Best Story of the Week - 2018

Discussion in 'Referee' started by IASocFan, Jan 1, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. djmtxref

    djmtxref Member

    Apr 8, 2013
    Do you want coaches to “track you down” after games to discuss why they told you to call the game better?
     
    mathguy ref repped this.
  2. 65GT350

    65GT350 Member

    Jun 25, 2015
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    @Spencedawgmillionaire I have read your posts and have a couple observations and they may or may not be appropriate because like most game incidents YHTBT.

    1) I am not a big fan of switching games at tournaments. Most assignors will put you on games that they feel you are a good fit for and with an idea of getting the most out of you for their tournament. You might have had the boys final on Sunday if you didn't swap to that game on Saturday etc... But if you stepped up to cover an uncovered game then I am pretty sure the assignor appreciated it.

    2) We all think we are good refs and parents will normally tell you that you did a good job to your face but they will also be some of the voices you hear on the sidelines wondering aloud how you missed that call. I have heard a few parents telling a National or State we are glad we have you on this game, good job, etc..but then be on the sidelines muttering about the same ref costing them a game 2 weeks ago.

    3) FRD. If you feel that you had to issue the caution because you gave one earlier for the same infraction then okay but you had 2 minutes to go in a tied tournament game that I assume does not allow for added time. Just get in the barn.

    4) Insisting on subbing the player. That is not our place and I am guessing was the reason for the outburst. May I suggest asking the coach next time if he would like to sub the carded player. The the outburst is directed at the coach and you can avoid the 2YC for Dissent. If he doesn't use the opportunity to remove him from the situation you have at least provided it. Another approach would be to slow the restart down and make sure he is calm enough to continue. If he doesn't then you might want to call the coach on to tend to his obviously mentally injured player. :)

    5) One area that has me confused is your involvement in the PAD decision. You felt strongly enough about this players misconduct to issue 2YC but after the game when in discussion with the PAD you feel that he should not sit out any games. Do you really feel that he learned his lesson sitting out the last two minutes? I think if you feel that both the cards were deserved then he should sit a game. I don't think I would be doing that tournament again if they were rescinding my 2YC send offs.

    I have read this a couple time and I can't get the tone right so instead of deleting it all and starting over, I'll just apologize if it comes across offensive that is not my intention it is just trying to offer another POV.
     
    dadman, rh89 and Spencedawgmillionaire repped this.
  3. wguynes

    wguynes Member

    Dec 10, 2010
    Altoona, IA
    Some personal observations regarding the "suggesting" a player be substituted.
    • I have heard of this many times from other referees in my career. Both in person and various referee forums.
    • I usually hear it from HS referees and less so from USSF referees. Given the experience requirements between the two (given the same age level) I see a correlation between this and experience level and game philosophies ("extension of the classroom" yada yada)
    • I usually attribute it to the referee speaking wanting to believe they were that "attuned enough" to the match that they felt they could get away with it. I make no judgement to any truthiness of these statements. I was not there.
    • I don't believe I have ever used this technique and personally view it as treading a little too far into coaching for my style. I really don't want them making my calls so won't presume. At most, I would find a way to make sure the coach knows how hot the player is and let them choose.
    • IMO if I have already failed to manage the player on the field and it has gotten that far out of hand then the player probably needs the formality of a caution. Looking for excuses to let them off the hook isn't doing the next referee any favors.
    • I refuse to say that I will never do it.
    Edit: Oh! It fits that I don't like it. I don't tell a player "I'm going to caution you if you do that again" because it backs you into a corner. This is along the same lines only with the coach instead.
     
  4. Spencedawgmillionaire

    Mar 2, 2017
    Belleville, ILLLLLLLLINOIZE
    Club:
    Saint Louis Athletica
    As long as it's a healthy discussion, I'm ok with it. If they have questions or disagreements, they often do. I use "Look, we can have a discussion, like gentlemen, or we can not have a discussion." when needed, and it calms guys down. I've been questioned for 80 minutes, a couple more won't kill me. as a coach I sometimes like clarification or lack understanding, so I ask post-match.

    I appreciate the input.
    1) I was covering a match, someone I was working with earlier wanted out, so I switched with her because I was off at that point and needed a break earlier in the day.

    2) My friend, who's kid earned himself a caution earlier in the match always gives me good, honest feedback. he's been a good source of mentoring and is always unafraid to tell me where I need to improve, or mistakes he thinks I've made. I trust him implicitly, but take what i think I need from him. My nickname for him is "Ricky Rulebook." Other parents I always take with a grain of salt.

    3) That wasn't lost on me, it was a difficult decision, but I stand by that part.

    5) Part of my decision to talk to them about it was the fact that I feared I may have mis-handled the situation, although I was going on instructions. I spoke with them about it, explained what happened, how I felt about it and told them if they were on the fence that I'd let him play. I'm still on the fence about it. Did he react that way because I may have mis-handled it? Does that matter? I don't know.

