Best players of 18/19 season

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by AD78, Mar 15, 2019.

  1. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Interesting thread here

    1122622752278626307 is not a valid tweet id


    For this season I think Ronaldo his league form is not better as, say, Hazard or even Aguero, but his five KO stage goals are a huge bonus and lift...
     
  2. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord


    So the PFA has been given to VvD while FWA went with Sterling. Probably that is alright (in too many years there was a 'double' imho) and it never happened that a defender won both, but I've seen commentaries now that previous harsh treatment of Sterling by the press (his gun tattoo etc.) played a part. Maybe some small sort of nationality bias as well, now a feasible candidate is at hand (not true for every year), given that the women vote was altered in a similar way (a dutch lady surpassed by a brit).
     
  3. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    And the confirmation for how it worked:






    I'd say this is though an approach not without vulnerabilities (echo chamber?), even if there are good reasons to take this into account. It's not like VvD has shown a total lack of sensitivity or ignorance of the small and big gesture (which - honestly - felt genuine, improvisational and spontaneous and not pre-meditated).
     
  4. Edhardy

    Edhardy Member+

    Sep 4, 2013
    Nairobi, Kenya
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    I think this year was very close between the two (Sterling and Van Dijk), and that's being given as an explanation for what was probably a tough choice for every voter.
    In the recent past,

    Cristiano Ronaldo (wink to get Rooney sent off at the world cup, reputation as a diver)
    Luis Suarez (racist incident, biting incident)
    Jamie Vardy (not so flattering tweets and impressions he had made in the past).

    All three, and I'm probably missing others, were not exactly viewed favourably in terms of professionalism.
    In the case of Ronaldo and Suarez they were very clearly the best in the league that season and it can explain to a degree why they won anyway. But in Vardy's case, Kante and Mahrez were just as worthy.
    I don't know how many such cases exist where one player pipped the other due to their off field impact.

    As a black man, and having lived in England too, I must say I was rooting for Sterling and I can't help but feel some pride seeing him being recognised for what's been a tremendous season.
    With that said, I believe if you take both of them away and replace them with players already at the club, Liverpool would lose more.

    I hope both make the Ballon D'or, Fifa POTY podium.. there's a few players who've been within the same ballpark, but only Messi has been better this season.
     
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  5. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Kun is just a striker (as lewadowski or kane)
    Ronaldo has been a LWF for most of this season helping build attacks ,contributing to several assists and was at one point in the first part of the season averaging 2 crosses per game (which is in line with most WC wingers)
    https://www.google.com/amp/www.spor...es-more-than-just-a-poacher-20181229.amp.html
    https://amp.calciomercato.com/news/juventus-make-100-more-crosses-with-ronaldo-60016

    The all round game of Kun which has improved vastly under pep is still way behind this

    There is a stronger case for hazard but the 5 KO stage goals (all his teams goals)tilt the balance in Ronaldos favour
    At 34 years old his performance is still worthy of a podium place finish (Messi is clear cut number 1 here even if he fails to progress beyond the SF)
     
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  6. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I was reading not so long ago about Cantona perhaps losing some possibility/probability of the 1993/94 FWA award, due to some on-field petulance. Actually in an article about being given the award for 1995/96 I think (after he had the Crystal Palace incident, which was far more notable than previous behaviour, but that was not in 1995/96 and it seems it was seen that his behaviour had been particularly clean/admirable in that season after his return to the game). The Vardy one does seem strange when it shouldn't have been a landslide playing wise I'd say, but then maybe the other factor of the PFA award already being handed to Mahrez (just like in 93/94 to Cantona, and 95/96 not to Cantona) comes into play in swaying the journalists towards the 'other' choice so the awards are split? This year that's not what happened I suppose, with both awards being handed out together, but yeah I remember Puck posting about Van Dijk's admirable behaviour a while back so it's not like he wouldn't be a good choice on that basis. Purely on performance I still wonder whether Hazard should be in the frame (I at least think he's a major candidate for best PL player during 2018/19, but that's a bit different to getting the verdict as best player of 2018/19 overall I suppose).
     
  7. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    I'm not so sure about Suarez in 2013-14, whose weakness was his performances against the top teams.

    I mean, Yaya Toure scored 20 league goals (6 pens) and 9 league assists as a nominal midfielder while also being the hub of his team (more passes and higher pass accuracy as David Silva). Maybe because Man City was for a long time stuck at #3 in the table and only jumped to #1 in the last two matchdays it snowed under.


    Also if you replace him with Laporte imho, and replace Sterling with Mane/Hazard, but in general I'm in favor of these awards going to attackers.
     
