News: Club World Cup to Expand; Confederations Cup to End

Discussion in 'FIFA and Tournaments' started by Nico Limmat, Sep 9, 2016.

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  1. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #926 EvanJ, Aug 26, 2019
    Barcelona was second to Real Madrid in the club coefficients for the five seasons ending in 2018-2019. Each CWC can only include four CLs per confederation unless some CLs are chosen to qualify winners for two CWCs, which I doubt. The country and club coefficients include five seasons, so it's easy to look at five CL winners without realizing that it's too many. That means that one season would be the most recent season in club coefficients for one CWC and the fifth most recent (least recent) in club coefficients for the next CWC.
     
  2. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #927 Nico Limmat, Aug 27, 2019
    Yes, my mistake. It should be:

    1. Real Madrid (Spain) - Winner 2016/2017/2018
    2. Liverpool (England) - Winner 2019
    3. Barcelona (Spain) - 2nd in Club Ranking
    4. Bayern Munich (Germany) - 3rd in Club Ranking
    5. Juventus (Italy) - 5th in Club Ranking
    6. Manchester City (England) - 6th in Club Ranking
    7. Paris St. Germain (France) - 8th in Club Ranking
    8. FC Porto (Portugal) - 10th in Club Ranking

    Only the rationale changes, not the list. And the same clubs miss out.
     
  3. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #928 Paul Calixte, Oct 7, 2019
    Reports out of Brazil are that FIFA will announce China as host of the 2021 CWC on October 27.
     
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  4. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #929 HomietheClown, Oct 7, 2019
    I would say I am $urprised.

    But I am not $urprised at all.
    Makes a lot of cents if it is true.
     
  5. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #930 Nico Limmat, Oct 18, 2019
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  6. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    #931 BocaFan, Oct 18, 2019
  7. Thezzaruz

    Thezzaruz Member+

    Jun 20, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Sweden
    #932 Thezzaruz, Oct 19, 2019
    It seems that it's a poorly named additional competition. The competition we'd call "Super Cup" is called "Recopa" instead in CONMEBOL.
     
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  8. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #933 Nico Limmat, Oct 20, 2019
    According to this CONMEBOL wants to create a competition with all 25 historic Libertadores winners. :rolleyes:
     
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  9. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #934 HomietheClown, Oct 20, 2019
    That sounds awesome to me. :D
     
  10. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #935 Nico Limmat, Oct 20, 2019
    This NY Times article (requires registration) says China is a done deal for 2021 and claims UEFA is no longer opposed to the expansion. UEFA's eight spots are expected to go to the UCL and Europa League winners (not teams on the UEFA ranking). The article further speculates that the US will be the host in 2025.

    While I would normally think the US would be a fine host (and they should probably host the 2029 edition), I don't want to see World Cup and Club World Cup in the same confederation let alone the same country in the same four-year period. This CWC is big in size and should no longer serve as a "warm-up" event in the mold of the Confederations Cup. I say spread the game as much as possible.

    2025 definitely has to leave Asia but should go to Brazil (unless still event fatigued), or Morocco (to let them have their "big" FIFA event), or South Africa (dust off the 2010 venues).
     
  11. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #936 HomietheClown, Oct 20, 2019
    Looking at it from a business and television perspective (like I usually do) it may be a sneaky way to appease FOX Sports for having to do a stupid winter World Cup during NFL season.

    Doing a major summer event in the USA would make a lot more money from sponsors for both FOX and NBC/Telemundo.
     
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  12. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #937 Nico Limmat, Oct 20, 2019
    I think placing the 2026 WC in North America is appeasement enough.

    But if we do another "United" hosting scenario for 2025, how about we reverse the allocation of matches compared to 2026? :D

    2025 CWC
    Canada - 16 matches (40%)
    USA - 8 matches (20%)
    Mexico - 16 matches (40%)

    2026 WC
    Canada - 10 matches (16.7%)
    USA - 40 matches (66.7%)
    Mexico - 10 Matches (16.6%)

    That way Canada and Mexico may actually get to host some games.
     
  13. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #938 HomietheClown, Oct 20, 2019
    Realistically if they want empty stadiums for most of the tournament they would listen to you your idea here.

    100% USA is the way to go if they want to create a major buzz.
     