    Not offensive at all. It was a tough match, but certainly not my most difficult. I bring it here because it's how I learn. I trust my friend's opinion, but talk about it here because sometimes we're too close to a situation. Perhaps part of my indecision is steeped in lack of experience.

    I think if it happened today, I'd likely still give him the caution, walk him back ten and maybe ask coach if he'd like a sub (the time left on clock might push me to just move on though) move on. I love tourneys because I get to see new teams/coaches etc... plus, the money is nice, but the surety of league rules is somewhat absent. Too many cooks at the top making weird decisions, at times.

    I will say that it was a weird, weird weekend. I have a bunch more stories from other matches, but this one was maybe my most unsure.
     
    dadman repped this.
  5. threeputzzz

    threeputzzz Member+

    May 27, 2009
    Minnesota
    I've gone the suggest a sub route only once, and it was in a u-littles rec game. I think if you use the "mental injury" excuse to allow a sub when it would not otherwise be permitted, you are opening yourself up to more problems than you are solving if the opposing coach objects (whether they say anything right away or not).
     
    dadman and Spencedawgmillionaire repped this.
  6. seattlebeach

    seattlebeach Member

    AFC Richmond
    May 11, 2015
    Not Seattle, Not Beach
    I also hear this more in the HS/College world than I do in USSF: I think it's also that we're under the impression/guidance that our "customer" in HS/College is the coach, and our "customer" in USSF (Youth) is the player. (I'm not sure I agree, but it's definitely the sense, and it's certainly true that club coaches are more transient/distributed than school coaches.) So in the process of building that coach-referee relationship, we are trying to avoid problems - though of course our mouth often creates them.

    I also rarely use this technique. I work under the assumption that even coaches who seem to like me don't really want to hear what I have to say. The only time I've used this is when I've believed a player is sufficiently on tilt that he's a danger to someone - on his own team, on the opposing team, or on the crew. He may have not done anything yet that warrants a caution, but I am concerned about safety nevertheless. My approach to the coach is that I have a safety concern and I think we can all use his help. (This reflects @Law5's point about being the adults out there.) I remember having done that twice in the last three years.
     
    dadman repped this.
  7. YoungRef87

    YoungRef87 Member

    DC United
    United States
    Jan 5, 2018
    It’s astonishing how many people don’t know that delaying the restart is a cautionable offense.
     
  8. YoungRef87

    YoungRef87 Member

    DC United
    United States
    Jan 5, 2018
    Best stories: I’m an AR for a former MLS referee on a U14B State Cup match.

    I also got assigned a U14B State Cup Center.

    And lastly, I got assigned a center for a U19 rec game. (I’m only 17)
     
    dadman, rh89, RespectTheGame and 8 others repped this.
  9. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A favorite of mine occurred during a tournament last season. I call a foul about 30 yards from goal. The wall naturally sets it's self up at 10 yards and about 10 seconds after the foul, the coach yells at a player to delay the kick. I don't know why. The defenders were back. The attackers were in no hurry to take the kick. But it's U14 and the coach probably saw it on TV. So a player from the wall sprints out and statutes in front of the ball. I pull the yellow and the coach gets upset.

    Afterwards the field/referee coordinator (an experienced ref) told me the coach was explaining the story to him about how I screwed up. The coach says "and then the player ran from the wall to stand in front of the ball" and the ref coordinator tells him "you just described a 100% yellow card in the laws of the game".
     
    ArgylleRef, dadman, rh89 and 7 others repped this.
  10. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Boys or girls? If it's boys then be ready to run your *** off. Those games usually turn into long ball since they're strong enough to boot the ball 50 yards but not skilled enough to connect passes in midfield.
     
    dadman, rh89, YoungRef87 and 1 other person repped this.
  11. Bubba Atlanta

    Bubba Atlanta Member+

    Mar 2, 2012
    Yep, Atlanta
    Club:
    Atlanta United FC
    And blow the whistle. "Let 'em play" has little useful application in a U19 rec game.
     
    dadman, rh89, YoungRef87 and 3 others repped this.
  12. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    Depends on the meaning of rec and the nature of the league. My advice would be a bit different, or perhaps differently nuanced. Be ready to call tightly. Start that way. And let the game tell you when to ease back. And then start the second have the same way--there may be a ratchet up of aggression at the start of the second half, and if you aren't ready, things can spiral. (If you notice things spiraling, tighten up the calls again and hold it that way for a while until things simmer down.)
     
    dadman repped this.
  13. mathguy ref

    mathguy ref Member+

    Nov 15, 2016
    TX
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    My advice would be to be cognizant of your surroundings and play close attention to dissent. You will be refereeing players roughly 1-2 years older than you. That is a big challenge at this age (for them and you). They very well may do and say things to you that they may not do or say to an older Referee. Remember you are not their peer.
     
    dadman and YoungRef87 repped this.
  14. camconcay

    camconcay Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Feb 17, 2011
    Georgia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Make sure this is OK, even if you are assigned it could be a mistake made by the assignor and its up to you to correct it if so - center refs here (GA) are required to be one year older than the game they are refereeing.
     
