Let´s make a accurate discussion about these 4 great players: My first guesses are: At the NT level: Baggio >= Rivaldo > Laudrup > Ronaldinho AT the club level: Ronaldinho > Laudrup > Baggio = Rivaldo At their peaks: Baggio (92/94) > Ronaldinho (2004/2006) >= Rivaldo (1999) > Laudrup (90/95) Longevity: Baggio > Laudrup > Rivaldo > Ronaldinho Abilities- Passing: Laudrup > Ronaldinho > Baggio = Rivaldo Shooting: Rivaldo > Baggio > Ronaldinho > Laudrup Dribbling skills: Baggio = Laudrup > Ronaldinho >=Rivaldo Pace: Laudrup > Rivaldo = Baggio > Ronaldinho These are only initial guesses
I can find great tournaments by Rivaldo (WC02), Baggio (WC94) and Ronaldinho (UCL). Laudrup is a different case, since his best performances were spread over a whole decade. So, it´s hard to choose one special year of his career or one single tournament. He is definitely a legend of La Liga, he was chosen as the best foreign player of La Liga between 74/1999 in a public poll. Ronaldinho and Rivaldo dominated La liga on their peaks, while Laudrup had many good seasons there.
All the above, but the follwoing changes. I think that Ronaldinho's Champions League may put him on top of the peaks category, though. e.g. At their peaks: Ronaldinho (2004/2006) >Baggio (92/94) > Laudrup (90/95)> Rivaldo (1999) second I think in Pace category: Ronaldinho at his prime beats all of them. Ronaldinho>Baggio > Laudrup> Rivaldo Bare in mind that at Club, Laudrup won La Liga 4 times with Barca and 1 times with Real Madrid. This was back to back. This is quite an achievement. I would vote for Laudrup as a playmaker overall and consistency Ronaldinho as the one with the highest peak at Clubs Rivaldo the best shooting Baggio the best World Cup and NT player. Tough list by the way. All of them are my favourite playmakers.
Adjusting post 1 - keeping the peak years as stated as they are about right I think - Laudrup's could maybe be narrowed to the peak of his Barca career yet he also wasn't far away in the mid 80's at his very best and if we're looking for his best tournament performance I think it's WC 86 despite also a very good WC 98 at the end of his career in a different (deeper) role. At the NT level: Baggio > Laudrup >= Ronaldinho >= Rivaldo AT the club level: Laudrup > Ronaldinho >= Baggio > Rivaldo At their peaks: Ronaldinho (2004/2006) = Laudrup (90/95) >= Baggio (92-94) > Rivaldo (99) Longevity: Baggio = Laudrup > Rivaldo >= Ronaldinho Abilities- Passing: Laudrup > Ronaldinho > Baggio >= Rivaldo Shooting: Rivaldo > Baggio > Ronaldinho >= Laudrup Dribbling skills: Laudrup > Baggio = Ronaldinho >Rivaldo Pace: Laudrup(pre 95) >= Ronaldinho (pre 06)> Baggio > Rivaldo EDIT - Moved Laudrup ahead or Ronaldinho for 'at the club level' considering more than the peak of it.
I guess you are right about the pace. Dinho was really fast before 2006, my recent memories about him made me put him down on this one. Now, for the NT level, Rivaldo is surely ahead of him and the gap is really big IMO. Rivaldo had 1 good WC(98) and 1 great WC(02). Dinho was only good in WC02, not on par with Rivaldo or Ronaldo. Also, Rivaldo had a great peak. In 99 he was huge for Barcelona and NT. His peak was short, from what I remember. In 2000/2001 he was not the same anymore. However, in WC02 he was back to his better form.
What a marvellous technique by Laudrup. The guy had a vast repertoire of skills. Now, for Rivaldo and his best years:
I think Baggio´s peak was one of the best I ever seen. In 92/95 he outstanding. And he really delivered in WC94, so I think this fact have to put his peak ahead of Ronaldinho´s.
Technique: Laudrup=Ronaldinho>>Baggio>=Rivaldo But Laudrup was the most elegant player Passes: Laudrup=Ronaldinho>>Baggio=Rivaldo Shooting: Rivaldo>Baggio>Laudrup>Ronaldinho NT: Rivaldo>Baggio>Laudrup>>Ronaldinho In this category Ronaldino is just about an average player. Rivaldo had a great WC02. Baggio+Laudrup had great WC'94. Club: Ronaldinho=Laudrup(Barca+Real)>>Rivaldo=Baggio Ronaldinho had a greater peak in CL, while Laudrup was more consistent/longevity in La Liga Best player overall: All of them are as good as the other, but my favoured is Ronaldinho then Laudrup. Ronaldinho made me smile and brought joy to the game. Somehow he revived the Jogo Bonito. While Laudrup was extremely elegant and clinical as a surgeon at executing passes and tactics. Laudrup reminded me of a specialist who was called into the surgery room to do a specific precision job on a surgeon. He was that sharp and eloquent. How would you guys rank Zidane in this list?
