Yeah for the Dutch league I think that are the two best (not necessarily in that order; here the one nicks it away from the other and launches a good pass) - Kindvall etcetera just a bit behind. This is also the season with that goal against Ronald Koeman's dad. Well spotted and seen by you, to pick out these two (I know you watch a good amount of archive material etc.). Unlike other seasons I don't think one stood head and shoulders above others, but others in Holland see this different. For the Belgian league, including international games, I think the top is formed by Van Himst, Roger Claesen and Polleunis. Claesen and his Standard forced AC Milan to a (contested) replay match, to name one thing. If it's appreciated I can return to all these guys a bit later.
I already looked a bit into Polleunis actually! I wondered if he might be an outside candidate for next season if anything in the end....
Pilot, Standard's Luxemburge, is mentioned in the balon dor list. Would he be ahead of Claessen for this season?
Well seen. I think Pilot (for some he's Luxemburg's best ever player) got his 1967 vote for his 1966-67 season when he won the domestic cup, reached the semis in Europe and had decent/good games (plus goal against Belgium NT!) for his national team. He got his 1968 vote for the start of 1968-69, on the way to the championship and a career best goals total (in the league, 8 non-penalty goals, and all competitions). In 1967-68 season he played only 20 league games and scored a low 2 goals (only two seasons in his entire career where he did worse), had an international goal against Aberdeen and as far as I can tell only 3 games for Luxemburg with little of note. So tentatively I don't think it was better as topscorer Claesen, with Luxemburgs 'Golden Player' (BdO listed 1967 - 1969) being better the season before and after. Not his fault to get injured.
I guess I'll honor Claessen again for Standard's achievement. Lol, if George Best was the 5th Beatle, then Roger Claessen would be the 6th Rolling Stone.
Italy: It was a strong year for Italian football. At the club level AC Milan won the league in convincing fashion (Scored 20 more goals than their closest rivals, finished 9 points clear, nearly won a treble as they were runners up in the Italian Cup). In European competition Juventus made the semifinals of the EC, Bologna the semis of the FC, and AC Milan won the CWC. The national team won the European Championship in strange fashion, never really appearing to play that well and having a major lack of consistency in selections throughout the season. Some of this is due to new players being tried out and injuries to star players. Half the lineup seems to change from game to game. Something you usually do not see on the way to a tournament win. They won the semifinal on a coin flip after a 0-0 draw vs the Soviets. They were outplayed in the final by Yugoslavia but managed a 1-1 draw and finally played better in the replay (helped by a key player lost for Yug.) and won 2-0. Best performances were 4-0 over the Swiss to advance from their group, 2-0 over Bulgaria to advance from the quarterfinals, and the final replay. Kurt Hamrin (AC Milan) Right-wing: League winner: 23(8), Italian Cup Runner Up 8(2), CWC Winner 8(4). Scored a brace in the CWC final. Giovanni Lodetti (AC Milan, Italy) Center-mid: League winner: 29(2), Italian Cup Runner Up 10(2), CWC Winner 10(0). Played once for Italy in the first final match vs YUG. Pierino Prati (AC Milan, Italy) Left-wing: League winner: 29(15), Italian Cup Runner Up 7(3), CWC Winner 8(4). Top scorer in Serie A. Had excellent performances in the late stages of the CWC. Played four times for Italy scoring 2 goals, one in each leg of the QF vs Bulgaria. Had to compete with Riva for caps. Gianni Rivera (AC Milan, Italy) Attacking-mid, Inside-forward: League winner: 29(11), Italian Cup Runner Up 5(3), CWC Winner 10(1). Capped four times for Italy. Was injured before the