Build-Out Lines for Fun and Profit

Discussion in 'Referee' started by Pittsburgh Ref, Jul 21, 2017.

  1. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've had some games using the build-out line in U9/10. I can tell the rules weren't made by someone with a deep understanding of the LOTG. Here's what our one-page rules say. (Emphasis is mine)

    This is in Law...I mean Rule 1.

    B. Build out lines: Build out lines are located halfway between the box and midfield line on both sides of the field. When the goalkeeper has the ball, either during play or from a goal kick, the opposing team must move behind the build out line. After the ball is put into play by the goalkeeper, the opposing team can cross the build out line, play resumes as normal.​

    And then Law 16-

    Rule 16 - Goal Kick Conform to FIFA. All players defending the goal kick must be no closer than the build-out line until the kick is struck.
    Just going off of Law 16, I'd take that to mean that players can cross the build-out line as soon as the ball is kicked. In Law 1, there is mention of "after the ball is put into play" which could mean once it leaves the penalty area. However, that part seems to be relating to when the keeper has the ball during live play.

    And to top it off, the assignor says that the other team can't cross until the ball leaves the penalty area on a goal kick.

    At this rate, the season is almost done and the teams have settled in on players being able to "charge in" the moment the ball is kicked.
     
  2. Vinnydabody

    Vinnydabody Member

    Jun 10, 2014
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    USSF has heard our prayers and petitions and provided some additional guidance on the BOL in their last email blast to referees (emphasis added):

    I wonder whether AYSO will revise their national rules and regulations on this especially for the goal kick bit, since their current interpretation is that opposing players can cross the BOL once the ball has been kicked.
     
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  3. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Update to my previous post - For the last week of the season at U9/U10, they let the teams know that the other team can't cross the buildout line until the ball is touched by a teammate of the GK or the ball crosses the buildout line. It worked a lot better and resulted in play that was much closer to the purpose of the buildout lines.
     
  4. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009

    AYSO has announced that is not making any changes right now because it is so close to the end of the season. (My guess is there will be a few changes for next year now that there has been a full year of play with the BOL, but that is just my guess.)
     
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  5. CPT_Hoolie

    CPT_Hoolie Member

    May 2, 2013
    Florida (South)
    In the last two weeks I've seen some bad habits in youth players caused by the build out line.

    I'm AR2, U12B game, first age group where BOL not used locally. Keeper sets the ball down on the ground after a save and kicks it out to the side -- to a marked player.

    Same game, keeper again sets ball on the ground after a save. Coach, or maybe parent, hollers "You can punt it!" -- so goalie picks it back up. Tweet, IFK.

    I understand the idea of the BOL in theory, but in practice I think it is shaping up to be counterproductive. So far I'm not a fan.
     
  6. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    That sounds a whole lot more like a kid who doesn't play keeper much than a problem from the BOL--which didn't exist last year when the kid was at a younger level. (Or is this a kid playing in tow different leagues and under different rule sets?)
     
  7. CPT_Hoolie

    CPT_Hoolie Member

    May 2, 2013
    Florida (South)
    That's possible, or maybe he was playing up.
     
  8. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wait, you're bringing up a problem with a league going against the directive and blaming that on the build out line?
     
  9. CPT_Hoolie

    CPT_Hoolie Member

    May 2, 2013
    Florida (South)
    I'm not sure what you're referring to. My belief is that players who have gotten used to the build out line have developed some bad habits that can cause other problems.
     
  10. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Playing from the back and build comfort on the ball is a bad habit and pressing a GK in a small sided game is a good habit? The problem here is a local league deviating from what is now the standard. This is not a build out line problem. The question I'd ask here is what could the referee team do to help deal with the confusion the poor goalkeeper experienced? You may think this a stupid question but the game is for the kids. He's getting conflicting advice in game and put in a situation where he needs to follow two conflicting models of play. I've been in games where a young player is confused and feeling some pressure. Is there any harm in stopping the game for a second to clear up his confusion and restarting with a dropped ball?

    If there is a flaw, I'd put it down to coaching. If we're teaching players to mindlessly play short, that's clearly bad and not at all what this is meant to instill. Its about decision-making, keeping shape, and developing some balance. The line is there because adults place more emphasis on results and exploiting weakness than they do teaching soccer. As you start play it's meant to instill some sense of safety so you can build good habits, comfort on the ball, and learn how to make decisions. As you defend, you're meant to learn how to defend together and press with some purpose.

    It's also important to understand that this concept is not an American invention either. It's been borrowed from countries like Spain.
     
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  11. CPT_Hoolie

    CPT_Hoolie Member

    May 2, 2013
    Florida (South)
    Agree completely and have done just that -- but in this case I was the AR.

    No doubt.
     
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  12. voiceoflg

    voiceoflg Member+

    Dec 8, 2005
    The first directive from USSF and Georgia Soccer said "No punts." So a couple areas I ref in allowed dropkicks. This season it states "No punts or dropkicks." U10B game today, my last of three. The keeper makes a save and waits for opponents to get behind the buildout line. He then pushes the ball down to the ground, it bounces up and a teammate boots it past the midline. I blow the whistle and call dropkick. The coach argues. I said "the purpose is to teach the players to build out from the back and that was not building out from the back. That was a two man dropkick. Indirect kick." I'll ask the assignor later, but I feel in the spirit of the rule, I was right.
     
  13. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    COACHES STOP GAMING THE SYSTEM IN AN ATTEMPT TO WIN U10 SOCCER GAMES
     
  14. El Rayo Californiano

    Feb 3, 2014
    Well, at least they haven’t tried a two-person punt. Yet.
     
  15. Timbuck

    Timbuck Member

    Jul 31, 2012
    That is amazing. I wonder how much time the coach wasted at practice trying to teach this.
    “Every line up and we’ll take turns smashing a bouncing ball as far as we can”
     
  16. voiceoflg

    voiceoflg Member+

    Dec 8, 2005
    After a 7v7 game with the buildout line, I spoke with an older referee I had not met before. I asked him about how he's handling the rule. He said it was fine. He liked using the line to see offside, the no punting, etc. He also said he only had to call "two line pass only once." I asked "two line pass?" He said when a player passes the ball from behind the midline to a player who receives it past the buildout line. I asked "Was the attacker ahead of the buildout line and behind the 2LD when the ball was kicked?" He said "It doesn't matter. You can't pass across two lines like that."

    Sigh
     
  17. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Must have been an old hockey fan...
     
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  18. El Rayo Californiano

    Feb 3, 2014
    The infraction here is grassing.
     
  19. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's not even an infraction in hockey anymore!
     
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  20. FootyPDX

    FootyPDX Member

    Portland Timbers
    England
    Nov 21, 2017
    My local indoor soccer club has that rule for youth and coed. They have lines similar to the build-out lines.
     
  21. wguynes

    wguynes Member

    Dec 10, 2010
    Altoona, IA
    It took me forever to figure out what the heck you guys are talking about. In Iowa, our "academy" matches (9U-10U) use "build out" lines. It's the center line.
     
  22. Bubba Atlanta

    Bubba Atlanta Member+

    Mar 2, 2012
    Yep, Atlanta
    Club:
    Atlanta United FC
    You got to keep 'em separated...
     
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