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  8. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #133 PuckVanHeel, Apr 30, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2019
    Undoubtedly. I'm not taking away Sterling his efforts but the British media have created their own story in the way Sterling was previously treated and that there's understandably (and rightly) more of a focus on the commendable efforts of their native stars (at the same time, various complaints often are directed to overseas players but that's a different subject).

    The big gesture:
    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...lass-act-both-on-and-off-the-pitch/ar-BBSNlh7

    The small gesture:
    http://www.sportbible.com/football/...et-to-young-mascot-in-classy-gesture-20181120
    https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/spo...verpool-van-dijk-netherlands-gesture-15430063

    With The Times writing 26 december:
    "[W]ith Klopp accepting that his summer stance of "Van Dijk or no one" could not stretch beyond another transfer window. Crucially, however, City were given no encouragement that Van Dijk saw his future at the Etihad. He remembered being a guest at the Champions League final between Juventus and Real Madrid in Cardiff in 2017 when Liverpool supporters kept approaching him, urging him to join, and saw parallels between Celtic and the fervour that might await him on Merseyside. He was swayed by Klopp's drive and dreams. Van Dijk understood Liverpool before he joined and he gets them now. Before the Wolves game he paid for a Christmas party for the Owen McVeigh Foundation, with 120 children benefiting. It is said that history weighs Liverpool down, although more often than not it points the way forward."

    I also think he presents himself well. Many British comments say (with some hyperbole I'd say) "he speaks better English as Kane and Sterling".



    As I said, in general I'm in favor of attackers (no defender has ever received the PFA & FWA double) but the whole 'story' is as much about the British press as it is about Sterling.
     
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  9. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Thanks for the confirmation/elaboration.

    I tend to agree about Yaya Toure too.
     
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  10. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Re: the aforementioned Daniel Storey, this is also a decent take by him:

    https://www.football365.com/news/f365s-early-winners-johan-cruyff-and-his-ajax-legacy

    Surprisingly good Daily Mail article here too, that doesn't forget to highlight some main things (e.g. giving people who never played semi-professional football high and responsible positions):

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...pponents-built-legend-John-Cruyffs-image.html

    :thumbsup:
     
  11. Edhardy

    Edhardy Member+

    Sep 4, 2013
    Nairobi, Kenya
    Club:
    Juventus FC

    Certainly thought about Suarez vs Toure, though I can't remember if there were many people 'campaigning' for Toure. If it was close, it further points to the inconsistency of such a criteria.

    Re: the second point.
    It's the biggest point in favour of VVD. I think of all the big teams in Europe now, he's the least replaceable. Or another way, his team would be furthest from where they are without him. Eden Hazard is 2nd, and Messi is always key for Barcelona, but this season, domestically they haven't truly been challenged. And up to this point they would have probably found a way past the teams they played against in Europe.
    Of course Liverpool held Bayern without VVD, but that's more telling of Bayern's attack without Coman this season than Liverpool truly coping without VVD.
     
  12. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Yes I thought Liverpool was fine in that match (although there were some nervous and scrappy moments with Allison that could have cost them) but later on I saw pieces mentioning they missed his presence in the air with Lewandowski winning all aerial duels (didn't happen in 2nd leg) and problems in build up working through the rest of the team.

    https://miasanrot.de/2019-analyse-liverpool-fcbayern/
    https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...mpions-league-first-leg-anfield-a8787526.html


    At 2nd thoughts I agree with you on Aguero. Lewandowski however had a very all-round campaign. He's more of a passer and through-baller as Ronaldo, worked more, had sub-standard support, and as others have mentioned, is Juventus now improved in the league? His usual CL form is however a big bonus.
     
  13. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    This is remarkable trivia:

    Marc Overmars four years ago in VI, when the journalists confronted him with that often the crown jewels are 'stolen' (for free!) from the academy before they make their first team debut and synergy is hard to create.

    [​IMG]

    "I believe in cycles in football. Between the last European Cup of Ajax in 1973 and our Champions League win was 22 years. Now we are again 20 years further. Somewhere in the coming seasons it must be possible to touch that level again. After that attempt we can start again, because then the whole team will be dismantled. That is in my head. And no one will get it out."

    https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ess-story-of-the-champions-league-this-season
     
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  14. AD78

    AD78 Member+

    Jul 17, 2013
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I heard one of the FWA voters talking about the award and they talked about taking into consideration off the field items as well, first point is that despite VDV edging it for me, Sterling as a very strong case for his on the field performances for winning the award.