final vs YUG and did not play. Was at the center of some of the better offensive performances in earlier stages. Ballon d'Or 9th place. Roberto Rosato (AC Milan, Italy) Center-back: League winner: 28(0), Italian Cup Runner Up 9(1), CWC Winner 10(0). Played twice for Italy including the final replay victory. Karl-Heinz Schnellinger (AC Milan) Left-back, Center-back: League winner: 27(0), Italian Cup Runner Up 9(1), CWC Winner. Antonio Juliano (Napoli, Italy) Center-mid: 2nd place in the league 27(1). Capped 7 times for Italy. Dino Zoff (Napoli, Italy) Goalkeeper: Part of Napoli's record second place finish and excellent defensive record. Earned his first four caps after an injury let him into the team. Played the final four games of the Euro. Luigi Riva (Cagliari, Italy) Left-wing: 9th in the league: 23(13) tied for the #2 scorer in the league. Played 4 times for Italy scoring 7 goals, including 1 in the final replay. Ballon d'Or 6th place. Had to compete with Prati for caps. Angelo Domenghini (Internazionale, Italy) Right-wing: 5th in league 26(11). Played all 8 games for Italy scoring 4 goals. Scored the goal that saved Italy in the final and allowed a replay. One of Italy's better players throughout the uneven Euro. 24th Ballon d'Or Sandro Mazzola (Internazionale, Italy) Inside-forward, Center-forward: 5th in league 28(6). Played 6 times for Italy scoring 3 goals. Was probably the best player in the final replay. 17th Balon d'Or. Giacinto Facchetti (Internazionale, Italy) Left-back: 5th in league. Played all games for Italy as captain. 5th in Ballon d'Or voting with two first place votes. Struggled in the final vs YUG. Not sure what his best performances were that garnered this vote. Maybe more symbolic as famous player and captain for winning team. Really looked bad in the first leg of the final, repeatedly beaten. Spain: Real Madrid had a good season with a strong showing in the European Cup nearly making the final after narrow losing to United. Knocked out of good Ajax team in round 1. Spanish teams were disappointing in the Fairs Cup. Spain made it out of its Euro qualifying group but were beaten by England in the QF. Pirri (Real Madrid, Spain) Center-mid: League winners: 28(10), Copa Gen finalist 5(0), EC semifinalist 8(3). Scored vs Ajax and Man U. played 5 times for Spain scoring once in the 2-1 win over the Czech's that allowed them to advance to the QF in the Euro. 10th place Ballon d'Or Amancio (Real Madrid, Spain) Right-wing: League winners: 28(10), Copa Gen finalist 8(4), EC semifinalist 7(4). Scored a hat trick vs Sparta Prague in the EC QF. In the second leg of the semifinal vs Man U was excellent and scored the goal that put Real up 3-1 and in position to win the tie until the late George Best inspired comeback. Played 5 times scoring twice for Spain. In the return leg vs England scored the goal to put Spain up 1-0 and even the tie before England's late comeback. Francisco Gento (Real Madrid, Spain) Left-wing: League winners: 24(8), Copa Gen finalist 1(0), EC semifinalist 7(5). Real's top scorer in the EC. Played twice for Spain. Portugal: The national team disappointingly failed to move past the group stage of the Euro after the strong WC in 66. The team failed to score a single goal in the final two decisive games vs Bulgaria. Benfica made the EC Final and had a great chance to win the match in regulation. Jose Augusto Torres (Benfica, Portugal) Center-forward. League winner, EC runner up 2 goals scored. Eusebio (Benfica, Portugal) Inside-forward: League winner 24(42) league and European top scorer. EC runner up 9(6) EC top scorer. 8th place Ballon d'Or. Antonio Simoes (Benfica, Portugal) Left-wing: League winner, EC runner up. Jose Augusto (Benfica, Portugal) Right-wing: League winner, EC runner up scored one goal. Mario Coluna (Benfica, Portugal) Center-mid: League winner, EC runner up. Jamie Graca (Benfica, Portugal) Attacking-mid: League winner, EC runner up scored one goal.
