They are poaching in the middle of the season - got busted in Rockford and openly state they are going after Eclipse players during the season. Two different things. One is just fine - the other is no different then what Magic did. But yet you say... "That's been my limited but very much confirmed experience." Which hardly makes sense in of itself to begin with. That started the Winter of last season because the club did not want to find the 05 girls in the same position as the 04 team in which only 4 longstanding Sockers players made the DA. BC took Fall to determine who was the best and shit canned the rest. Integrating the best for NPL is great - but that should be age appropriate. Instead they are bouncing up 2006 players and displacing 05 players - not development - that's all about winning - in a lousy league at that. Even worse is that the rest of the 05 players only have 4 games. Great - you are shit binned, get no additional opoprtunities, train with a pool worse then where you came from and you only get 4 games??? Come on man - there is no winning that one. Maybe because you are at Sockers. Parents who had left and are still there all agree... One coach on one side of the field and a coach on the other. Two teams or groups running rondo... Slowly the coaches merge to the middle and just start chatting. Bad habits are not corrected and mistakes are not pointed out. I've seen players shunned by their team because they make the same mistakes in critical games over and over. I'm 55 minutes away (each way) and as a result have watching virtually every practice since my youngest was 6 and rarely if at all have I see coaches correct this behavior in practices - which is why it carries over to games. It's try out season and this entire statement sounds like a promo. It's worse then when I was drinking the kool aid - that's bad! I think you are overly harsh in todays climate. I'm seeing more kids stay with their clubs and parents and players leaving the big clubs. Again CSA and Chicago Inter are growing. We have Eclipse and Sockers players looking at our 05, 06 and 07 teams. Are they the top players at Sockers? Nope but it sure is getting harder for that club to field PDA teams that are age appropriate and it's been that way since 2012/2013. Part of this is parents learning more from sites like this and parents who are involved in the sport as coaches and so on. Again - sounds like a promo during try out season. Huge issue here... Free play is a massive part of what other cultures maintain when it comes to this sport. Sockers maintains a USSF style of play and have to adhear to that because they are a DA club. That is one reason why outside play is prohibited. The arrogance from both organizations on this point is ridiculous. The fact that it dictates that to the point where players and parents refuse to even consider outside play - which there are many, is completely back asswards in terms of the customer-provider relationship. Yeah so with 8 years of experience at Sockers - 2 kids and more... I'm going to say if your boy and really good and u10 and up, there is not better place then Sockers for sure. For girls, numbers show that the wide majority of top players are developed at other clubs and come over at u12/u13/u14. That's certainly not a ringing endorsement. However if your player is u14 and up and in the top 5%... Sure! You can make the DA at Sockers and play on one of the lowest teams in the region. So location and cost should come into play. If you are closer to FCU or Eclipse - then I recommend a try out there because from 04 down they are posting better teams. Dont drink the kool aid though! If your not on a DA or ECNL team then why move. As mentioned there are much better clubs out there producting far better non-DA and non ECNL teams then the big three. Here is what was posted earlier... Of the top 20 teams in Region 2 for 2005 girls, 7 of them participate in the ECNL, 5 play in the MRL, 4 play in US Youth National League and only 4 participate in the DA - none are from Illinois. Yeah that sums it up. Kids that have no love of the game should play at other clubs. BTW the commitment my kid has to make at a non DA/ECNL club is far greater then the commitment her former PDA team has at Sockers. But she's just doing it because I make her - she does not really love the game at all.
