We've got guys that may become good enough to be special or relevant for a long time (Pomykal, Sargent, Weah, McKennie, Morales, heck even Nova, and the U20 kids from this past spring to name a few), and we can either start building around them, or plateauing on our best day (and humiliating ourselves on our worst, which seems to be the more common result) with less volatility and more predictability options like must sub lovitz/roldan, mega erratic Morris, WTFBOYD, and hacks like Trapp and Bradley and one could go on and on.

    I see no point in this whatsoever. We know whats not good enough. We more than offing know. It's beyond obvious. Take our lumps with the kids, find the vets that can serve as glue guys (Altidore even if I don't like his attitude), I'd bring back Bedoya for his mentality as a glue guy, I'd exclude Bradley because I am absolutely convinced he stifles the development of leadership potential in others through his presence. I wouldn't give two blanks about the idiotic diagonal pass that Berhalter seems to have grown far too emotionally attached too, nor his keeper, fullbacks and center backs fixating so much on playing out of the back that they give up 1 potential howler every fifth or sixth game, and have turned Steffen into a neurotic Woody Allen character when he puts on the US shirt, rather than the terminator he becomes when he puts on a freaking Dusseldorf jersey.

    I know none of this is going to happen though. After four camps so far, it's become clear that a drunk, blindfolded poster in this thread could be put in front a key board and pick a better 23 and a better XI. His fixation on MLS options he knows, and veteranness is going to be what he goes with, w/a few choice handouts to the young prospects that should be what he's building around. Same old, same old. More crummy results and a super scary qualification campaign to begin if he isn't forced to wake up (and the only way that happens is if our kids force their way into the lineup by star making turns in Europe which is kinds hard to do when you're 17-22.
     
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  23. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    McKennie has an awkward skill-set, for 3G's system, but should improve over time.

    Strengths
    Aerial Duels---------------------Very Strong
    Defensive contribution--------Very Strong
    Ball interception----------------Strong

    Weaknesses
    Passing---------------------------Very Weak
    Concentration-------------------Very Weak
    Finishing--------------------------Weak
    Discipline-------------------------Weak
    Tackling---------------------------Weak


    Adams on the other hand...

    Strengths
    Tackling------------------Very Strong
    Passing------------------Strong
    Through balls----------Strong
    Key passes-------------Strong
    Ball interception-------Strong

    Weaknesses
    Holding on to the ball
     
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  24. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    Have you watched Weston play with Bradley? They don't fill well together. Bradley needs a specific player to compensate for his weaknesses and we've been looking for that player since 2014 (Jermaine Jones was able to do it but even he wondered why he had to change his game to suit Bradley).

    Your question presumes that we should build around Bradley/Trapp and that's the problem - it forces a series of cascading compensations that put all of our high-ceiling guys (Pulisic, Adams, McKennie, Brooks) in non-optimal situations.

    I love all of our young guns but they're not complete players right now and we should be building around them. Therefore, the question should be: which set up augments McKennie strengths and offsets his developmental areas? I think it goes without saying that one wouldn't pick a Bradley or Trapp type as his optimal partner in midfield. If Berhalter can solve that challenge, we have real potential - I'd guess it's someone who is also a rangy ball-winner who can clean up mistakes that Weston makes with over-enthusiasm (and vice versa).
     
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  25. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    In the Portugal game, Danny Williams played behind McKennie in a 451. Sapong was the center forward.
     
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