I might have been tempted by Lodetti without the DBS ratings being available funnily enough, even to contend for the central midfield slot in my Team of the Year potentially, being someone who contributed well with the ball (the 1967/68 Videoteca Milan highlights on YouTube enhance that feeling if anything for this season). But I guess I do and should pay attention when an average rating is a bit off being exceptional. For the opposite reason (the exceptional DBS rating, which led me in turn to see the highlights I'd not have been looking up otherwise quite probably) I still feel Nene is really an option for my 23. So I guess I'd ask you to list him too Tom. Or maybe we can vote for players that aren't listed nominees (therefore agreed by Tom as candidates) anyway - I don't know whether annoyed and/or wm might have selected players that way last time or not (I haven't gone and checked but it might be the case). I don't think I'm going to need him as an option for Team of the Season anyway (although if I do put him in my 23 he will be one I guess) as although Best did play in various roles again I think, that right wing berth seems the best slot to put him in and I'm pretty certain I'll be doing that.
Best @7, agreed. Tom makes a good selection but he does like for us to complement it. Each of us has their own criteria. Omitting Bercellino, for me, is like denying that Juventus made it to the EC1 semifinals. Perhaps for others the euro is simply more important, despite the few matches played. What is your take on Mazzola vs Domenghi vs Nene vs Riva? Also Cooper vs Wilson vs Dunne? And Moore vs Jack Charlton?
Well, Mazzola and Nene are the ones I'm going with for this season I think - the ratings suggest so - Mazzola could also be considered a key Italian player ultimately in the Euros also. I'm not sure exactly where I place him among the top names as yet though - I think I might have a top 5, old Ballon d'Or style, that doesn't include him but maybe I shouldn't reveal that just yet at this early stage. Left backs I might need to look into more to be honest. I'm already thinking I could be leaving both Gemmell/Facchetti out of my 23 and potentially going without a left back in that this time (as opposed to right back last time). In general maybe Moore had dropped off more from his peak since the World Cup, but maybe that's more relevant to 66/67. His team was less in contention near the top in England at this stage of course, but he retains his place for England which J.Charlton doesn't, and is inherently the all-time great. I didn't have either in my plans so am maybe not the best to comment in detail though.
I'm going to go back and watch all the games from Euro 68 again as I need to update my book. I just watched England-Yugoslavia yesterday and overall it was a very poor game. Charlton started really poorly. Gave possession away cheaply 3 times in a row. He grew into the game though and was a threat in the second half. Physically he looked fine. He was his typical self as well in the way he played, very stylish in everything he did, graceful and effortless. There was an air of menace with him in possession and it was clear Yugoslavia were wary of him and his ability to go past people. He was just very sloppy in some of his final balls. Moore, although at fault for the only goal, was good. Imperious in his use of the ball, all of the defenders deferred to him and he would frequently take the ball off the toes of others to start attacks. He was though (as all of the England team were) wasteful in his use of the ball at times. A few free-kicks were wasted as he hit them into the wall or out of play. Ball was good. Industrious, always chasing lost causes and neat in his use of the ball. Dzajic was impressive for Yugoslavia but not great. He went on one superb dribble and was lively but didn't get on the ball that much. Petkovic was also one of the best performers, as was Osim who always looked composed in possession. Pantelic was not tested at all by shots but was commanding in his control of the area and claimed a lot of crosses. Not much to say on the rest. It was a dire game, full of fouls and very little quality.