Ryan, you had a lot to say but I think this was the most important. If your kid is playing at a very young age almost every day then they will develop, no matter what club he or she plays for. All of us have had different experiences and are relating those here. None are right or wrong but personal because it was or is our kid. My experience...I agree that Sockers has been the rock in Chicago for youth soccer. I had kids playing for different clubs (Galaxy, Fire Juniors, Eclipse, and 1 defunct) and all ended up at Sockers. Galaxy, Fire Jrs and the defunct had good training, committed coaches, and we had good experiences. The issue was just more talent, and more and better training at Sockers as they got older. Eclipse on the other hand has always had the talent at older ages (they rely on recruiting) but very poor training. They rely on the girls to train on their own or together outside of the club to improve. The exception is that DD does a good job for Eclipse. So I think you can get good training at a young age at many clubs, but Sockers is the only club in Chicago that I believe has a soccer culture. And I think you feel that when you are there. They even offer training for college-age kids over summers and breaks to kids from any club. You didn't have to play for Sockers. And it is large enough to present opportunities if your kid wants to play 2 days per week or 6. But it is not a perfect meritocracy. Some kids get overlooked, others are favored, but this will happen anywhere and happens in life.
'Tryout season promo" uh no...I don't think Sockers has a problem getting kids to tryout if the ashen white look on parents faces is any indication each time a new kid shows up to practice week in / week out. Coaches bad habits comment...do not see that at all. Not even close. And I don't see attention on the great players. In fact it's the opposite. Correction is happening with the kids who need the help way more often than not. Believe it or not I firmly believed Sockers was a place that was only about the stars. That narrative is 100% false. Sounds like you're with a club doing some promoting? Good for you... I think there's a lot of great clubs in the area and some really good people trying to turn around some once really great clubs. My limited but confirmed comment is simple...I don't have eight years at Sockers. But I can absolutely confirm that our experience has been top notch. These coaches give a shit. Someone mentioned it earlier...something gets canceled they make it up. Team isn't doing well, all of a sudden a new practice is posted for the week. They care. Culture, culture, culture...Sockers has it straight up. Argue with me all you want. You clearly have an axe to grind with the girls program. It's struggling and everything you tell me and I'm hearing speaks of an organization trying to figure it out. To get the pump going so they regularly get an influx of talent. Hard to do when Eclipse is the female equivalent of Sockers Boys program. Anyway...don't want to go back and forth. It's my opinion. I'm just a Dad who loves the game and has kids who ***LOVE*** their experience at Sockers thus far...can't ask for anything more than that and I know this club racket well so I won't hold my breathe that it lasts forever.
Sockers does promote a culture for sure. And they have a good balance of coachinig development. Players are focused early on for DA. I can attest to that because when the girls side moved over from ECNL my 05 was not happy. She watching the ECNL vids on Youtube - had some gear and was disapointed. So she was in that culture for sure and Sockers enabled that.
When we came to Sockers with my oldest there were 3 u12 girls teams and only 2 locations. Plenty more at other ages as well. Decline year after year. Not hard to find these numbers by the way. The biggest impact to the decline was removing the girls from NISL play and training with the boys. The year they did that, most teams were under-performing in the middle of IWSL B divisions. That stalled the program right there. Not playing indoor competition for years also damaged the program. However the latter they resolved this winter with DR finally agreeing to set the girls up (u13 and down only) at Canlan. Promoting my club??? I think I have equally promoted Team Chicago and Galaxy for girls - now Chicago Inter because they have shown a good deal of success on the girls side. I have also jammed Eclipse for the same reasons Toe Poke mentioned. Do you know anything about these clubs - their coaches and so on??? Again - even here - it would not take long to review my posts and see this.
Amen! If I could rep this comment 100 times I would. Life is often not a meritocracy. This is a good lesson for preteens and teens to learn as part of developing emotional maturity.
Ryan can you please rundown what a good training looks like at Sockers? i.e. for an hour of practice what do they do.
Agree. Along with personal maturity, my daughter has learned a ton from her experience at both Sockers and CSA. She is a better player and kid for her experiences at both. She's also a much better coach for her u6 and u10 rec teams. It's the journey - not the end that matters. I wish more parents realized that.