    However his off field conduct has been fantastic, paying for a whole host of children from his old school to go to Wembley to watch the FA Cup semi final (and I think is doing for the final too) and his support of the young Crystal Palace academy player who passed away with Cancer, the local news had a section on it and he visited him, spent time with him, played pool etc... the family said it meant so much as Sterling was his hero. Sterling also paid for the funeral, attended in person and did a speech, he in my opinion is an exemplary off the field professional.
     
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  15. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Surprise: most football writers don't really watch the football (a question that can be asked about players as well)




    I'd think so yes. Right now he's the most productive player of the league (combined G + A) and he has additionally an overall game that is as good as any attacker there, maybe the best (certainly better than Sterling or Mane I'd think). Only thing is maybe that he had some quiet matches against a few top six or top ten sides, but the overall state of the team is a proper 'excuse' (for the national team he has played well/very well against all the best/better teams he faced this season).

    I also agree with the (very subjective) observation of 'journalist' Michael Cox that Hazard is one of those players who look impressive live and in the flesh. I remembered @comme saying some things about that 'seeing in the flesh' too (here and while searching another one here). Close up cameras (tracking a player) often gives a rather different impression as well as the 'normal' cameras (see the link below).

    Van Dijk had a sub-standard match wednesday (also admitted by himself) but was on the other hand not totally embarrassed in the duels, interceptions and initiated/created a chance for Milner wasn't it. That he can hold himself 1 vs 1 against Suarez and pals is for the long run maybe more telling than the not tracking of one/two runs (as odd as it sounds). After hearing the Totally Football Show (where they were very mild on him, saying that even if he had reacted he would be too late for Suarez) I started thinking again on this and what to think of it if this was an 'ultimate test'. N.B. he was on monday asked what is the 'best goal' he scored - he replied that the ones he scored against Everton or Portugal are more like 'favorite' ones but that the best is probably this (was at times also adventurous for Southamton).

    So as a sort of evolving thought I right now have Hazard, Messi, Lewandowski (one of his most all-around seasons I think), Mbappe as the best players of their league (with Serie A undecided).
     
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  16. schwuppe

    schwuppe Member+

    Sep 17, 2009
    Club:
    FC Kryvbas Kryvyi Rih
    Hazard is the best EPL forward this season for me too. Stats might look similar to Sterling, but he is more of a one-man-team, while there isn't much seperating Sterling from Bernardo or Agüero imo.

    Ligue 1 and La Liga are easy.
    Reus was impressive at the start, but might be Lewandowski now.
    Serie A: I think Ronaldo is the best attacker and Chiellini the best defender.
     
  17. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #142 PuckVanHeel, May 3, 2019
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
    The largest quality paper of Spain (which is also fairly non-partisan) had this article:
    https://elpais.com/deportes/2019/05/02/actualidad/1556788517_380111.html

    Thread

    This is probably right. Ronaldo having 'only' 20 league goals (with 5 penalties) while playing for by far the best team, firing so many shots, does create a bit of cognitive dissonance here.
     
  18. schwuppe

    schwuppe Member+

    Sep 17, 2009
    Club:
    FC Kryvbas Kryvyi Rih
    Indeed it looks odd how he ranks behind 36 year old Quagiarella on the goalscorers table...
     
  19. Jack Colpitts

    Jack Colpitts New Member

    Newcastle United
    England
    Aug 1, 2017
    ter Stegen
    Wan-Bissaka Piqué van Dijk Alba
    Rakitić Fernandinho Bernardo Silva
    Messi Mbappe Sterling
     
  20. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
  21. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
  22. Bavarian14

    Bavarian14 Member

    Bayern München
    Jun 1, 2017
  23. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    I'm leaning to believe this because the bottle is half empty/half full and that makes the margin of error substantial (for professionals). With the target not too far away it is credible (for the right kicking power applied). With a full bottle I'd be more sceptical.

    I don't believe though the video where he nutmegs someone from 50 yards out. The crossbar challenges (where he hits 3/10 to 7/10) raise some doubts about that.

    But for sure a lot is possible now.
     
  24. Edhardy

    Edhardy Member+

    Sep 4, 2013
    Nairobi, Kenya
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    ----------------Ter Stegen
    Kimmich-Pique-Virgil van Dijk-Alba
    Bernardo-Fernandinho-F. De Jong
    -------Messi-Mbappe-Sterling

    Oblak, Chiellini, De Ligt, Robertson, Savanier, Rodri, Rakitic, Cazorla, Zieych, Kai Havertz, Papu Gomez, Nicolas Pepe, Lewandowski, Tadic, Hazard, Aguero, Aspas
     
  25. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Gazzetta dello Sport ratings :thumbsup:

    [​IMG]
     
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