I'd tend to agree with comme from what I saw and remember of England-Yugoslavia. Dzajic did show sparks of quality and danger, and I'd think with the way he took his goal he'd be a valid Man of the Match (taking that goal certainly decided the match and that's not everything for MOTM but helps of course), but wasn't constantly involved indeed. I think that Yugoslavia generation, outside of Dzajic, was not the countries most talented of the surrounding 20 years or so even, considering the more revered teams/players of the 50s and that they might even have produced a few more quality players for the Intl side by the 70s too. They actually played better against England at Wembley in 1972, in terms of constructive and attacking play. But of course that was a friendly not a Euros semi-final. I recall Mazzola playing pretty well in the Final replay game I think especially, but he wasn't involved in the goals. Going back to annoyed's question, I guess the euros in general (qualifiers included) does help the case of Riva and Domenghini with the goals they scored. This video (following on from part 1, which could possibly contain the odd clip from 67/68 too - the clips are in order pretty much but not completely I think - I've been able to identify I think a few games certain goals were scored in where it's not obviously clear, using the Man Utd results pages I showed on the other thread) shows 67/68 goals from Manchester United up until the Final vs Benfica (or thereabouts - again the ordering might not be perfect). Based on it, and Buchan's poll results, plus the fact there was a European campaign in which he scored twice in the Final, and a Euros campaign in which he scored vs Spain at Wembley to help make the Final stages, it does seem Charlton's season being better than his previous one is likely. Whether some of his late-season 66/67 goals were not captured and were extremely impressive too I wouldn't be sure though - it's not like today where everything is televised although I don't know exactly about the percentage of goals being shown on local news etc:
I don't have it. I keep an eye on ebay for them so if it pops up at a reasonable price I will get it, but unlikely.
I will add everyone to the list of nominees that anyone has any intention of voting for. I want everyone to nominate players. I am just working off a list a made a few days ago at this early stage.
The nomination process is open. Please nominate any players you see fit and add any relevant info for profiles. The more everyone contributes the better for me. You are likely to convince me a player is worth voting for and take some of the workload off my shoulders. It is time consuming to type all these out I am totally willing to share all these duties.
To make things as clear as possible, this is how I think the early stages of these threads will work best. Everyone nominates players in a semi formal process. Just make a post with some basic information: name, club, country, maybe # of games/goals and caps etc. Then a little bit of information on why you think he should be nominated. There is some reason you rate the player in this season. State that reason as briefly or thoroughly as you see fit. I would like every player that will be voted for in a 23 to be nominated first. If you see a player you want to vote for that is not nominated yet please nominate them. Once we are confident a thorough list of nominees is accumulated I will list them all together and we can vote. The reason I have nominating players is not because I want control of the process, I just want to keep things moving. Please look at the first post if you are unsure about the timeline. @comme @PuckVanHeel @schwuppe @annoyedbyneedoflogin @PDG1978 @Gregoriak @Perú FC @msioux75 @ManiacButcher @peterhrt @AD78 @Ariaga II @wm442433 @Tropeiro @Titanlux
I will give you informations I found from different countries which might have relevant players for this list: Starting with Hungary Average Player ratings and allstar team from Nemzeti Sport 1967 World XI Dec 1967 Kepes Sport Nemzeti Sport 1968 Later on my might make a detailed game by game break down. Ferencvaros won both league titles - might seem odd how the highest rated forwards are Ujpest players in 1968. Closer look at the league table Ujpest not winning the league with that GD? Really dominating goalscoring. What a weird result - like City getting relegated as the topscorer or Perugia "Invincibles" not winning the league
I was just meaning the one Puck posted about in the 66/67 thread (with a link to another thread), but I don't have a breakdown of tallies or anything for 1967/68 - just the top 10 can be seen as for all the seasons in the 60s but Charlton and Best are put right at the top this time anyway:
Via looking at the Russian Wikpedia page for Byshovets I did notice this though for the Soviet League - a vote for best XI and two reserve XIs of the season/year: https://translate.google.com/transl...0_%D0%B2_%D0%A1%D0%A1%D0%A1%D0%A0&prev=search https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Список_33_лучших_футболистов_сезона_в_СССР
Byshovets feels an obvious one, but I don't have much of an idea from a wider perspective of how the games went.
Maybe not a bad idea to post the Eric Batty World Soccer XI in the thread, just for a reference like last season too (although a calendar year selection, and often controversial):
Maybe also good to ask @Titanlux whether you have anything again for the Spanish league in terms of ratings or summaries? I think for me it's fairly unlikely to change things re: Amancio in terms of making the top 23 but not top 3, but I guess I like to make a bit more of an estimated order (including suggested top 10) for my own entertainment too! Similar case for Pirri maybe even too. But I'd think in general people would appreciate seeing anything you'd have to shine more light on La Liga performances again.