All for you promoting your clubs my friend. Eclipse I know very good friends who have kids there and played on uber teams. I've heard (several) first hand stories of coaches calling young girls the "C" word. I've heard the owner did something really sketchy when he coached high school. I've heard all sorts of stuff... But I learned my lesson with Sockers...I believed/bought into the rumors/whisper campaigns. Then we went to a tryout/practice to see what it was all about. So glad we did that... I know several parents in the sockers age brackets you speak of (girls)..they're really happy there. I know some who have left... On another note... speaking of Eclipse. Why are they doubling down on ECNL? For girls I get it...the DA is a mess and probably won't sort itself out for a bit. But on the boys side...why wouldn't they become a DA? There's no question that will be THE game in town for a long time to come in US Youth Soccer. And isn't all these clubs screwed (boys side again) if Fire break their lease and have a much more accessible location? Tough to compete vs a pro franchise (and I emphasize the word franchise over club) that is free.
Sorry...I have to get back to work to pay for the ridiculous club fees! Go to a tryout..your kid participates in a practice. I think you can go to two of them...or more. Highly recommend it.
Can someone do the same practice rundown for Eclipse u13 please? I'ts a spirited discussion with valid points from all. Volk certainly has knowledge of the Chicago market and been helpful in providing feedback to me. Ryan has made clear points that something is working for his kids. There have been clubs mentioned in previous posts which I am very familiar with and have researched. I think key takeaways: Boys and girls are different. Different development, different peaks and valleys, maturity, mentality, physical qualities. Different clubs just cater better to either sex and cater to different levels of plays and development. Galaxy used to be only about the boys so things can shift. Soccers is about the boys, that could shift. TC is about the girls, that could shift. I am convinced that culture starts in the home. My kid yesterday had a day off yesterday and watched Zidane's roulette videos. She did his variation after watching them, but I asked her when and why would you do them? Do kids get this feedback at every home? Is that the responsibility of the club? Passion and ingrained mentality starts at home. Volk mentioned top 5% and clubs for those kids. I think the point he is making is some clubs are just that and there is nothing wrong with that. It's the same system for professional sports or in the workforce. Some people will just outperform others, ie outliers. People can argue about development at those same clubs but an elite elite will never struggle in that environment. So the remaining options are still wider for the remaining 95%, many of which are capable and will develop into something. Clubs are dictated by coaches that care. Club philosophy and a guided program are very important to me now. My kid is an elite elite playing for a top name club. Why am I entertaining other clubs? Because of lack of vision and philosophy about team and individual development. Not sure I need to worry about that at an Eclipse but everyone would need to really understand the coach and philosophy if making a change or determining value in a club. All the major clubs Volk has mentioned have excellent teams but also very poor teams. I can tell you for a fact there are major holes in a top level club that Volk mentioned. Reputation will only garner you so much and with the competition within Chicago, up and comers that offer vision, philosophy, culture, structure and coaching depth will win. I believe many clubs are in the dark and a golden age may begin with technology and better tools to train. There are clubs in Chicago that I know very well that have coaches whose players will follow them around from club to club. That is what I want to hear and yes there is politics with that. But for an elite elite it may not matter. But for a talented kid with potential to get in, practice, learn, develop in that environment is far more impactful than a coach who plays a system and needs parts and will rotate in and out till a fit is found. Tryouts are strenuous for the parent and the kid. Take the stress out of it and do the research upfront and talk to coaches, understand their vision and club, practice with them if you can and know where you stand prior to the tryout. Point is there so many options, no one is doing it better than anyone else. Some is inherent characteristics of your kid, some is the coach and club. My belief now is that for an elite elite it's about a venue. I have yet to determine if that is u13,u14 etc. For a talented kid with potential, it's about structure, coaching and individual development. For a kid with limited skillset or lack of desire, club is not an option. For parents that don't care you are wasting your money or limiting the potential in your kid. At least we can agree that everyone here does care and doing this for your kid and the passion it brings in life.