Baggio vs Laudrup vs Rivaldo vs Ronaldinho All individual geniuses - let's talk about them one by one... Roberto Baggio Roberto Baggio is the original great false #9 of the modern era. Neither a centreforward or a traditional playmaker, Il Divin' Codino is an outrageously talented footballer who plays inside the magic zone between midfield and attack. In his youthful prime, he would penetrate stubborn defences with his silky dribbling and pace, out-thinking his opponent with his elegant movement and turns, and clinically finish with great composure. He would later demonstrate his appreciation of space with his refined range and depth of passing, striking the ball with great accuracy, both in open play and at set-pieces. With the ball at his feet, very few footballers could create as many memorable moments as Baggio - I rank him #1 in this 'comparison thread'.
Michael Laudrup What a footballer! The most graceful player of this quartet, Laudrup is also the finest playmaker of the four too. Michael possesses 'that pass' - the killer pass - executed with absolute technical perfection. The weight, pace , timing and accuracy of his passes is one of the most beautiful things I have beheld in football history. Add to this his dribbling technique - ambidextrous foot-to-foot gliding, able to turn his marker effortlessly, pirouette into space, clever feints and changes of direction - Michael Laudrup appeared to see the whole picture. An intelligent footballer who is underrated my many. If he'd been Dutch, we'd probably see his name pop up more often in 'Greatest Ever' discussions - in this comparison thread, I rank him at #2, a close #2 to Baggio!
The most complete playmaker! The most underrated in history! The most elegant player! His passes were the deadliest! His vision was of a hawk! And he won in every league he played. A true winner of leagues!
His penalty miss in WC94 is the sole reason why so many underrates him. Wasn't it for that penalty he would have been given what he deserved, utterly respect! He produced football just like Ronaldinho, Laudrup ad Rivaldo. I like to call him the Italian Maradona.
I think we should first split this in two, to make it easier: Ronaldinho vs Rivaldo Because both are Brazilians, shined at the same club. Major differences are of course the longevity and playing style (Rivaldo much more selfish, which the goals/assists ratio shows too). Baggio vs Laudrup Because both peaked at the same timeframe and contemporaries are easier to compare as players who played in BOTH a different league and era. Anyway. Laudrup is IMO the most all-round and indeed the most underrated. Many put him lower as 70 in a all-time table, even lower than 90 or outside the top 100. Baggio on the other hand is one of the most overrated players of all-time.
That's a great insight. Funny how Baggio was criticized for this by the media throughout his career, even Platini once referring to him degoratorively as a "9.5", yet contemporary players like Messi get unending accolades for playing this same role. The old axiom holds true: pioneers get the arrows, settlers get the land.
Applause, also in this thread the M-word is used within 20 posts. Apparently it is impossible to open a thread without the M-word on the first page.
This is undoubtedly relevant: Did people know that Baggio is the all-time leader in Serie A penalty goals? 68 to be precise.
Let's now talk about Rivaldo. Rivaldo is Mr.Emphatic. Whether it be a powerful drive from 30 yards, a last minute overhead winner, a brilliant display of ball control or demonstration of his physical dominance, Rivaldo was a beast. At the turn of the 21st century, Rivaldo symbolized the return of the trequartista amidst the stranglehold of predictable modern tactics and disciplined formations. All his teams found a place for him - ensuring that he could execute his genius technical ability and win games. In the last third, Rivaldo would be the player to make the decisive action - whether it be the all important defence-splitting assist, or the thunderous strike. I would place Rivaldo at #4 in this comparison thread.
Indeed, Michael Laudrup is truly one of the best footballers of all time. When some critics compile a 'greatest ever' list, they usually lose sight of how the footballers actually played, why not rate players by - 'how great were they as a footballer?' I hate comparing statistics and medals (useful in some comparisons however )
I've never seen a footballer more humble and simple as Baggio. Even after all the money and fame he remained quite and humble. What a nice guy. No need to be loud nor draw media hype. His game spoke for itself. A true professional.
well I have to disagree on a few things: NT level: Rivaldo > Baggio > Laudrup = Ronaldinho Rivaldo (WC+ Wc final + copa with 8goals+4ass/14ga WC and 5goals+2as Copa) > Baggio (WC final with 9goals+3ass/15ga WC and nothing Euro) Laudrup did well at Euro,= Ronaldinho did very well at confed99, and very good WC02! Club level (peak form): Ronaldinho 04-07 > Rivaldo 98-02= Baggio 92-94> Laudrup SKILLS ONLY: Laudrup = Ronaldinho >= Baggio = Rivaldo
I think this is going to be the toughest thread so far! How do you pick one as the winner without doing the others justice? They are all great playmakers. Perhaps instead of picking a winner, we should discuss these great playmakers in order to learn something. Perhaps that is what went wrong in the Ro-Ro thread. It was a battle for who was the best while we didn't analyse their respective qualities without biases. I'll say the following: Ronaldinho: the Entertainer (Jogo bonito) Laudrup: the engineer Baggio: the executor Rivaldo: the passionate Other playmakers we should be paying homage to, Riquelme, Valderrama, Rivelino, Socrates, etc etc.