  14. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #939 Paul Calixte, Oct 20, 2019
    Wait, so Eurosnobs don't exist in Canada and Mexico?

    I don't remember either country ever having attendance issues when hosting a FIFA tournament. The advantages that the US has are 1) being able to charge higher ticket prices and 2) leaning on expat communities for the less popular games (e.g. getting 5k+ to show up for Auckland City vs. Al-Hilal).
     
  15. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #940 HomietheClown, Oct 21, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
    That was my general point.
    There is more of the expat population to lean on to fill up stadiums and smaller modern soccer specific stadiums to use for the crappy... ... I mean less well known teams.
     
  16. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #941 Nico Limmat, Oct 21, 2019
    While I agree that some (lower profile) games would struggle to draw in Mexico, Canada has a lot of immigrant communities too and should definitely host some matches of a 2025 CWC in North America.

    Besides, the "Eurosnob" market in the US has been oversupplied in recent years with the International Champions Cup circus (the same is true for China.) Attendance numbers have been dwindling and a number of American casuals (who probably don't understand the CWC in the first place) are no longer falling over themselves to watch Real Madrid.
     
  17. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #942 Nico Limmat, Oct 21, 2019
    When you say Auckland City in the US a different blue team comes to mind as opposition. Auckland City vs. Cruz Azul in LA, billed as la revancha de la maquina. :D
     
  18. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #943 HomietheClown, Oct 21, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
    Canada would have too much conflict with baseball at Rogers Centre. Montreal is a Dump but they are renovating it for 2026 so by 2025 could be an option.
    The MLS stadiums are okay but not as nice and up to date as the NFL stadiums they can use in New Jersey, Los Angeles , Miami, Chicago etc. without any MLS conflicts.

    You attach "World Cup" to the title and the Buzz will be there. Especially with FOX and mores so Telemundo promo hype of prime time games.
     
  19. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #944 Nico Limmat, Oct 21, 2019
    Surely MLS would take a break in this scenario? And it's not just about having the "nicest facilities" - it's about spreading the game. As established, Canada is already getting the short end of the stick when it comes to 2026 match allocation.

    Unfortunately too late for Schweinsteiger and the Chicago Fire :D

     
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  20. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #945 HomietheClown, Oct 21, 2019
    You know very well it is about money first and foremost and fascilities also are a part of that.

    MLS may take a break but they may not. They do not even take breaks for the real World Cup.

    We have had this conversation before. You cannot claim to have the short end of the stick because if it were not for the USA you would have claim to no stick at all. :ROFLMAO:

    Chicago local media being idiotic has nothing to do with this thread. Keep my Fire out of this. :D
     
  21. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #946 Nico Limmat, Oct 21, 2019
    I never claimed it's not important, but if that was the only criteria FIFA tournaments wouldn't leave Western Europe and North America.

    But forget it, you are an incurable homer. Can't even spare a few CWC games for Canada? Good lord.
     
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  22. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #947 HomietheClown, Oct 21, 2019
    I m not a homer. Just stated obvious facts.
     
  23. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #948 Paul Calixte, Oct 21, 2019
    Don't remind me :mad:
     
  24. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #949 Paul Calixte, Oct 21, 2019
    C'mon now, do I really have to send both of you back to Corruption 101 with Prof. Odebrecht? :D I mean, you can't brazenly overbudget in Canada like you can in Brazil (...unless someone in Ottawa has your back :cautious: ), but you can make plenty of money out of suboptimal hosts.

    I have a different main concern with a Club World Cup on these shores in 2025. The Confederations Cup was, at worst, a neat pregame that wouldn't distract anyone from the WC finals - but would there be a risk of market fatigue with a Club World Cup and World Cup in the same country/-ies in back-to-back years?
     
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  25. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #950 Nico Limmat, Oct 22, 2019
    Precisely. This expanded CWC, unlike the Confederations Cup, is a major event in its own right. It makes no sense to maintain it as testing/warm-up event. Until I hear more on this I'm going to chalk it up to media speculation.

    Coming back to 2021. The FIFA council agenda has been published. There it is as item number four. With no surprises regarding the host, that leaves the question of qualification, whether there will be host team (probably) and whether there will be a country restriction (hard to implement in my opinion).
     
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