BigSoccer's Players of the Season: 1873

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Tom Stevens, Mar 3, 2019.

  1. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    This thread covers the 1872-73 football season.

    The FA Cup this season is again won by Wanderers who defeated Oxford University in the Finals. Wanderers only played in the final and did not have to play any previous rounds. Oxford defeated strong opponents Crystal Palace and Royal Engineers, in the semifinal they got a pass to the final when the match vs Queen's Park could not be played.

    Queen's Park played a more robust schedule, facing their future rivals for superiority in Scotland Vale of Leven four times, winning two and drawing two. They ended the season defeating Wanderers in a challenge match in Scotland 1-0.

    England and Scotland played the first two official international matches ever this season. The first was a 0-0 draw in Glasgow vs an all Queen's Park Scottish team. The second was a 4-2 win for England in London vs a Scottish side that was a combination of Queen's Park players and London based Scots playing for English clubs.
     
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  2. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    I will come up with a list of suggested nominees soon.

    You should emphasize Queen's Park defeated Glasgow Wanderers, and not the famous Wanderers from England in the last match of their season.

    It would be great to learn more about the three London vs. Sheffield inter-association matches, where once again the home team won in each case.
    Hopefully peterhrt has access to some match reports for these encounters.

    Oxford University defeated Crystal Palace 3-2 and Royal Engineers 1-0 in the FA Cup. These seem to be important matches, further details about goalscorers and the best players could help us selecting the Top 23 nominees.
     
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  3. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    In 1872-73, Scottish clubs other than Queen's Park started playing to the London FA's rules, resulting in more games north of the border. Queen's Park had been following the London code since joining the FA in late 1870. Rugby was still more popular in Scotland.

    Only 14 teams played in the FA Cup, all from around London or Oxford. Wanderers as holders were granted byes through to the final. There was no semi-final as Queen's Park, also given byes to this stage, and Oxford University were unable to agree a date, leading the Scots to withdraw.

    The centre of British football was still Sheffield, with its own football association, bigger crowds, and more comprehensive media coverage. Sheffield Rules still applied in Northern England and the Midlands. The main difference was no offside, which aided the development of passing and heading. One forward, a “kick through” stayed upfield as a goal-hanger. He was marked by a defending “cover goal”.

    It could be confusing for the press. The third Sheffield v London game, played under Mixed Rules, was recorded as 2-1 in one newspaper and 4-1 in another who counted two “offside” goals. To prevent similar misunderstandings occurring in the FA Cup, Sheffield clubs were barred.

    Main matches 1872-73:

    30 November 1872. Scotland 0 England 0. The first official international.

    Best players – England: Arnold Kirke-Smith, Brockbank, Morice, Clegg. Scotland: Weir, Leckie, Rhind, Wotherspoon, plus backs and half-backs (Ker, Taylor, James Thomson, James Smith). The entire Scottish team was from Queen's Park.

    8 March 1873. England 4 Scotland 2. Goalscorers: Kenyon-Slaney 2, Bonsor, Chenery / Renny-Tailyour, Gibb.

    Best players – England: Kenyon-Slaney, Goodwyn, Howell. It was also stated that Vidal had good moments for England, and Kinnaird and Renny-Tailyour for Scotland - by London sources.

    The Scots' “best two forwards” Weir and Secker were absent. Scotland could only afford eight return rail tickets from Glasgow so three London-based men filled in, including Kinnaird who qualified by owning land in Perthshire.

    26 October 1872. FA Cup. Oxford University 3 Crystal Palace 2. Dixon, Longman, Summer / Armitage, Soden.

    9 December 1872. FA Cup. Oxford University 1 Royal Engineers 0. Arnold Kirke-Smith.

    29 March 1873. FA Cup Final. Wanderers 2 Oxford University 0. Kinnaird, Wollaston

    Best players – Wanderers: Sturgis, Howell, Kinnaird, Welch (gk); OU: Kirke-Smith, Ottaway, Maddison, Leech (gk). Several leading players missing including Hooman, Thompson and Crake for Wanderers, and Nepean for Oxford.

    The match was played in the morning to avoid clashing with the Oxford/Cambridge boat race, which was considered a higher-profile event.

    2 November 1872. Sheffield 3 London 1. Charlie Clegg 2, Willey / Kennedy

    Best players – Sheffield: Clegg, Sampson, Willey, Wood, Carr (gk); London: Kinnaird, Hooman, Chenery, Welch. One of Clegg's goals was described as exceptional.

    4 January 1873. London 1 Sheffield 0. Chenery

    Best players – London: Kinnaird, Wollaston, Chenery, Howell; Sheffield: Sampson, JC Clegg, WE Clegg, A Wood.