  15. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    Maybe in Georgia. Not in my state. If the assignor thinks you can do the games, you get the assignment.

    We had a guy who was 15 at the time complete the five centers at U-17 or above that we require in order to upgrade to 7. Great guy. He was just accepted for law school at Georgetown.
     
    dadman, rh89, Bio-Hazard and 3 others repped this.
  16. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    And here it's two years. FWIW.

    Go get 'em, @YoungRef87 , it seems like you are on your way to wonderful things.
     
    dadman repped this.
  17. YoungRef87

    YoungRef87 Member

    DC United
    United States
    Jan 5, 2018
    It’s coed, but it’s mostly boys.
     
  18. Cornbred Ref

    Cornbred Ref Member

    Arsenal
    Jan 3, 2018
    Omaha
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One of the bigger games I have done in my ~13 month career was yesterday. I had our HS Metro Area Conference Girls Final as AR1. Very competitive match, too! White went up 2-0 at half and Blue put two equalizers in during 2nd half. Blue ended up winning in OT.
     
    dadman, rh89, YoungRef87 and 1 other person repped this.
  19. Spencedawgmillionaire

    Mar 2, 2017
    Belleville, ILLLLLLLLINOIZE
    Club:
    Saint Louis Athletica
    #519 Spencedawgmillionaire, Apr 12, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2018
    Do they even KNOW you're 17? I mean, I'm 44, but can pass for 43 when I'm wearing a hat. I kid, but you could be older than they are, just young-looking. Act like you're older and it'll be easier, if not because of them, but because you're giving yourself confidence.


    The tourney this past weekend had a really weird scheduling error; my son was trading 1st match and 3rd match centers with a 19-year-old so he could get his feet back under him before hitting the middle. He ended up taking the center on his original, the first match of the day, because they had scheduled a very-scared-looking 13 yr. old to do lines on a top-level boys U17 match...for his second match ever, so they switched him out with the 19-year old.

    It was pretty crazy, this kid had never even played the sport, so was super, duper green. He did lines for my son on his U11 match and my son (I was so proud of this) ended up calling a bunch of offside calls because the AR wasn't getting any of them. We got an older guy to shadow him and help him out in the end and it was ok, but I giggle when I imagine this poor kid trying to keep up with U17 elite boys on his second match.

    I wouldn't want to be an assignor.
     
    dadman and YoungRef87 repped this.
  20. jdmahoney

    jdmahoney Member

    Feb 28, 2017
    Plymouth, MN
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Best story for me: I was assigned four Presidents Cup games and a State Cup game, first time for me working either tournament.
     
  21. Dayton Ref

    Dayton Ref Member+

    May 3, 2012
    Houston, TX
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    I was at a kid's birthday party on Sunday. Someone happened to put on a soccer game. A couple of non-soccer people happened to start talking offside. I've learned from experience to not give input unless directly asked because I get a bit over the top. My wife jumped in and explained the offside law to the T including active involvement, minus impeding an opponent. It almost brought a tear to my eye :cry:
     
    tomek75, Noadvantageref, roby and 15 others repped this.
  22. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    There was a survey taken in England some years ago which asked people who taught them the offside law. The number one answer was "my mother."
     
    roby, IASocFan, dadman and 5 others repped this.
  23. kayakhorn

    kayakhorn Member+

    Oct 10, 2011
    Arkansas
    I saw this and immediately thought of the line "She may very well pass for forty-three in the dusk with the light behind her" from Gilbert and Sullivan's "Trial by Jury". I'll be singing it all afternoon now. Thanks.
     
  24. jdmahoney

    jdmahoney Member

    Feb 28, 2017
    Plymouth, MN
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Back outside tonight on turf in a high school stadium, only to see another 6+ inches of snow coming this weekend... :(
     
  25. Bubba Atlanta

    Bubba Atlanta Member+

    Mar 2, 2012
    Yep, Atlanta
    Club:
    Atlanta United FC
    Moderately decent boys varsity game tonight, ended 3-1. Dual. Only 2 miles on my GPS, and I never so much as broke into a trot.

    Was I trying out a new approach? Well, yes, because I had pulled a groin muscle in the second half of the girls game preceding. I iced it between the games, after which a somewhat gingerly walk with an occasional hop and skip was about the best I could muster. My partner covered for me admirably, and we got through it. Not much fun though. :barefoot:
     
    dadman repped this.

Share This Page