I think you've lost the plot. Sounds like your experience is less limited then you led on? Eclipse comment is totally true - and expected. I would not take my kid there either because if you end up with a bad coach you are screwed. Eclipse made a mistake by pushing BK to the Red Stars and moving NK over. They will lose players but they will likely be going North and not NW. Why 2 ECNL teams... It's not abnormal. Many of the ECNL clubs have gone with two teams because they have the numbers and they needed to fill gaps which clubs left - having left for GDA. However - that trend has completely reversed. Slammers/PDA/Hawks/Stars and many more have come back. Sockers will always be the rock for boys in Chicagoland. A cold day in hell would not change that. They have worked hard on the boys side. Far less on the girls side. Look at the number of training sessions and opportunities the boys get - ridiculously lopsided. But that is equally a cultural issues that other clubs (Magic/Fire) fall into as well. Again - taking the girls out of NISL was the real killer. They did that for marketing reasons and it failed. It exposed a good deal of problems, Coaches were then removed/swapped out over the course of two seasons. The winter program (games) fell apart completely. Coaches who only coached boys in the past were now coaching girls and that was really interesting in of itself. Like Eclipse - there are bad coaches but far fewer at Sockers. Eclipse coaches may swear but I know of one coach telling parents "Your kid is really slow - and I don't mean just on the field". Other coaches who did nothing to contribute to fixing the bad habits of long time players then bad mouthing those players to parents on the same team. It's hit or miss everywhere. If your kid is happy, passionate and growing, then you are in the right place - leave it alone.
A lot of small sided games to mimic real game/game speed scenarios in a nutshell... If you're looking for a good club see if the kids can string more than five passes together on a consistent basis...if you see winning records/top tier divisions and you don't see the consistent passing (possession) run...
First year at the club = limited Knowing people with kids at clubs all over Chicagoland, including Sockers = not limited.
I would like to mention again. When it's all going right for your kid, the experience is great. But when it's not - and wrongfully so, it's completely different. Like I mentioned parents may only see that players get less game time. They may not understand what is happening at training and the impacts it has - especially on girls.
Sooo much back and forth here. As someone who has been through it all and is done now (child playing in college), all the debate is worthless, everyone's experience is different. Find a coach who will develop your child. It doesn't matter what club, how big, what level they are at until your child is U14 or older. Eclipse, Sockers, or any big club are constantly looking to replace and upgrade. It is far better to bring your player late to these clubs than early. Many of these coaches mentioned in this thread my kids played for and most of them, including the ones mentioned as great/good, spent practice watching the kids play 90 minutes of transition, run, shoot, repeat. There are a ton of great coaches out there, find them and take advantage of their talent. It will be a lot of work, but if you want to develop your player, do not rely on the club to do it, it is on you. Same goes for college recruiting. Also, remember, if you are trying to get your kid money in college, send them to a tutor, their odds are significantly better.
Isn’t it ultimately on the player? Best player at my daughter’s club/age group visually checks in with her dad throughout every game, every training, every futsal game, etc. Makes a mistake? Checks for Dad’s reaction. Scores a goal? Smiles at Dad. Pretty sure she’s going to have to decide to play for herself at some point. Wonder how she’ll react when he quits driving (literally and figuratively.)
Yes - as the trend on the girls side I see and know of at Sockers and Eclipse - this is true. I think FCU is a bit different because they have a huge Trevian base under them. Hard to say on the boys side at Sockers because they have massive numbers to start out with. My point is there are far better places to learn the game and get the attention that players need to grow. The big three will put it all together with a style of play - college exposure and more. Very worthy cause if your kid is looking to play college and so on. That said - some of these other clubs are capable of placing kids in college as well. Remember that some of the top teams in region II are playing MRL/National League and not in either ECNL or DA.
Yes, some day the player will have to learn, you can be there to help in the process, but if they are looking at you on the field, the end is near...
I feel like i disagree with that statement. My daughter who's only U11 just left a big ECNL Club after a little over a year. She now plays for a smaller club and is applying what she learned i.e. checking shoulder, creating space, movement off the ball, active 1st touch etc.. I think the bigger club laid a great foundation for her to build off of and perhaps she would never have learned those things so young at another club. Her teammates are great players but lack the skills i just described. To counter that i know a U13 who just did the exact opposite (left same smaller club we're at now to join the big ECNL club) and seems to be far behind her teammates. She's athletic and a good player but never learned those things. She's struggling for PT and to even get rostered for most games.