    15 March 1873. Sheffield 2 London 1. Charlie Clegg, Thompson og / Chenery

    Best players – Sheffield: AK Smith, Owen, Gregory, Marsh (best game yet), Carr, Sampson, Willey; London: Morten (gk), Chenery, Kinnaird.

    23 November 1872. Sheffield Wednesday 0 Derbyshire 1. A Wood

    Best player - A Wood for Derbyshire.

    Billed as the greatest match yet played at Bramall Lane. It was the first time a Derby team had beaten one from Sheffield. A Wood, a leading Sheffield footballer, represented Derbyshire, who were also beginning to be known as Derby County.

    Queen's Park played seven matches in Scotland, winning five and drawing two. Leading scorers were Jamie Weir and Alex Rhind with 3 goals each.


    Newspaper sources: Bell's Life, London Daily News, Morning Post, Derby Mercury, Sheffield Daily Telegraph, Sheffield Independent, The Scotsman.

    Sources are from the British Newspaper Archive, managed by the British Library Board.
     
  4. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Here are my nominees for the Top 23

    Arthur Kinnaird SCO Wanderers
    captain of the FA Cup winning team; 1 cap for SCO; plays well for London in all three matches against Sheffield, the 1873 Football Annual hailed him as "without exception the best player of the day, capable of taking any place on the field."

    William Kenyon-Slaney ENG Wanderers
    FA Cup (but plays just two matches for Wanderers), scores 2 goals against Scotland

    Robert Gardner SCO Queen's Park
    captain of Queen's Park in the 1872/73 season and Scotland

    Joseph Taylor SCO Queen's Park
    one of the best players of the first international, 2 caps

    William Ker SCO Queen's Park
    one of the best players of the first international, 2 caps, becomes captain of Queen's Park after Gardner leaves at the end of the season

    Alexander Morten ENG Crystal Palace
    ENG captain in March, perhaps the best goalkeeper in the world during the early 1870s

    Cuthbert Ottaway ENG Oxford University
    FA Cup finalist, captain of England in November

    Walpole Vidal ENG Oxford University
    plays well against Scotland, FA Cup finalist

    Charles Clegg ENG Sheffield
    one cap, twice plays well for Sheffield against London

    William Clegg ENG Sheffield
    one cap, once plays well for Sheffield against London

    Arnold Kirke Smith ENG Oxford University
    captains Oxford University in the FA Cup Final and plays well, plays well for England in November

    James Weir SCO Queen's Park
    1 cap, scored many goals during the season

    Billy MacKinnon SCO Queen's Park
    2 caps, scored many goals during the season

    Alex Rhind SCO Queen's Park
    1 cap, scored many goals during the season

    Ernest Greenhalgh ENG Notts County
    2 caps

    Charles Chenery ENG Crystal Palace
    2 caps, scores a goal in the second, plays well for London in all three matches against Sheffield

    David Wotherspoon SCO Queen's Park
    2 caps

    Robert Smith SCO Queen's Park/Norwood
    2 caps

    Henry Renny-Tailyour SCO Royal Engineers
    1 cap, plays well against England

    James Thompson SCO Queen's Park
    2 caps

    GH Sampson ENG The Wednesday (Sheffield)
    played well for "Sheffield" in all three matches against London

    Leonard Howell ENG Wanderers
    plays well against Scotland

    Alfred Goodwyn ENG Royal Engineers
    plays well against Scotland

    A notable absentee is Charles Alcock, twice selected as captain of England, but he is unable to play due to an injury sustained in November (plays only 7 matches for Wanderers this season)

    Finalists
    For the best player of the season I would nominate Kinnaird.
    Many other players could be nominated for the Top3, including Kenyon-Slaney, Gardner, Ker, Kirke Smith, Chenery and Sampson.
     
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  5. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Agree with Kinnaird being first.

    Gardner was at fault with one of the England goals and played in the outfield for half the other international. He also scored a goal for Queen's Park so must have been in the outfield then. Kirke-Smith was not originally chosen for the first international, coming in when someone else dropped out.

    William Clegg probably owed his England selection to his brother, who was friendly with selector Alcock. Wood and Willey were more notable Sheffield players. Sheffield football was more important than the London-based FA Cup at this time. Most eligible clubs did not bother entering the cup, and some of those that did pulled out when their players found something better to do. The final was moved to accommodate the university boat race.

    In my previous post, Secker looks like a misprint. Should be Leckie.
     
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  6. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Possible Best XI 1872-73


    -----------------------------------------------A Morten--------------------------------------------------

    -----------------------------J Taylor--------------------------W Ker-----------------------------------

    ------------------------- AF Kinnaird----------------------RWS Vidal-------------------------------

    GH Sampson----TC Willey----JC Clegg------CJ Chenery-------JB Weir--------A Wood


    Four from London, four from Sheffield, and three from Queen's Park.
     
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  7. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Apart from Kinnaird, which players would make your Top 3 in this season?
     
  8. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Charlie Clegg as the best Sheffield-based player this season, plus one of the Queen's Park Scots. Probably Weir as he was considered their leading forward.

    Looking at backs, Ker might have the edge over Taylor as he scored a couple of goals. As you say, he also took over the club captaincy after the end of the season.
     
  9. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nominees (25 thus far)

    Morten
    Taylor
    Ker
    Kinnaird
    Vidal
    Sampson
    Willey
    C Clegg
    Chenery
    Weir
    Wood
    Goodwyn
    Howell
    Thompson
    Renny-Tailyour
    Smith
    Wotherspoon
    Greenhalgh
    Rhind
    MacKinnon
    Kirke Smith
    W Clegg
    Ottaway
    Gardner
    Kenyon-Slaney
     
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  10. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    First England Scotland games 0-0 in Glasgow. From Scotsman report: Again the difference in styles in mentioned, England more skilled individually, Scotland better team play. Draw seems fair based on the report. Players mentioned as best for England Ottaway, Kirke-Smith, Brockbank, Morie, and Clegg. Ottaway, the captain, was singled out the most for his stylish dribbling. For Scotland Weir, Leckie, Rhind, Wotherspoon, and the backs are mentioned, with Weir recieving the most praise, as with Cuttaway for being the best dribbler in his team.

    Second game 4-2 to England in London. To my knowladge this is the only game where Glasgow and London based Scots mixed into one team for Scotland. For England's first goal Kenyon Slaney is praised for a clever pass to set up Bonsor. Scots then went down 2-0 quickly. Renny-Tailyour strikes back with what is described as an excellent goal and attack, this was described as the best move of the match. This goal gives the Scots heart and the match starts to turn. Kinnaird and Reeny-Tailyour are now running the game with intermittent attempts to counter from Kenyon Slaney, Chenery, and Bonsor. Gibb eventually scores the equalizer for the Scots. The match is now a great back and forth affair with the score tied. A Bonsor move sets up a scrum in front of the Scottish goal finished by a good kick from Kenyon Slaney. England now overrun the Scots and the are lucky to only give away one more goal. Vidal is the leading the attacks for the English and Kinnaird makes a few great runs to try to relieve the pressure.

    Scots are noted as not playing up to form and Weir was missed greatly. England were excellent with Kenyon Slaney, Goodwyn, and Howell being singled out.
     
  11. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nominees (26 thus far)

    Morten
    Taylor
    Ker
    Kinnaird
    Vidal
    Sampson
    Willey
    C Clegg
    Chenery
    Weir
    Wood
    Goodwyn
    Howell
    Thompson
    Renny-Tailyour
    Smith
    Wotherspoon
    Greenhalgh
    Rhind
    MacKinnon
    Kirke Smith
    W Clegg
    Ottaway
    Gardner
    Kenyon-Slaney
    Bonsor
     
  12. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Several books report the score as 4 to 1. Are you sure there was not a fourth goal for Sheffield?

    Similar details about goalscorers and best players in these Sheffield vs London matches would be highly appreciated for the previous (1871/72) and subsequent seasons as well.
    Next season the Sheffield vs Glasgow matches will start as well.
     
  13. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    #13 peterhrt, Mar 13, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
    Which books are you referring to?

    One newspaper reports an additional goal for Sheffield by A Wood. Apparently the teams did not change ends so there was doubt whether the goal was allowed.

    Details of the best players in the 1871-72 London v Sheffield games were given in the 1872 thread, as was the goalscorer in the match played in London (Carr own goal). Scorers in the other two games:

    Sheffield 3 London 1. A Wood, C Mills, Sampson / P Revitt-Carnac (Harrow Chequers).

    Sheffield 2 London 1. Sampson, JC Clegg / Chenery. The goal by Chenery came when the goalkeeper kicked the ball against him and it rebounded into the goal.
     
  14. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Thanks for the goalscorers of those Sheffield vs London matches.

    Concerning the 4-1 score of the fourth match, I have seen that score in two recently published books.

    Curry, Dunning (2015): “Association Football: A Study in Figurational Sociology“
    https://books.google.hu/books?id=qM0qBwAAQBAJ&pg=PA106&lpg=PA106&dq=sheffield+vs+london+inter-association+matches,+1872,+football&source=bl&ots=VIkDlP8-0V&sig=ACfU3U3xqoZLTlbeIBYy2rDwYQzQoF0cPA&hl=hu&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiitP7i3_7gAhVji8MKHfYjBWgQ6AEwAnoECAAQAQ#v=onepage&q=sheffield vs london inter-association matches, 1872, football&f=false


    Mitchell (2011): “Arthur Kinnaird First Lord of Football”
    has the same score (4-1), without further details.

    Perhaps they counted this additional goal by Wood.
     
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  15. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Best players according to reports (1871-72 season):

    Sheffield v London 3/12/71:
    Sampson, Willey, Ash, Wood / Alcock, Chenery

    London v Sheffield 27/1/72:
    Holden, Morten, Vidal, Hooman, Alcock, Thompson, Stephenson, Chenery / Carr, J Marsh, Sampson, JC Clegg, Willey, Mills

    Sheffield v London 2/3/72:
    Wood, Sampson, JC Clegg, WE Clegg, Hollingsworth / Elliott, Chenery
     
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  16. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Do you have any suggestions for the best players of this season?
     
  17. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Leckie seems to have been regarded as the next best Queen's Park forward after Weir so might be included in the 23.

    Possible omissions: Goodwyn, Ottaway, Robert Smith, James Thomson.
     
  18. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    How does this look for a 23

    Bonsor, Alexander (Wanderers, England)
    Chenery, Charlie (Crystal Palace, London XI, England)
    Clegg, Charles (Sheffield XI, England)
    Gardner, Robert (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Greenhalgh, Ernest (Notts County, England)
    Howell, Leonard (Wanderers, London IX, England)
    Kenyon-Slaney, William (Wanderers, London IX, England)
    Ker, William (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Kinnaird, Arthur (Wanderers, London IX, Scotland)
    Leckie, Robert (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    MacKinnon, Billy (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Morten, Alexander (Wanderers, London IX, England)
    Ottaway, Cuthbert (Oxford University, England)
    Renny-Tailyour , Henry (Royal Engineers, Scotland)
    Rhind, Alex (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Sampson, GH (Sheffield XI)
    Smith, Arnold Kirke (Oxford University, England)
    Taylor, Joseph (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Vidal, Walpole (Oxford University, London XI, England)
    Weir, James (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Willey, TC (Sheffield XI)
    Wood, A (Sheffield XI)
    Wotherspoon, David (Queen's Park, Scotland)

    Please let me know what clubs are missing ir wrong.
     
  19. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Looks good to me.

    Additional clubs

    Bonsor: Old Etonians
    Clegg: Wednesday
    Howell: Old Wykehamists
    Kenyon-Slaney: Old Etonians
    Ker: Granville
    Vidal: Old Westminsters
    Wood: Derbyshire

    Change of club

    Morten: Crystal Palace not Wanderers

    Name change

    Harwood Greenhalgh (known by his second given name rather than his first Ernest)

    Typo

    Howell, Kenyon-Slaney, Kinnaird and Morten should be London XI not London IX
     
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  20. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Final 23 man shortlist

    Bonsor, Alexander (Wanderers, Old Etonians, England)
    Chenery, Charlie (Crystal Palace, London XI, England)
    Clegg, Charles (Sheffield Wednesday, Sheffield XI, England)
    Gardner, Robert (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Greenhalgh, Harwood (Notts County, England)
    Howell, Leonard (Wanderers, Old Wykehamists, London XI, England)
    Kenyon-Slaney, William (Wanderers, Old Etonians, London XI, England)
    Ker, William (Queen's Park, Granville, Scotland)
    Kinnaird, Arthur (Wanderers, London XI, Scotland)
    Leckie, Robert (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    MacKinnon, Billy (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Morten, Alexander (Crystal Palace, London XI, England)
    Ottaway, Cuthbert (Oxford University, England)
    Renny-Tailyour , Henry (Royal Engineers, Scotland)
    Rhind, Alex (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Sampson, GH (Sheffield XI)
    Smith, Arnold Kirke (Oxford University, England)
    Taylor, Joseph (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Vidal, Walpole (Oxford University, Old Westminsters, London XI, England)
    Weir, James (Queen's Park, Scotland)
    Willey, TC (Sheffield XI)
    Wood, A (Derbyshire, Sheffield XI)
    Wotherspoon, David (Queen's Park, Scotland)
     
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  21. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    For the three finalists I think we are all ok with Kinnaird as winner.

    For the other two spots names you guys tossed around are Kenyon-Slaney, Ker, Chenery, Clegg, Weir and Sampson.

    I personally like Kenyon-Slaney, Ker, or Clegg for this seasons final two podium spots.
     
  22. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Looking at making a team of the season, did Vidal play as a halfback? Also how do you feel about Kenyon-Slaney moving into the team as a forward, maybe for Willey or Wood? Those were my only thoughts on what you already have.
     
  23. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    I agree with this list and the modifications suggested by peterhrt.

    How about the Top 3?
    Shall we settle for Kinnaird, Clegg and Ker, in this order?
     
  24. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I am good with this.
     
  25. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Same here.
     

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